Apostolic Succession

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Lazerlike42:
I dont have the time to dig through all of this right now - does anybody have a quick answer to some of the objections?

ccel.org/contrib/exec_outlines/top/aposucc.htm
Actually, I always use a lazerlike answer (pun intended.)http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

The Catholic Church, following the Apostolic Succession, has taught a constant and coherent message for 2,000 years. Protestants, abandoning the Apostolic Succession have split, fragmented, quarreled and re-fragmented to the point where they have produced literally tens of thousands of sects in only a quarter of that time.

Truth is unitary – but there are tens of thousands of competing Protestant sects, each claiming they have the one, true truth.
 
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Lazerlike42:
I dont have the time to dig through all of this right now - does anybody have a quick answer to some of the objections?

ccel.org/contrib/exec_outlines/top/aposucc.htm
Lazerlike,

II.A.1.a. The idea that the body needs only the Head (Christ) and the members (Christians) is an unsupported assertion. There has always been a hierarchy within the Church, starting with the Apostles themselves.

II.A.1.b. The passage cited authorizes nothing; it cites an Apostolic Church practice of having bishops overseeing local congregations. If anything it contradicts II.A.1.a. I will admit that it does not explicitly state that there should be a head over the universal Church, but that was not its goal.

II.A.1.d. The Book of Acts does not mention a successor to James; this does not mean that there was none. If the Apostolic Succession meant that each Apostle was to be succeeded personally, then we would have only twelve bishops in the present-day Church. Obviously it does not mean that.

II.A.2. Possibly it was not appealed to before the late second century because the question of authority was not an issue until then. And the earliest lists were written down then; this does not mean that there were no earlier lists. Finally, the question of “appealing to the Word of God” is a red herring because the Bible had not been settled on at the end of the second century.

I would also ask which churches use “succession lists” to establish their validity. Certainly no Protestant churches do; they don’t have valid “succession lists” and they know it.

III.A. They would not know what was in the “indestructible Word of God” had the Catholic Church not told them.

III.B. Without sound teachers teaching sound doctrine, the individual Christians are like sheep without a shepherd. The other respondent’s note about the cacaphony of Sola Scriptura Evangelical and Protestant voices is relevant here.

I hope this helps a little.
  • Liberian
 
  1. Based on history
    a. The appeal to apostolic succession did not appear before
    A.D. 170-200 - Elwell Evangelical Dictionary

    b. All early succession lists were compiled late in the second
    century - ibid.
    c. It was developed as a means to counter Gnostic and other
    heresies
    d. It became a convenient way to assert validity and authority,
    taking precedent over appealing to the Word of God
ccel.org/contrib/exec_outlines/top/aposucc.htm

“Through countryside and city [the apostles] preached, and they appointed their earliest converts, testing them by the Spirit, to be the bishops and deacons of future believers. Nor was this a novelty, for bishops and deacons had been written about a long time earlier. . . . Our apostles knew through our Lord Jesus Christ that there would be strife for the office of bishop. For this reason, therefore, having received perfect foreknowledge, they appointed those who have already been mentioned and afterwards added the further provision that, if they should die, other approved men should succeed to their ministry” Pope Clement I, (Letter to the Corinthians 42:4–5, 44:1–3 **[A.D. 80]). **

“For what is the bishop but one who beyond all others possesses all power and authority, so far as it is possible for a man to possess it, who according to his ability has been made an imitator of the Christ off God? And what is the presbytery but a sacred assembly, the counselors and assessors of the bishop? And what are the deacons but imitators of the angelic powers, fulfilling a pure and blameless ministry unto him, as…Anencletus and Clement to Peter?” Ignatius, To the Trallians, 7 (A.D. 110).
 
Better and better! Thank you very much.

Usually when one does one’s homework the Catholic Church comes out in a much stronger position.
  • Liberian
 
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