I don’t understand how your post could be related to my question.Good and evil is a philosophical dichotomy but not a religious forefront for love.
That I agree.Actually, its that God allows the possibility of evil, not that he wills or needs evil to occur.
I don’t understand how what you said is related to the question in OP.He does not desire or will evil. He gives us freedom to choose good or evil. Without that freedom we could not love, because you can’t love unless you have the freedom to choose love. Love that is coerced is not true love. However, in order to have this freedom to love means you can choose not to love. Thus, evil is a possibility, though it is not desired.
I don’t think your definitions are correct but I still think I can work with them. Based on your definitions I think you would need to restate “Personal Evil” and Personal Good" because that is the only way the “feelings” could come into play. For instance, I am sure we could both agree that if someone were to rob a bank and shoot one of the customers for looking at him wrong, this would be an act of Evil. However, based on your definition I would have to say, no it isn’t evil because I am not feeling confused and am not suffering from this Evil act.We can define Evil as a state of mind which brings confusion and suffering where as Good as a state of mind which brings clarity and pleasure.
It is claimed in Christianity that God allowed Evil for greater Good. But how such a transformation is possible given the definition Evil and Good?
Evil remains evil; it is not itself transformed into good. However, allowing an evil to occur may create the opportunity for a greater good to occur that might not otherwise have been possible.It is claimed in Christianity that God allowed Evil for greater Good. But how such a transformation is possible given the definition Evil and Good?
Think of it like this. The greater good is the possibility that we could choose to love. The possibility of evil is the price to pay. So it’s not like God needs evil to occur for a greater good to happen. Evil occurs as an unfortunate side effect because we don’t always choose to love. But, the greater good that is made possible is that we can freely love.That I agree.
I don’t understand how what you said is related to the question in OP.
That definition of good and evil is not the one used by Catholic Church rather physical and moral evil is used (and therefore by contrast physical and moral good).We can define Evil as a state of mind which brings confusion and suffering where as Good as a state of mind which brings clarity and pleasure.
It is claimed in Christianity that God allowed Evil for greater Good. But how such a transformation is possible given the definition Evil and Good?
That is correct.I don’t think your definitions are correct but I still think I can work with them. Based on your definitions I think you would need to restate “Personal Evil” and Personal Good" because that is the only way the “feelings” could come into play.
Killing a person and rob a bank is wrong, it is not evil.For instance, I am sure we could both agree that if someone were to rob a bank and shoot one of the customers for looking at him wrong, this would be an act of Evil. However, based on your definition I would have to say, no it isn’t evil because I am not feeling confused and am not suffering from this Evil act.
Could you please give me an example?Also, I am not to sure about the word “pleasure”, something good doesn’t always have to be pleasurable.
That is not true. The only way that you can turn Evil to Good is through performing Good. You practice Good in order to understand and go from an Evil/confusion state to Good/understanding state.That being said, since the only way your definition works is based on “Personal Evil”. I think the “transformation” from being confused to understanding and from suffering to not suffering anymore, is quite possible.
That is only possible through performing Good as it is explained in the previous comment.If you are trying to use your definition of Good and Evil as a definition of any type of Evil then I think the confusion to clarity could occur.
Can you justify accepting death penalty for following a faith as a good action for the believers?For example, in the second century, there was a deadly persecution of Christians for their faith, an evil act.
That is a social movement. Sometimes it happens sometimes it doesn’t. I think we don’t know how and why it happens yet.However, instead of putting an end to Christianity, the persecution of Christians resulted in the growth of Christianity, a greater good. Seeing the joy and fearlessness of Christians in the face of death and desiring such joy and fearlessness for themselves prompted many who publicly witnessed the martyrdom of the Christians to become Christians themselves. “The blood of the martyrs is the seed of the Church.” (Tertullian)
That is a good coincidence. You cannot justify Evil given your definition.Another example, in the Old Testament, Joseph, the son of Israel, was sold into slavery by his jealous brothers and later falsely accused of a crime and put into prison, evil acts. However, being in the Egyptian prison created the opportunity for Joseph, through a long chain of events, to do a greater good, namely, to save his family and Egypt from starvation.
First what is your definition of Evil and Good? Secondly, saying that greater Good can comes out Evil as a mystery is not a good answer.That definition of good and evil is not the one used by Catholic Church rather physical and moral evil is used (and therefore by contrast physical and moral good).
Catechism
324 The fact that God permits physical and even moral evil is a mystery that God illuminates by his Son Jesus Christ who died and rose to vanquish evil. Faith gives us the certainty that God would not permit an evil if he did not cause a good to come from that very evil, by ways that we shall fully know only in eternal life.
Compendium of the Catechism
57. If God is omnipotent and provident, why then does evil exist?
309-310
324, 400
To this question, as painful and mysterious as it is, only the whole of Christian faith can constitute a response. God is not in any way - directly or indirectly - the cause of evil. He illuminates the mystery of evil in his Son Jesus Christ who died and rose in order to vanquish that great moral evil, human sin, which is at the root of all other evils.
58. Why does God permit evil?
311-314
324
Faith gives us the certainty that God would not permit evil if he did not cause a good to come from that very evil. This was realized in a wondrous way by God in the death and resurrection of Christ. In fact, from the greatest of all moral evils (the murder of his Son) he has brought forth the greatest of all goods (the glorification of Christ and our redemption).
The Faith, A Popular Guide Based on The Catechism of the Catholic Church, by John A. Hardon, S.J. has this:First what is your definition of Evil and Good? Secondly, saying that greater Good can comes out Evil as a mystery is not a good answer.
First I think you simply repost your previous post. Secondly, saying that greater Good can comes out Evil as a mystery is not a good answer. It simply leaves us in the state of ignorance.The Faith, A Popular Guide Based on The Catechism of the Catholic Church, by John A. Hardon, S.J. has this:
They are moral and physical evil.
- What are the two kinds of evil in the world?
(310-311)
Moral evil is sin. It is evil because it is contrary to the will of God. It is moral evil because it is caused by a free created will acting against the will of God. He does not want moral evil as an end or as a means.
- What is moral evil?
Physical evil is the privation of a natural physical good. It is evil because something is lacking in what it should be. It is physical because the lack or privation is in the nature (physis in Greek) of a thing. The privation may be material, like the size or strength of a body; or it may be spiritual, like ignorance in the mind or courage in the will. When this privation is consciously experienced, it is painful suffering which may also be called a physical evil.
- What is physical evil?
(310)
There is physical evil because God willed that there be limitations in the world He created. These limitations provide us with the opportunity to develop the world in which we live. Yet, as the Second Vatican Council reminds us, such “earthy progress #133; is of vital concern to the Kingdom of God, insofar as it can contribute to the better ordering of human society” (Gaudium et spes, 39).
- Why is there physical evil?
therealpresence.org/archives/Catechism/Catechism_010.htm
We can always choose to love. I don’t understand how Evil could help us to get Good considering the fact that we can always to choose love. By the way what are your definition of Evil and Good.Think of it like this. The greater good is the possibility that we could choose to love. The possibility of evil is the price to pay.
That I understand.So it’s not like God needs evil to occur for a greater good to happen.
The greater Good is always possible from Good with less effort. It is nonsense to let Evil happen for greater Good.Evil occurs as an unfortunate side effect because we don’t always choose to love. But, the greater good that is made possible is that we can freely love. Now, God can turn a bad situation around for good. But, he doesn’t need evil to occur for the greater good to be possible.
I guess you did not read it. The material from the earlier post is from the Catechism and from the latter post is from Fr. Hardon, S.J…First I think you simply repost your previous post. Secondly, saying that greater Good can comes out Evil as a mystery is not a good answer. It simply leaves us in the state of ignorance.
Your post simply didn’t answer my questions.I guess you did not read it. The material from the earlier post is from the Catechism and from the latter post is from Fr. Hardon, S.J…
Why should there be any mystery in your system of belief knowing the fact that 2000 years past from its establishment the fact that Holy Spirit in charge of revelation?Some things are mysteries and it can be because of inability to understand God.
OK, but you said “First I think you simply repost your previous post.” which I did not so I explained. You have a lot of questions, which ones did I not answer?Your post simply didn’t answer my questions.
Why should there be any mystery in your system of belief knowing the fact that 2000 years past from its establishment the fact that Holy Spirit in charge of revelation?
When believers die, they leave this life and they enter a far better life, eternal life. If someone kills them they simply go to that far better life sooner. See Philippians 1:19-26; Wisdom 4:7-19.Can you justify accepting death penalty for following a faith as a good action for the believers?
That is a social movement. Sometimes it happens sometimes it doesn’t. I think we don’t know how and why it happens yet.
Christians have reason to believe that there are no coincidences but rather that God is intimately involved with everything that happens, divine providence. St Paul said, “We know that in everything God works for good with those who love him, who are called according to his purpose.” (Romans 8:28) Jesus said, “Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? And not one of them will fall to the ground without your Father’s will. But even the hairs of your head are all numbered.” (Matthew 10:29-30)That is a good coincidence. You cannot justify Evil given your definition.
I cannot accept mystery if we are cognitively open to the Truth and God is Love. How God how is Love can leave His creature in the state of Ignorance?Did you not understand that mystery exists because we do not have the ability to understand everything?