Conversion Help! Again!

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Dimmers

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Okay got 2 conversions so far.

This one is almost there. This is the problem:

Possible Catholic convert is in love with the Catholic tracts I have printed and supplied to him, loves Catholic Tradition, the Mass etc… But… his parents are Christian Evangelists and all their tactics have failed so far, so they have resorted to this one.

Fourth Commandment “Honour thy father and mother”

They say since he is still under their YOKE. That he has to do as they say. Since they are not leading him to sin and they are also followers of God, that their requests should be HONORED. And by converting to Catholicism, he is not honoring. Therefore he is commiting grave sin.

Help me out on this one guys. Thanks in advanced.
 
To begin with, how hold is this person? Is he a dependent minor? If so, given the non-abusive environment, his parents have a point. This person may have to bide his time in formally converting out of respect for his parents until he is on his own. Of course, he can be a Catholic in his heart until the time is right.
 
He could say this:

"Christ Himself quoted that commandment, when he said to the rich man (Luke 18:20-22):

And Jesus said to him: Why dost thou call me good? None is good but God alone. Thou knowest the commandments: Thou shalt not kill: Thou shalt not commit adultery: Thou shalt not steal: Thou shalt not bear false witness: **Honour thy father and mother. **

But when the rich man said:

‘All these things have I kept from my youth.’

Then Jesus gave him another command:

‘Yet one thing is wanting to thee: sell all whatever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.’

The only way I can truly, honestly follow Christ is by being a member of His Church."

And when they object, he can add (Mark 10:29-30):

“Jesus answering, said: Amen I say to you, there is no man who hath left house or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or children, or lands, for my sake and for the gospel, Who shall not receive an hundred times as much, now in this time; houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions: and in the world to come life everlasting.”

He should, however, avoid Matthew 10:37:

“He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me.”

if at all possible, since it may come across as too harsh.
 
Ahh, but it doesn’t say that their requests are to be honored, but that they are to be honored. I wonder, if a son of e.g. Mormons wanted to become an Evangelical Christian, and the Mormon parents tried the “Honor thy Mother and Father” argument, if these Evangelical parents would consider that a valid reason for the Mormon son to not become an Evangelical Christian? Actually, I don’t wonder one little bit. 😉

And then there’s Luke 14:26: “If any one comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple.” Hmm…
 
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Fidelis:
To begin with, how hold is this person? Is he a dependent minor? If so, given the non-abusive environment, his parents have a point. This person may have to bide his time in formally converting out of respect for his parents until he is on his own. Of course, he can be a Catholic in his heart until the time is right.
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He is 19 years old. Currently attending University and at their mercy to pay his School, meals, clothing etc…

Which is what is stopping him.
 
So must they be aware of his conversion just yet? I’m sure he can work under-cover until he’s done with University.
 
I don’t think you should encourage him to be deceptive though. If he really wants to convert, he may have to face the discomfort of supporting himself through college. That is really an unfortunate situation. I wish I had better advice. Bless you for the work you’ve done to bring this young man to truth, Dimmers. I’ll pray for him.
 
One could ask if the son’s conversion would dishonor the parents, or if the parents decision dishonors their son. But this is merely playing with words. The fourth commandment can be argued not to have anything to do with honor as we know it. The Hebrew word that we translate to “honor” is pronounced Kah-Voe-Thah and it more accurately means to give glory to, or to glorify, ergo: Glorify thy father and mother.

The sense is that one should not deem all of their abilities or accomplishments as being entirely of their own doing. One should always keep in mind the contributions in one’s life by their parents, and the best way to do this is to share one’s glory with their parents who made it all possible in the first place. (This almost makes the 4th commandment the “Pro-life” commandment as one cannot glorify the ones who gave them life by killing their parent’s grandchildren.)

If Mr. and Mrs. “John Doe” raise a child in schism from the authorized apostolic church, and their child overcomes this ingrained bias by assenting to the true faith, then this overcoming of bias out of a yearning for the fullness of truth becomes another source of glory for God who has led that child to the truth.

If this gives glory to God, then how can it not, in turn, give glory and “honor” to the parents as well?

Thal59
 
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Dimmers:
He is 19 years old. Currently attending University and at their mercy to pay his School, meals, clothing etc…

Which is what is stopping him.
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This is very revealing.

He clearly has no obligation to honor their request, since he is not a minor and no longer under their instruction (or did they tell him which classes to take?).

On the other hand, neither are they obligated to pay his schooling, meals, or clothing anymore.

This really does correspond to the rich man who did not want to give up all his possessions. If God is truly calling him, then he has to face the prospect of leaving college. Perhaps he will have to get a job and go to college later when he can afford it on his own - if God wants him there.

But he needs to keep in mind that he has no inherent “right” to be in college, and his parents are not obligated to send him.

hurst
 
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Dimmers:
He is 19 years old. Currently attending University and at their mercy to pay his School, meals, clothing etc…

Which is what is stopping him.
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Hurst said it correctly. This young man needs to decide which is the greater good-getting his parents to pay for college, or following Jesus wherever He leads and whenever He calls, even if it be a little inconvenient at the time. He might read Luke 9:23-26. He should also definitely read and contemplate Luke 9:61&62!
 
Agreed —This person is not a child and should be free to make his own decisions regarding his faith. If his parents are so ignorant and/or so hate filled as to cut him off, he --and they --might just have to suffer the consequences in being true to God’s call to him. Many before him have done the same.
 
Gotta agree here too…The 19 yo has a decision to make. From experience, most parents would rather not see their child drop out of college, but would threaten to withdrawl funds. If he thinks that it is the right thing to do he is free to do so, but if he fears his parents withdrawl of funds more…well that is a shame!
 
Man, I feel as if I have come into these people’s lives and stirred things up. It would be a shame for him to drop out of school. Also the whole guilt thing is getting to him as well. I wish I could direct him here to this page. But he speaks only in spanish. I tried doing a translation of the page through babelfish and things were out of wack.

I don’t want to leave him with little or no options and since his parents follow strictly SCRIPTURE. I need to do some more research to get them to understand that they are interpreting it wrong. The whole language barrier gets to me as well. Thanks for all your help and keep me and him in his prayers so that the Lord guides him to do the right choice.

Seriously, I don’t see why there is so much Anti-Catholicism in this world. The Vatican has just as much power as my 7 year old son. I don’t see the conspiracies all our Non-Catholic brothers see. It is all based on ignorance.
 
Your first post said that they said, if we aren’t leading you into sin then you must obey us. Well I got news for them they are leading him into sin, they just don’t think they are. To know Christ founded a church here on earth and then not become part of that church is a very grave sin.
 
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Dimmers:
Man, I feel as if I have come into these people’s lives and stirred things up. It would be a shame for him to drop out of school. Also the whole guilt thing is getting to him as well. I wish I could direct him here to this page. But he speaks only in spanish. I tried doing a translation of the page through babelfish and things were out of wack.
Click to expand...
I came across Blessed Frassati and wonder if it would do him some good to read about him.

English: frassati.org/OurPatron.asp

Here are some google results -
Spanish:
  1. archimadrid.es/vocaciones/catequesisi/beato%20pierg.htm
    (translated to English: translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www.archimadrid.es/vocaciones/catequesisi/beato%2520pierg.htm&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dfrassati%26num%3D50%26hl%3Den%26lr%3Dlang_es%26safe%3Dactive%26sa%3DG%26as_qdr%3Dall)
  2. es.catholic.net/santoral/articulo.php?id=22045
    (translated to English: translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://es.catholic.net/santoral/articulo.php%3Fid%3D22045&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dfrassati%26num%3D50%26hl%3Den%26lr%3Dlang_es%26safe%3Dactive%26sa%3DG%26as_qdr%3Dall)
hurst
 
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