Jehovah's witnesses still dont have an accurate translation?

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Hellisreal

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Our Kingdom Ministry

September 2007

For the United States of America

km-E Us 9/07 Vol. 50, No.9

the question box on page 3

Does “the faithful and discreet slave” endorse independent groups of witnesses who meet together to engage in Scriptural research or debate?
-Matt.24:45,47
No, it does not. And yet, in various parts of the world, a few associates of our organization have formed groups to do independent research on Bible-related subjects. Some have pursued an independent group study of Biblical Hewbrew and Greek so as to analyze the accuracy of the New World Translation.

(cont.)

Is this an admission that they dont have assurance they have translated it correctly?

Anyone know?
 
JW’s view the NWT as the most accurate translation available.

Jason Debuhn also agrees:

In his book “ TRUTH IN TRANSLATION: ACCURACY AND BIAS IN ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT" Author: Jason David BeDuhn he compares varoius Bible translations for their accuracy.

In summary, he says: “… it can be said that the NW emerges as the most accurate of the translations compared…the translators managed to produce works relatively more accurate and less biased than the translations produced by multi-nominational teams, as well as those produced by single individuals.” “Jehovah’s Witnesses… really sought to re-invent Christianity from scratch… building their system of belief and practice from the raw material of the Bible without predetermining what was to be found there. Some critics, of course, would say that the results of this practice can be naive. But for Bible translation, at least, it has meant a fresh approach to the text, with far less presumption than that found in may of the Protestant translations.”

Author: Jason David BeDuhn is the Associate Professor of Religious Studies at Northern Arizona University in Flagstaff. He holds a B.A. in Religious Studies from the University of Illinois, Urbana, an M.T.S. in New Testament and Christian Origins form Harvard Divinity School, and a Ph.D. in s Comparative Study of Religions form Indiana University, Bloomington.

The Nine English Translations Compared in BeDuhn’s book are:
  • The King James Version (KJV)
  • The Amplified Bible (AB)
  • The Living Bible (LB)
  • The New American Bible (NAB)
  • The New American Standard Bible (NASB)
  • The New International Version (NIV)
  • The New World Translation (NW)
  • The (New) Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
  • Today’s English Version (TEV)
The book can be found at:

tinyurl.com/28cy6y

It should also be noted that the author is not one of Jehovah’s Witnesses and yet he fully recognizes the accuracy of the NWT.
 
Hey NWT bible Steve!

Can you answer my question?

I asked a specific question about your Kingdom ministry literature.

Why check for accuracy? :confused:

Are there ANY doubts there could be an innacuracy?

And, based on the story, your presence here is very questionable, as you are here in a seperate group…:rolleyes:
talking about bible study…:eek:
In direct violation of your organizations statements above!😛
 
Hellisreal,

The discussion in the KM was very straightforward, regarding what our Governing body “endorses”.

There is plenty that any religious leadership doesn’t endorse:

eating pizza, drinking beer, various medical proceedures, various popular diets, various books, etc.

The question was whether WT leader “endorses” members getting together and having debates with each other over the accuracy of our doctrinal beliefs and the accuracy of the NWT.

No, they do not “endorse” this because it can become divisive, contrary to what the Apostle Paul said at 1 Cor 1:10

(1 Corinthians 1:10) Now I exhort YOU, brothers, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ that YOU should all speak in agreement, and that there should not be divisions among YOU, but that YOU may be fitly united in the same mind and in the same line of thought.

Similarly, could it be said that the Catholic Church, or the Pope “endorses” groups of Catholics to get together and have debates over the accuracy of Catholic doctrine? No, if asked, I doubt they would say they “endorse” this activity.

How would the Catholic Church answer: “Do you **endorse **groups of Catholic laity to get together to debate whether the Catholic understanding is correct, and whether the Duay or Jerusalem Bible is accurate?”

I suspect they would suggest they are already correct and that the members should apply themselves to studying what the Church says is correct, right?
 
Hellisreal,

The discussion in the KM was very straightforward, regarding what our Governing body “endorses”.

There is plenty that any religious leadership doesn’t endorse:

eating pizza, drinking beer, various medical proceedures, various popular diets, various books, etc.

The question was whether WT leader “endorses” members getting together and having debates with each other over the accuracy of our doctrinal beliefs and the accuracy of the NWT.

No, they do not “endorse” this because it can become divisive, contrary to what the Apostle Paul said at 1 Cor 1:10

(1 Corinthians 1:10) Now I exhort YOU, brothers, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ that YOU should all speak in agreement, and that there should not be divisions among YOU, but that YOU may be fitly united in the same mind and in the same line of thought.

Similarly, could it be said that the Catholic Church, or the Pope “endorses” groups of Catholics to get together and have debates over the accuracy of Catholic doctrine? No, if asked, I doubt they would say the “endorse” this activity.

How would the Catholic Church answer: “Do you **endorse **groups of Catholics laity to get together to debate whether the Catholic understanding is correct, and whether the Duay or Jerusalem Bible is accurate?”
You are serious? Do you realize the fact that theologians do just this all the time? Debate over doctrine is absolutely fine!

We also have dogma. 😉

In fact, you are clever with your use of switching topics.

Individual groups of witnesses can not do certain things. In this case fellowship with each other in groups for bible research or debate.

I assume that is because, as you claim the NWT is so accurate.

But, the orginazation does allow for some to check for accuracy of the NWT.

Why should they do this, unless…

Interestingly, no mention of credentials of this research group either.
 
My suggestion is that you buy this book and read it. You might learn something valuable…

tinyurl.com/28cy6y

Happy reading,

Steve
Again, I will patiently await an answer from you that I have no expectation of getting.

If its so accurate, why the study group (with no mentioned credentials) to check for accuracy?

I will ask as many times as it takes, and I will ask you to refrain from posting if you can not, or will not answer.
 
Hellisreal,

I’ve tried to answer your question multiple times. I’m not sure how I’m missing it, or what you are thinking.

Various JW members have apparently thought it to be fun and interesting to debate with each other over doctrinal issues and topics like the accuracy of the NWT.

Credentials? I’m not sure why you keep bringing this up… these are just various members… similar to Catholic laity choosing to debate over Catholic doctrinal issues.

The KM discussed the question of whether the GB “endorsed” this… not “prohibited” this.

The article was a good reminder that the Bible recommends a spirit of unity between members, not argumentative divisiveness.

Whether members of JW’s or laity of the Catholic faith choose to debate the accuracy of their religions “official” translation doesn’t decide whether a translation is accurate or not… It just means they choose to debate this…

If you’re interested in learning why the NWT is the most accurate translation, then read the above mentioned book.

If you are concerned that the GB doesn’t “endorse” certain things… whether it be various diets, specific exercise programs, or theological debates between members of like faith… then I say great, I appreciate your opinion…

I personally see the wisdom in it… but if you don’t, then that is fine… so be it.
 
Hellisreal,
I’ve tried to answer your question multiple times. I’m not sure how I’m missing it, or what you are thinking.
:confused:

Not my concern at all. You have been told what my concern is in each post.

If the org, will OK a group to check for accuracy of the NWT, but not Okay debate on scripture…

and they cant debate scripture because its so accurate…

Why the check of accuracy then?
 
Dear Hellisreal,

Please save yourself the time and effort… You are apparently far more interested in parsing words to argue your point than I am.

For example,

I state that some members wanted to “debate” the accuracy of the NWT. And you want to argue over the word “analyze” vs. “debate”:

Quote: Inaccurate! The article does not state that debate is involved with the NWT. Your projection perhaps? The article, speaks for itself! It says that …“so as to analyze the accuracy of the New World Translation.”

Really, save yourself the effort… arguing over this level of minutia is not interesting to me…

I wish you well in your studies.
 
There is a difference.

To analyze for accuracy, one is not going into it with a debate mindset.
Its merely a matter of looking at the “Biblical” Greek and Hewbrew, right?

To debate scripture, however, leads to questioning interpretation, not translation.

You can not be so blind to that fact.

nice try though.
Dear Hellisreal,

Please save yourself the time and effort… You are apparently far more interested in parsing words to argue your point than I am.

For example,

I state that some members wanted to “debate” the accuracy of the NWT. And you want to argue over the word “analyze” vs. “debate”:

Quote: Inaccurate! The article does not state that debate is involved with the NWT. Your projection perhaps? The article, speaks for itself! It says that …“so as to analyze the accuracy of the New World Translation.”

Really, save yourself the effort… arguing over this level of minutia is not interesting to me…

I wish you well in your studies.
 
In the same literature

in the announcements

…Please note that Watchtower Library -2007 Edition is a provision for the baptised members of the congregation and is made available only through the congregation.

I could go on Steve, do you want me to or will you answer my question?
 
Hellisreal, I don’t know how to answer your question because IMHO, your posts are ambiguous and argumentative.

Here’s the full article for your reference. If you disagree with the principles expressed, then so be it. I wish you well as a Catholic and hope you enjoy debating with your fellow church members over topics that the Catholic Church and Pope have already decided to be true… perhaps you can convince a few of your fellow members the Catholic Church doctrine is wrong and your opinions are right… because that is the point of the article…

QUESTION BOX

Does “the faithful and discreet slave” **endorse **independent groups of Witnesses who meet together to engage in Scriptural research or debate?–Matt. 24:45, 47.

No, it does not. And yet, in various parts of the world, a few associates of our organization have formed groups to do independent research on Bible-related subjects. Some have pursued an independent group study of Biblical Hebrew and Greek so as to analyze the accuracy of the New World Translation. Others explore scientific subjects related to the Bible. They have created Web sites and chat rooms for the purpose of exchanging and **debating **their views. They have also held conferences and produced publications to present their findings and to supplement what is provided at our Christian meetings and through our literature.

Throughout the earth, Jehovah’s people are receiving ample spiritual instruction and encouragement at congregation meetings, assemblies, and conventions, as well as through the publications of Jehovah’s organization. Under the guidance of his holy spirit and on the basis of his Word of truth, Jehovah provides what is needed so that all of God’s people may be “fitly united in the same mind and in the same line of thought” and remain “stabilized in the faith.” (1 Cor. 1:10; Col. 2:6, 7) Surely we are grateful for Jehovah’s spiritual provisions in these last days. **Thus, “the faithful and discreet slave” does not endorse any literature, meetings, or Web sites that are not produced or organized under its oversight.–**Matt. 24:45-47.

**It is commendable for individuals to want to use their thinking ability in support of the good news. **However, no personal pursuit should detract from what Jesus Christ is accomplishing through his congregation on earth today. In the first century, the apostle Paul warned about getting involved in exhausting, time-consuming subjects, such as “genealogies, which end up in nothing, but which furnish questions for research rather than a dispensing of anything by God in connection with faith.” (1 Tim. 1:3-7) All Christians should strive to “shun foolish questionings and genealogies and strife and fights over the Law, for they are unprofitable and futile.”–Titus 3:9.

For those who wish to do extra Bible study and research, we recommend that they explore Insight on the Scriptures, “All Scripture Is Inspired of God and Beneficial,” and our other publications, such as those that discuss the prophecies found in the Bible books of Daniel, Isaiah, and Revelation. These provide abundant material for Bible study and meditation, whereby we can be “filled with the accurate knowledge of [God’s] will in all wisdom and spiritual comprehension, in order to walk worthily of Jehovah to the end of fully pleasing him as [we] go on bearing fruit in every good work and increasing in the accurate knowledge of God.”–Col. 1:9, 10.
 
The debating their views you bolded, pertains to scientific topics, which I will address on another thread.

Stick to the questions.
 
Does “the faithful and discreet slave” endorse independent groups of Witnesses who meet together to engage in Scriptural research or debate?–Matt. 24:45, 47.
 
Do you agree with the Apostle Paul? The GB is simply making the same point.

In the first century, the apostle Paul warned about getting involved in exhausting, time-consuming subjects, such as “genealogies, which end up in nothing, but which furnish questions for research rather than a dispensing of anything by God in connection with faith.” (1 Tim. 1:3-7) All Christians should strive to “shun foolish questionings and genealogies and strife and fights over the Law, for they are unprofitable and futile.”–Titus 3:9.
 
Hellisreal, I don’t know how to answer your question because IMHO, your posts are ambiguous and argumentative.

Here’s the full article for your reference. If you disagree with the principles expressed, then so be it. I wish you well as a Catholic and hope you enjoy debating with your fellow church members over topics that the Catholic Church and Pope have already decided to be true… perhaps you can convince a few of your fellow members the Catholic Church doctrine is wrong and your opinions are right… because that is the point of the article…

QUESTION BOX

Does “the faithful and discreet slave” endorse independent groups of Witnesses who meet together to engage in Scriptural research or debate?–Matt. 24:45, 47.

No, it does not. And yet, in various parts of the world, a few associates of our organization have formed groups to do

independent research on Bible-related subjects. Some have pursued an independent group study of Biblical Hebrew and Greek so as to analyze the accuracy of the New World Translation.

Others explore **scientific subjects **related to the Bible. They have created Web sites and chat rooms for the purpose of exchanging and **debating **their views. They have also held conferences and produced publications to present their findings and to **supplement **what is provided at our Christian meetings and through our literature.

Throughout the earth, Jehovah’s people are receiving ample spiritual instruction and encouragement at congregation meetings, assemblies, and conventions, as well as through the publications of Jehovah’s organization.

Under the guidance of **his **

Hellisreal asks:
Cant even capitalize His? The Jehovah Almighty? Just a his will do?

holy spirit and on the basis of his Word of truth, Jehovah provides what is needed so that all of God’s people may be “fitly united in the same mind and in the same line of thought” and remain “stabilized in the faith.” (1 Cor. 1:10; Col. 2:6, 7) Surely we are grateful for Jehovah’s spiritual provisions in these last days. Thus, “the faithful and discreet slave” does not endorse any literature, meetings, or Web sites that are not produced or organized under its oversight.–Matt. 24:45-47.

So, the groups analyzing accuracy of the NWT do have oversight, but a bible reader and other bible readers that are JW do NOT have oversight?

**It is commendable for individuals to want to use their thinking ability in support of the good news. **However, no personal pursuit should detract from what Jesus Christ is accomplishing through his congregation on earth today. In the first century, the apostle Paul warned about getting involved in exhausting, time-consuming subjects, such as “genealogies, which end up in nothing, but which furnish questions for research rather than a dispensing of anything by God in connection with faith.” (1 Tim. 1:3-7) All Christians should strive to “shun foolish questionings and genealogies and strife and fights over the Law, for they are unprofitable and futile.”–Titus 3:9.

For those who wish to do extra Bible study and research, we recommend that they explore Insight on the Scriptures, “All Scripture Is Inspired of God and Beneficial,” and our other publications, such as those that discuss the prophecies found in the Bible books of Daniel, Isaiah, and Revelation. These provide abundant material for Bible study and meditation, whereby we can be “filled with the accurate knowledge of [God’s] will in all wisdom and spiritual comprehension, in order to walk worthily of Jehovah to the end of fully pleasing him as [we] go on bearing fruit in every good work and increasing in the accurate knowledge of God.”–Col. 1:9, 10.
If the group who has oversight approval, can analyze the accuracy of the NWT, why cant the WBTS tell you who they ARE?:confused:
 
Do you agree with the Apostle Paul? The GB is simply making the same point.

In the first century, the apostle Paul warned about getting involved in exhausting, time-consuming subjects, such as “genealogies, which end up in nothing, but which furnish questions for research rather than a dispensing of anything by God in connection with faith.” (1 Tim. 1:3-7) All Christians should strive to “shun foolish questionings and genealogies and strife and fights over the Law, for they are unprofitable and futile.”–Titus 3:9.
You think I am futile, yet here you are.

Afraid I will post about that topic on how only baptised members get the real stuff on another thread?:confused:
 
Afraid? Not hardly…

Actually, I’m more bewildered at how you think and what you want to argue about…

I think I will leave you to argue with someone else.

Peace,

Steve
 
JW’s view the NWT as the most accurate translation available.
Hey BS(I mean BibleSteve)

Are you are JW? Is it true that Russ T wrote in 1903 that Jesus was born in 1874? Then he changed the date (in 1920) to 1914?

And why did he make those specific predictions about the end of the world? Aren’t we supposed to be dead now??

Inquiring minds want to know

Robert
 
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