In very rare move, Pope dismisses conservative US bishop Strickland

Well, yes, but we have to look at these things, and ask why the Church did not speak out against them, even in eras when there was no question of not teaching traditional doctrine. If it is wrong for people to be ruled by females, then why did the Church (so far as I am aware) not teach that women should not be queens, and that monarchies should alter their rules of primogeniture so as exclude daughters from the succession entirely? Isabella of Spain is possibly a poor example, in that she was not Queen in her own right, but rather simply because she was married to King Ferdinand. (Ditto for Esther and her husband Ahasuerus.) But are there others who were queens in their own right?

Well, maybe you, not “we,” have to look at these things. I’m more concerned with the current crisis in the Church that is certainly connected with “women’s rights”, but has now expanded to encompass “victim’s rights” in general, where “victim” seems to include the poor abused souls who love their sins and deny any need of repentance. So, not to be rude, but I’ll pass on that concern, in favor or presuming that Holy Scripture is still true, every word of it, as the Church teaches. My obligation is to seek to understand “why” - and then train my reasoning to include all it does teach, whether in opposition to the conclusions of the world or not.

That’s up to you. I’m not going to condemn something that the Church has, to my knowledge, never traditionally condemned.

Good grief.

For HomeschooDad and ralfyman:
Here is a homily of St. John Chrysostom, on the passage 1 Tim 2:11-15.. I find his reasoning - Scripture, human nature and reason, to be very helpful in separating the spiritual and religious question from modernist culture. I hope it can be helpful to you.

Then perhaps the Church needs to include these points in the Catechism. She has not done so.

Could you provide some evidence of this “strong support”? Perhaps more than just one instance?

Remind me: What was this thread about again?

Bishop Strickland’s dismissal.

Apparently CQ doesn’t have “thread drift police” the way CAF did.

Thread drift is not necessarily a bad thing, but on some fora (including the one where I am moderator), it will get split out into its own thread at the moderator’s discretion.

And rightly so. I have chosen NOT to watch any videos or news reports relating to the Bishop. God is in charge, so I pray.


What strengths are “intended for the masculine soul?” And who “intended” them as such?

OK, but he’s subject to U.S. law and Church law. He can endorse a candidate as an individual but not in the capacity of a Bishop. Even as an individual, it’s dicey. I agree with this take - Explainer: Can a priest or a member of a religious order publicly endorse a political candidate?

Yes, I realize this, and I was referring solely to US law. The only ramifications that an endorsement would have, from a legal standpoint, could be regarding tax exemption. Church law is quite another matter.

As a kind of side point, Strickland would get far more sympathy from many evangelical Christians, than those in the Church who are pushing for same-sex blessings, insinuating how horrible American conservatives are, and the like. He preaches a simple message of following Jesus and the Gospel, and add to this that he speaks in very plain, unadorned language (with a Texas twang, no less). There are people out in America’s heartland who would like a man such as Strickland.

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Thinking about the many ways to approach an answer to your question, I looked at your public profile and see that you say about yourself, “Came into full communion with the Church in 2000. Still struggling with, (and therefore learning a lot about), my faith.” Twenty-three years is a long time; I wonder how that struggle is going on for you. I wonder whether you want and are seeking truth, or more opinions about the questions you asked. In the culture today, we are drowning in a sea of “opinions.”
You asked:
“What strengths are ‘intended for the masculine soul?’ And who ‘intended’ them as such?”

The first truth is, there IS Truth. When the very existence of that Truth is realized, then the various opinions about souls - masculine or feminine - become important only in a subjective sense, but objectively, the foundational question (your 2nd question) is the crucial one: and only the maker of personal souls - the Creator, God - intended His creation.

So the answer to “what strengths” are intended for masculine souls, and what for feminine souls, is found in God - in His intention, within His wisdom, thus in His purpose for creation itself.

Bottom line: seek to know God, and then His wisdom is approachable, and in that wisdom His purpose and specific intentions.

I’m not avoiding your 1st question; I’m pointing to the way to find its answer. Words are almost useless, apart from the first truth.

Of course. That’s largely why this forum exists - to establish what that is. My profile expressed simply that we’re best all coming at these “Catholic Questions” from a standpoint of intellectual humility.

Perhaps not, but I’ve noted that you haven’t answered it. To defend why being born male is your de facto requirement for holding the highest office in the land fundamentally calls for more than just, “It’s God’s wisdom, trust me.” “Seek to know God” are words that assume (presumptuously, if I’m honest) that you know God and God’s plan for women better than me or anyone else. But therein lies the issue. Assuming without proving is a case of petito principii. And I believe that, as Catholics in dialogue, we can rise above that.

In truth, God’s wisdom has called many great women to roles of leadership, many among whom are heroines of the Old Testament and Saints of our Church.

FTR, I am not defending or in any way cheerleading Nikki Haley. Her stance on Israel alone is a slap in the face to our Church’s official position demanding a ceasefire.

Dialogue in itself, is worthless, often no more than an exchange of monologues, or worse, out-loud soliloquies, the other person just waiting for his chance to speak again. I was merely trying to point to something precious and necessary, the absence of which guarantees fruitlessness. The presence of which can be abundantly fruitful, and life-changing for the better - indeed, for the best.

I can understand your wanting to resolve issues and doubts concerning the Catholic Faith (which involves an immense deposit of revelation and the conclusions to be drawn from revealed truth). A way toward that end would need to be systematic, comprehensive, and possessing integrity. And by integrity I mean not only truthful in a factual sense, but in a human sense: true to human nature and to the supernatural potential God designed into our nature. That is, a formation in truth that is fully human: body, soul and spirit.
“Catholics in dialogue” - in snippets of time, via the cold medium of the internet, with people we barely know at all? Not the best source I could think of.

Oh - btw - you wrote of “our Church’s official position demanding a ceasefire” - do you mean the pope’s personal opinion? Or what, exactly.

Then respectfully, what brings you to this forum?

I am still curious how you justify your position of barring women from political office. (Or is it just the presidency?) Remember, I’m not interested on why you think God is on “your side.” I’m interested in how you think you’re on God’s side.

In trying to answer your question re: " how you think you’re on God’s side," can you tell me something about your prayer life? St. John Vianney wrote in his Catechetical Instructions, Ch. 8, Catechism on Prayer, “Prayer is nothing other than union with God.”

To grow in the life of prayer and grace, to grow toward maturity in the Interior Life, is to grow first toward, and then into the seven Gifts of the Holy Spirit. This brief teaching - truth - is profound and deep:

Catechism 1831 The seven gifts of the Holy Spirit are wisdom, understanding, counsel, fortitude, knowledge, piety, and fear of the Lord. They belong in their fullness to Christ, Son of David. [Cf. Isa 11:1-2] They complete and perfect the virtues of those who receive them. They make the faithful docile in readily obeying divine inspirations.
Let your good spirit lead me on a level path. [Psa 143:10]
For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God . . . If children, then heirs, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ. [Rom 8:14, 17]

Note the first Gift listed - which is the greatest, and holiest, as most inclusive of the others in a sense, is wisdom - intimately united with Holy Charity, one of the virtues (Faith, Hope and Charity) completed and perfected by these Gifts! Amazing, beautiful, crucially important!

These Holy Gifts, brought to maturity in a maturing Interior Life, are the intended fruit of prayer, being the journey to and into union with God.

This is how one comes to know God. Such knowing is found in a life of prayer. So - you don’t need to tell me anything! But I strongly suggest you ask and answer yourself: How is your prayer life? If you want to grow in prayer, you need to understand and live the spirituality of the saints who have recorded their wisdom for the Church and hear how exactly one “grows” in prayer, that is, in union with God.