Could jesus have been the father,son and the holy spirit?

[godsent]

I was told that perhaps he could be by a penecostal friend…i thought but when jesus said"my father sent me"…he surely wouldnt be talking about himself as he clearly asked his father to pray fort him!!

Anyone else able to help me with this concept…and perhaps show me biblcal proof of the trinity apart from"baptize them in the name of the father,son and holy spirit"…

thanks alot!

 

[thistle]

godsent:

I was told that perhaps he could be by a penecostal friend…i thought but when jesus said"my father sent me"…he surely wouldnt be talking about himself as he clearly asked his father to pray fort him!!

Anyone else able to help me with this concept…and perhaps show me biblcal proof of the trinity apart from"baptize them in the name of the father,son and holy spirit"…

thanks alot!

www.scripturecatholic.com/jesus_christ_divinity.html
www.scripturecatholic.com/the_holy_spirit.html
www.scripturecatholic.com/messianic_prophecies.html

 

[rwoehmke]

As Catholics we believe that there are three distinct persons in the Trinity, so Jesus, the Son, is not the Father or the HolySpirit, and conversely the Father and the Holy Spirit are not the Son or Jesus yet the three are one God. It is beyond reason to understand how this can be…

 

[Daniel_Marsh]

Hi GodSent, it sounds like you may be dealing with “Jesus Only” pentecoastals.

I tend to pull out my Montgomery translation of the NT,

Centenary Translation of the New Testament

John 1:1. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was face to face with God, and the Word was God.

Just as you are speaking face to face with the pentecostal, the Word was face to face with his Father before the incarnation. The phrase “the Word was God” they read as the “the Word was the Father”, but a study of the grammar reveals that “the word was divine” or that the nature of the Word is that of God.

forananswer.org/John/Jn1_1.htm

Here is a good outline on the trinity
apologetics.com/default.jsp?bodycontent=/articles/doctrinal_apologetics/bowman-trinity.html

 

[Georgess]

Sharing my ’ atomic’ little understanding of this area - what helped me some what to have a sense of being at peace ( for lack of a better word ) , has been to realise that we could relate to all Three Persons of The Trinity, as a child to Father ; The Lord Himself calls the disciples as children and also asks us to call God as Father !

The HolySpirit is also called The Father of Consolation …, in The Catholic Church, the priests who represent The Lord are called fathers, representing their role in helping to bring supernatural life , and also, as The Lord Himself, they too reveal The Face of The Father…

Now, some of our difficulty, in the Three Persons - One God might be overcome , when we look at the occasion of The Baptism of The Lord - The HolySpirit descending …The Lord , in His Divinity, being in constant union with The Father, in The HolySpirit ( my knowledge of theology being very limited , hope not conveying any heretical views !) The scene of The Baptism , when it is seen as the Eternal reality of an ongoing outpouring of Love - Father to Son, to Father, in The Spirit- instead of our somewhat unreal concept of static persons !( even as humans we are not static - and how awesomely The Eucharistic Consecration also brings this to reality !)

Since many of us might have held an unfair sense of The Father’s role in redemption,- as being not with The Son, inSpirit , IMHO, it is important to see the oneness in the Trinity( even when , the Lord allows Himself to feel the abandonment - to heal our wounds !)

When we can recognise the Father Love in and through The Lord, ( as St. John - the youngest disciple did)we also recognise the blasphemey of books like the davinci code …

 

[tilis]

godsent:

I was told that perhaps he could be by a penecostal friend…i thought but when jesus said"my father sent me"…he surely wouldnt be talking about himself as he clearly asked his father to pray fort him!!

Anyone else able to help me with this concept…and perhaps show me biblcal proof of the trinity apart from"baptize them in the name of the father,son and holy spirit"…

thanks alot!

The law of noncontradiction. Jesus cannot be his own Father. He would be his own begettor. Absurd

 

[Marilena]

One poster posted this:

See the link below:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=100773&highlight=proof+trinity

posted by: Tmaque

"Let’s take the New Testament in whole. The claims he makes to his divinity are numerous…check it out:

(from www.scripturecatholic.com)

Matt. 4:7; Luke 4:12 - Jesus tells satan, “you shall not tempt the Lord your God” in reference to Himself.

Matt. 5:21-22; 27-28; 31-32; 33-34; 38-39; 43-44 - Jesus makes Himself equal to God when He declares, “You heard it said…but I say to you…”

Matt. 7:21-22; Luke 6:46 - not everyone who says to Jesus, “Lord, Lord.” Jesus calls Himself Lord, which is God.

Matt. 9:2; Mark 2:5; Luke 5:20; 7:48 - Jesus forgives sins. Only God can forgive sins.

Matt. 12:8; Mark 2:28; Luke 6:5 - Jesus says that He is “Lord of the Sabbath.” He is the Lord of God’s law which means He is God.

Matt. 18:20 - Jesus says where two or three are gathered in His name, there He is in the midst of them.

Matt. 21:3; Luke 19:31,34 - Jesus calls himself “Lord.” “The Lord has need of them.”

Matt. 26:64; Mark 14:62; Luke 22:70 - Jesus acknowledges that He is the Son of God.

Matt. 28:20 - Jesus said He is with us always, even unto the end of the world. Only God is omnipresent.

Mark 14:36 - Jesus calls God “Abba,” Aramaic for daddy, which was an absolutely unprecedented address to God and demonstrates Jesus’ unique intimacy with the Father.

Luke 8:39 - Luke reports that Jesus said “tell how much God has done for you.” And the man declared how much Jesus did.

Luke 17:18 - Jesus asks why the other nine lepers did not come back to give praise to Him, God, except the Samaritan leper.

Luke 19:38,40 - Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord. If these were silent, the very stones would cry out.

John 5:18 - Jesus claimed to be God. The Jews knew this because Jesus called God His Father and made Himself equal to God. This is why Jesus was crucified.

John 5:21-22 - Jesus gives life and says that all judgment has been given to Him by the Father.

John 5:23 - Jesus equates Himself with the Father, “whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.”

John 6:38 - Jesus says, “For I have come down from heaven.”

John 8:12 - Jesus says “I am the light of the world.” - 1 John 1:5 - God is light and in him there is no darkness at all.

John 8:19 - Jesus says, “if you knew me, you would know my Father also.”

John 8:23 - Jesus says that He is not of this world. Only God is not of this world.

John 8:58 - Jesus says, “Before Abraham was, I AM.” Exodus 3:14 - “I AM” means “Yahweh,” which means God.

John 10:18 - Jesus says He has the power to lay down His life and take it up again - Gal. 1:1 - God raised Jesus to life.

John 10:30 - Jesus says, “I and the Father are one.” They are equal. The Jews even claimed Jesus made Himself equal to God. Jesus’ statement in John 14:28, “the Father is greater than I,” cannot contradict John 10:30 (the Word of God is never in conflict). Jesus’ statement in John 14:28 simply refers to His human messianic role as servant and slave, which He, and not the Father or the Holy Spirit, undertook in the flesh.

John 10:36 - again, Jesus claims that He is “the Son of God.”

John 10:38; 14:10 - “the Father is in me and I am in the Father” means the Father and Son are equal.

John 12:45 - Jesus says, “He who sees Me sees Him who sent Me.” God the Father is equal to God the Son.

John 13:13 - Jesus says, “You call me Teacher and Lord and you are right for so I AM.”

John 14:6 - Jesus says “I am the way, and the truth and the life.” Only God is the way, the truth and the life.

John 16:15 - Jesus says, “all things that the Father has are Mine.” Jesus has everything God has which makes Him God.

John 16:28 - Jesus says that “He came from the Father and has come into the world.”

John 17:5,24 - Jesus’ desire is for us to behold His glory which He had before the foundation of the world.

John 20:17 - Jesus distinguishes His relationship to the Father from our relationship by saying “My Father and your Father.”

Rev. 1:8 - God says He is the “Alpha and the Omega.” In Rev. 22:13, Jesus also says He is the “Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last, the beginning and the end.” The only possible conclusion one can reach is that Jesus is equal to the Lord God."

 

[Struggling]

Jesus is only the Second Person of the Trinity. Natures are possesed by persons, and only the Second Person of the Trinity was united to the human nature of Jesus Christ.

This prevents a lot of confusion, because then the Eternal Son in the Trinity is the same as the fleshy son of God concieved in the womb of the Virgin Mary. It would be confusing if the Father became incarnate as the human son of Himself in a woman’s womb.

However, it is of course theoretically possible for any Divine Person to incarnate. God can incarnate however he wants. And it is possible for one Divine Person to incarnate many times…take on many natures, angelic or human, and, for example, have several humans be the same Divine Person. And it is even theoretically possible for More than one (2 or 3) divine persons to take up the SAME nature and incarnate as the same thing…so some human could theoretically be united hypostatically to the Father and Holy Spirit. And there could be all sorts of combinations where some things are only united to one divine person, and others are united to more than one…however this would be MUCH too confusing. God has only Incarnated once…and has revealed it to be his only time…and only the Second Person was incarnate.

However, St. Thomas Aquinas discusses the hypotheticals here:

Can one person assume without another?
newadvent.org/summa/400304.htm

Can each person assume?
newadvent.org/summa/400305.htm

Can several persons assume one nature?
newadvent.org/summa/400306.htm

Can one person assume two natures?
newadvent.org/summa/400307.htm

He answers in the affirmative to all of them, by the way. God hypothetically COULD do any of these things. But we believe he only incarnated once, taking up one human nature, in one person of the Trinity: the Second Person.