Participation in invalid marriage

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sixofseven

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I’ll cut to the chase - I’m a weak Catholic. Strong in my faith but very weak in witnessing to others for fear of offending.

I married a non-catholic (well, a ‘should-be-Catholic).
His sister is getting “married” to a baptised Catholic in a ceremony officiated by a Baptist Minister. His first attempt at marriage was invalid (civil ceremony) and he has received a civil divorce. I would describe him as very poorly catechised with little-to-no knowledge of Catholic teaching. I am the only Catholic in the family of in-laws but my FIL was Catholic.

I have quietly maintained some distance in providing support and have only somewhat voiced my concerns to my father-in-law (ex-Catholic). I have, however felt obliged to attend engagement party, bachelorette party etc due to familial relationship. I layed very low.

My sister-in-law has asked me to help her get ready on the day, and has asked for my participation in the ceremony to read from Scripture.

I find no official church teaching but a range of commentary from having no part in the ceremony at all and not inviting the couple to our home in the future etc to attending the wedding and charitably voicing the truth.

I have not answered her request. Would it be acceptable to say ‘yes I will read from Scripture if you listen to what I have to say about marriage in the Catholic Church?’

My priest told me I could still attend weddings that are objectionable, that is I can still attend if I have voiced my objections - ie I have done my part in speaking the truth and am released from responsibility for their actions.

I am not so much concerned for my relationship with my SIL as I am for my own marriage.

Do I attend? Do I participate? How can I explain to ears that have no understanding?
 
You’re not finding an official yes or no answer because it’s a matter of prudential judgment. In the end your best answer might be yes or it might b be no, but no one can make it quite that simple for you.

First, how do you feel about participating? When you look back on this question in the future, will you look back with with regrets? What outcomes can you see coming if you participate? What will happen if you don’t? Do you think either of these decisions will help or hurt your marriage? Your relationship with other family members? Do you have much influence to help these people return to the practice of their faith? And if you do, are you more likely tho move them by standing firm and setting the example of saying no, or by being part of their ceremony so they see your example of being loving and accepting? Have you spoken with your husband about this?
 
I would attend, help her “get ready” hair, makeup, etc. Serve punch and help clean up after the party.

I’d not read from Scripture. Say “I prefer to simply help behind the scenes.”
 
Thank you. I haven’t spoken to my husband about it. He would be very upset and would probably accuse me of being ‘high and mighty’, ‘holier than thou’ etc.

Well I would love to be involved but the feeling of uneasiness is probably greater.

Knowing the truth I find burdensome. I’m always the kill-joy!
 
I’d participate. Full on.

And I’ll tell you why.

2 reasons.

Family is more important than religious differences. You want to make a permanent divide? Go and tell someone you think their way of chasing God is inferior to yours. So inferior in fact that you won’t even accept that what they’re doing on Sunday is “going to Church.”

Nah. Tell them it’s just a pretend version of what you’re doing for real. See how many hearts you change over in the fire of your love with that sort of speech. See how many people see you and remember the love of Christianity complete.

No.

2nd reason is humility. We’re called to be humble witnesses. You can’t do this if you’re now cut off from all family circles because no one trusts you, loves you, wants you, or feels pre-judged in your nearby.

So please just do what’s asked? And never mind thinking too much purpose into it.

You’ve been invited to play a strong part. So just do the best at it that you can. Show what true Christian love means.

Peace.
 
You are saying, if I understand you, that you are uncomfortable because your sister in law and her fiancé aren’t getting married in the Catholic church. The SIL may be Baptist, since they are planning to get married by a Baptist minister.
They could actually request the Church’s permission to get married by a minister. I think he just needs to ask his diocese.

You might consider mentioning it to the fiancé, if you speak to him.
But otherwise, I agree with Trident. If the two are poorly catechized (and she’s received no Catholic instruction at all) then it’s seems unfair to keep your distance from them because you know how they should do things and they don’t. How will they learn if Catholics avoid them?

I suggest that you go to the wedding, support the bride, read something inspiring from the Bible about the love of Christ for the church being reflected in human marriage, and wish them the best. Leave room for the Holy Spirit to work in their lives.
 
If she was marrying another non-Catholic I would have absolutely no problem. Catholics however are bound to Catholic Church teachings and canon law.

Jesus actually frequently said that he would come between family members, God comes first, always.

I spoke to my priest again, he felt I was doing a lot to help them prepare and under the circumstances I should not participate in the ceremony. They are also approaching marriage with as much knowledge as they have and their intentions are good. All in love and charity.

He highlighted that just as a priest is allowed to attend other Christian services/ceremonies, he is not allowed to participate in them. There is no ‘rule’ for lay people but we maybe use the priestly rule as a moral guideline.

I should also add, they are using an old Catholic Church for the ceremony - it hasn’t been decommissioned so I’m also uncomfortable with that.

I have responded that my conscience won’t allow me to participate in the ceremony but I am there to help in other ways, that I love them and am praying for them.
 
sixofseven said:
He highlighted that just as a priest is allowed to attend other Christian services/ceremonies, he is not allowed to participate in them. There is no ‘rule’ for lay people but we maybe use the priestly rule as a moral guideline.
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Just throwing this out there…this is the first time that I’ve heard this. I’ve always heard that if the marriage is valid, Catholics can participate.

My wife (Catholic) has participated in (at least) two non-Catholic weddings. One of the weddings was a Lutheran ceremony between a Catholic and Lutheran. We didn’t check to see if it was valid…it was family so we were in.
 
If a Catholic marries outside the Catholic Rite, it is not valid- that is why I don’t want to participate.

He wouldn’t have the knowledge to think to ask for a dispensation to marry outside of canonical form.
 
sixofseven said:
I should also add, they are using an old Catholic Church for the ceremony - it hasn’t been decommissioned so I’m also uncomfortable with that.
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Define “decommissioned”. If this building is still consecrated as a Catholic Church/Chapel, then a Catholic priest had to give permission for it to be used.
 
Im having this problem in my family now as my baptized half brother is getting married in a barn half way across the country and wants me and my family to be there and my kids to stand up as bridesmaides. I am not going for I consider going to a wedding or the party afterwards scandal. However, there is still problems because I was wishy washy at first and now my wife and kids want to go and my dad is fighting me. My advice to you is make is simple: Servant of God Fr.John Hardon, Patrick Madrid and others say we should not go to the ceremony or party of an invalid marriage. Make it clear to everyone that you will not attend (not only your own families but any known invalid marriage) and just dont go. Gently tell the people why. There may be much backlash but so what! Be kind and continue to keep people that you love in your life. Support them, love them, spend time with them. But to scandalize them and others at the wedding will not help your relationship. Hopefully they will get their situation figured out. Keep praying!
 
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LittleFlower378 said:
My advice to you is make is simple: Servant of God Fr.John Hardon, Patrick Madrid and others say we should not go to the ceremony or party of an invalid marriage.
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Isn’t it true that other priests (maybe even one on this site) have said there really isn’t a hard rule on attending the wedding (I could be wrong, but I believe it was on another thread here) and actually advise that if you really don’t feel comfortable going to the wedding that you can go to the reception?
 
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You are right, there is no rule about attending a wedding. We cannot be in the wedding party (I am too tired to look up the law on it, but, someone else will come along with that I am sure).

Fr Hardon and Mr Madrid have their opinions.

For me, I would not ruin my relationship with my brother over this.
 
I have done alot of research on this and what I came up with is this:
1)There is such thing as an invalid marriage (some people dont even believe that much)
2)No Church document tells specifically that you cannot attend, so right now, as I understand it, its not intrinsically evil so your going will depend on intention and circumstance.
3)All of Catholics agree that one should tell the person(s) his fault, and not participate in the ceremony like standing up, or being the master of ceremonies.
4)Many priests and theologians say that one should not attend at all.

My Opinion (not Church dogma)
The circumstances lead to the sin of scandall to knowingly attend a invalid marriage. It is worse when the one or both of the party is already married. To go to a wedding means celebrating something. Your just being there signifies that you agree and are congratulating the couple. People attending the wedding see this as well . Not going will bring about more of a conversion in the invalid married couple and in the people attending the invalid wedding. Would one want to purposely witness to a robbery, or some other grave sin? Then why would it be ok to witness to a couple that is committing to a life of fornication or adultery? Marriage today is in trouble, and I believe this is one of the reasons why, we dont value it enough.
 
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LittleFlower378 said:
1)There is such thing as an invalid marriage
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Don’t disagree (from your Catholic perspective)
LittleFlower378 said:
2)No Church document tells specifically that you cannot attend, so right now, as I understand it, its not intrinsically evil so your going will depend on intention and circumstance.
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Yep, and personally (if I were Catholic) I wouldn’t need to go any further than this.
LittleFlower378 said:
3)All of Catholics agree that one should tell the person(s) his fault, and not participate in the ceremony like standing up, or being the master of ceremonies.
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Don’t disagree (from your Catholic perspective), although I know some (many?) Catholics who would…I’m fairly confident I was in a wedding with them… I don’t think anyone thought once about sitting out their sister’s wedding.
LittleFlower378 said:
4)Many priests and theologians say that one should not attend at all.
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It sounds like many priests also say it’s fine.
LittleFlower378 said:
My Opinion (not Church dogma)
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Like you say, it’s opinion. If it’s worth possibly ruining (if not losing) a relationship over wedding attendance, then that’s your call. Personally I’m with TheLittleLady and wouldn’t face the potential of throwing out a family relationship over it, especially when there are mixed opinions on it and there’s no rule against it… I’m sure YMMV.
 
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LittleFlower378 said:
3)All of Catholics agree that one should tell the person(s) his fault, and not participate in the ceremony like standing up, or being the master of ceremonies.
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Not “All of Catholics” because I am Catholic and I disagree, I know others who disagree.
 
LittleFlower378 said:
2)No Church document tells specifically that you cannot attend, so right now, as I understand it, its not intrinsically evil so your going will depend on intention and circumstance.
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Actually, one of the print editions of the old Baltimore Catechism (I don’t think it is available online) stated that one could not attend weddings of Catholics being married by protestant ministers (this may include all invalid weddings), nor even give gifts.
 
Yes, it did. That Catechism was written for those under the auspices of the Bishop of Baltimore in the year 1885. It was used in many US Dioceses until the early 1960s.

There have been many changes to practice (attending weddings is practice, not doctrine) and the second Codex Juris Canonici in history for the Catholics of the Latin rite was promulgated by Pope John Paul II on January 25, 1983.
 
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