First-Hierarchs of all of the Orthodox Autocephalous Churches are gathered in preparation of the upcoming Holy & Great Council

[Isaiah45_9]

Interesting. If you really do agree the Pope is needed (for an Ecumenical Council, even though he’s not Orthodox) or required for it to be official, then why are you in a Church that doesn’t accept the authority of the Pope? With a belief like that, it seems that you ought to become a Catholic, right?

Right!

 

[1Tim215Mommy]

Well…how do you know this?

How do I know that the Pope of Rome is not a member of the Orthodox Church? That seems like an odd question to me.

Well, I know because he is the leader of a different Church that requires belief in unOrthodox teachings and also because he is not able to receive the Holy Eucharist in our Orthodox Churches.

That is right…but he had to affirm the final findings, as per Tradition, before the decisions become final.

All the Patriarchs, the Patriarchs of Rome, Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch & Jerusalem all had to affirm the decisions, not just the Patriarch of Rome. The Councils were confirmed by all the entire Church, not just one part.

 

[Stilldreamn]

The USCCB has outlined the agenda for the council. Here is a link.

usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/ecumenical-and-interreligious/ecumenical/orthodox/reaction-orthodox-council.cfm

Um, that’s apparently the link for the 1977 council. Still an interesting read though. I would love to see our synod tackle some meaty topics like that (and not just shunt them off to a committee or study group).

 

[1Tim215Mommy]

Right!

(I’m just saying…)

 

[josie_L]

Actually:

The Council of Chalcedon - 451 A.D. was called by Byzantine Emperor Marcian.

Slight quibble here, in fact, it was Pope St. Leo who initially called for an ecumenical council, not the emperor.

 

[Digitonomy]

I will be very surprised if this council comes to pass. I think some of the patriarchs have already weighed in against the convening of such a council. We discussed this a few years ago:

Great and Holy Council, 2013?
.
.

Um, that’s apparently the link for the 1977 council. Still an interesting read though. I would love to see our synod tackle some meaty topics like that (and not just shunt them off to a committee or study group).

No, his link was to the USCCB’s fraternal suggestions for the very council we are talking about, which were made by a committee back in 1977. Preparations have been underway for that long. Not because it really takes that long to plan, but because getting all the Orthodox churches to agree has been like herding cats.

 

[Isaiah45_9]

Slight quibble here, in fact, it was Pope St. Leo who initially called for an ecumenical council, not the emperor.

Attila was laying waste to the West.

From Papal Encyclicals:

It was the emperor Marcian who, after the “robber” council of Ephesus (449), commanded this council to meet. Pope Leo I was opposed to it. His view was that all the bishops should repent of their ways and individually sign his earlier dogmatic letter to Flavian, patriarch of Constantinople, and so avoid a new round of argument and debate. Moreover, the provinces of the West were being laid waste by Attila’s invasions. But before the pope’s view became known, the emperor Marcian had, by an edict of 17 May 451, convoked the council for 1 September 451. Although the pope was displeased, he sent legates: Paschasinus bishop of Lilybaeum, Bishop Lucentius, the priests Boniface and Basil, and Bishop Julian of Cos. No doubt Leo thought that the council would cause people to leave the church and go into schism. So he wanted it to be postponed for a time, and he implored the emperor that the faith handed down from ancient times should not become the subject of debate. The only business should be the restoration of the exiled bishops to their former positions.

Confirmed at EWTN

 

[zz912]

Preparations have been underway for that long. Not because it really takes that long to plan, but because getting all the Orthodox churches to agree has been like herding cats.

Seems like having someone with authority to bring them in line would be a good thing.

 

[pablope]

How do I know that the Pope of Rome is not a member of the Orthodox Church? That seems like an odd question to me.

Maybe you misunderstood the question…why do you believe the Pope has believed differently than that of the OC?

Well, I know because he is the leader of a different Church that requires belief in unOrthodox teachings and also because he is not able to receive the Holy Eucharist in our Orthodox Churches.

 

[JonNC]

Interesting. If you really do agree the Pope is needed (for an Ecumenical Council, even though he’s not Orthodox) or required for it to be official, then why are you in a Church that doesn’t accept the authority of the Pope? With a belief like that, it seems that you ought to become a Catholic, right?

Just being consistent. Rome’s councils are not ecumenical without the EO either.

Jon

 

[JonNC]

Right!

Jon

 

[josie_L]

Attila was laying waste to the West.

From Papal Encyclicals:

Confirmed at EWTN

Yes, and that is why I emboldened “initially”, i.e., he was the first to ask for a council:

In 449 the council, which was designated by Leo as the “Robber Synod”, was held. Flavian and other powerful prelates of the East appealed to the pope. The latter sent urgent letters to Constantinople, particularly to Emperor Theodosius II and Empress Pulcheria, urging them to convene a general council in order to restore peace to the Church. To the same end he used his influence with the Western emperor, Valentinian III, and his mother Galla Placidia, especially during their visit to Rome in 450. This general council was held in Chalcedon in 451 under Marcian, the successor of Theodosius.

newadvent.org/cathen/09154b.htm

I believe what happened is that he had to retract his earlier request for a council because for all intents and purposes the Church accepted/affirmed his tome/epistle, so that there was no longer a reason to hold an ecumenical council, especially in light of an invasion by the Huns in the West. Marcius however had already set in motion a council because of Pope St. Leo’s earlier request, the council was therefore convened. You can check up Pope St. Leo’s epistles to verify what I wrote, here:

crossroadsinitiative.com/library_article/677/St._Leo_the_Great___Letters_60_173.html

 

[Nine_Two]

Just being consistent. Rome’s councils are not ecumenical without the EO either.

Jon

To be fair, while many have billed this as an ecumenical council, there is no precedent to do so at this point, as the Tradition has always been that councils become Ecumenical after.

In truth this sort of meeting is unprecedented. Never before have we had all the Primates meet together for such an issue, always in the past it has always been limited to a few churches being represented and their decrees being backed by the rest, even the Ecumenical Councils were just what bishops were able to make the journey.

It will be up to future generations to decide if this is an Ecumenical Council. I don’t see the doctrinal controversies which have defined such councils in the past, so somehow I doubt it will be remembered on that level.

 

[pablope]

To be fair, while many have billed this as an ecumenical council, there is no precedent to do so at this point, as the Tradition has always been that councils become Ecumenical after.

I believe this was the case with the 2nd EC…it was not ecumenical at first…but became later.

I am not sure about the first…was it considered ecumenical from the start?

It will be up to future generations to decide if this is an Ecumenical Council. I don’t see the doctrinal controversies which have defined such councils in the past, so somehow I doubt it will be remembered on that level.

 

[House_Harkonnen]

This was News to me: www.patriarchate.org/news/releases/synaxis-2014

His All-Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew invited all the First-Hierarchs of the Orthodox Churches to gather to deliberate on matters pertaining to the entire Orthodox Church through out the world - an 8th Ecumencial Council?!

I wonder what topics are affecting the entire Orthodox Church in every single corner of the world that is triggering such a huge event?

Anyone have any guesses on what topics may be addressed?

Exciting!

Union with the Oriental Orthodox communion.

 

[dzheremi]

Union with the Oriental Orthodox communion.

What makes you think that? There are separate dialogues going for that, unrelated to the current gathering.

 

[Nine_Two]

I believe this was the case with the 2nd EC…it was not ecumenical at first…but became later.

 

[TimothyH]

I know what they are going to do at this council.

They are all going to announce submission to the Bishop of Rome, His Holiness Pope Francis, and fold their Churches into the Catholic Church.



-Tim-

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

To be fair, while many have billed this as an ecumenical council, there is no precedent to do so at this point, as the Tradition has always been that councils become Ecumenical after.

In truth this sort of meeting is unprecedented. Never before have we had all the Primates meet together for such an issue, always in the past it has always been limited to a few churches being represented and their decrees being backed by the rest, even the Ecumenical Councils were just what bishops were able to make the journey.

It will be up to future generations to decide if this is an Ecumenical Council. I don’t see the doctrinal controversies which have defined such councils in the past, so somehow I doubt it will be remembered on that level.

I am with you on this one Nine_Two The OP mentioned 8th Ecumenical council? In the West a synod of bishop’s deal with their independent diocese and disciplines of the Church and current issues pressing the Church. When it involves the whole Church regarding doctrine and the movement of the whole Church, Peter speaks.

I don’t see this Holy Council addressing doctrines for the whole of the Church. Disciplines and current issues affecting these autocephalous Church’s is of a great importance. I pray that the will of God be made known in this Holy Council. I’m honored and priviledged to pray for such a historical event in Church history, during my lenten prayers.

Happy Lent to you, and peace as always

 

[JonNC]

To be fair, while many have billed this as an ecumenical council, there is no precedent to do so at this point, as the Tradition has always been that councils become Ecumenical after.

In truth this sort of meeting is unprecedented. Never before have we had all the Primates meet together for such an issue, always in the past it has always been limited to a few churches being represented and their decrees being backed by the rest, even the Ecumenical Councils were just what bishops were able to make the journey.

It will be up to future generations to decide if this is an Ecumenical Council. I don’t see the doctrinal controversies which have defined such councils in the past, so somehow I doubt it will be remembered on that level.

Thanks, Nine_Two.

Jon