The Fullness of the Catholic Faith

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TerryPaul

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Hello,

I’d like to study our faith better and wonder what components make up the Catholic faith?

I have heard that the Catholic faith is based on 1) Bible 2) Tradition & 3) Magisterial

Is this accurate? So is this the fullness of the Catholic Faith?

Thanks,
Terry
 
The sacrements. The apostolic priesthood, and much much more. If you really want to learn start delving into good books, read the fathers of the Church. The history of the Church, etc.
Start with the Catachism. Oh and get some father Corapi tapes 🙂 .
 
Thanks, I’m doing that … is the Catholic Church built on three facets? 1) Bible 2) Tradition & 3) Magist.?

If so, I have a Bible & the Cat. of the church … is there a document(s) for Tradition?

Terry
 
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TerryPaul:
Thanks, I’m doing that … is the Catholic Church built on three facets? 1) Bible 2) Tradition & 3) Magist.?

If so, I have a Bible & the Cat. of the church … is there a document(s) for Tradition?

Terry
Magisterium is part of tradition. So it is tradition and bible.
 
Thanks for the reply! Is there someone who has audio / video commentaries on the entire Bible and what documents make up “Tradition”?

Best wishes,
Terry
 
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TerryPaul:
Thanks for the reply! Is there someone who has audio / video commentaries on the entire Bible and what documents make up “Tradition”?

Best wishes,
Terry
I don’t know about audio commentaries on the bible, but you can listen to a lot of audio files at this link.

ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/intro.asp

You can read the homilies of St. John Chrysostom, along with the writings of many other ancient Christians, on most of the New Testament at this link. Just scroll down to John Chysostom.

newadvent.org/fathers/

I really like the Homilies of St. John Chrysostom on the Gospel According to St John. St. Augustine also has a commentary on Johns gospel and his first epistle there.

You can also download some pdf files of St. Thomas’ commentaries on some of the letters of Paul at the link below.

aquinas.avemaria.edu/Commentaries.asp
 
The beginning of the Catechism of the Catholic Church explains it best.

Jesus is the source of everything. These teachings of Jesus are handed down as the Catholic faith. Scripture is salvation history and is used as a witness to the teachings and to illuminate the teachings of the Church, not the original source. I will use this method to summarize what the Catechism teaches.

First
In summary, Jesus is the source of the Catholic faith.
In Jesus, God revealed all. Jesus is the fulness of revelation.
The Catechism teaches:
“God has said everything in his Word . “In many and various ways God spoke of old to our fathers by the prophets, but in these last days he has spoken to us by a Son.” Christ, the Son of God made man, is the Father’s one, perfect and unsurpassable Word. In him he has said everything; there will be no other word than this one.”
Jesus has made known all to his apostles
“for all that I have heard from my Father I have
made known to you.” John 15:15

This revelation that Jesus has communicated to His apostles is called the Gospel, the good news.
The Catechism teaches:

" This Gospel was to be the source of all saving truth and moral discipline."

How did the apostles proclaim this Gospel? For example, when John went to preach in a new city, and a pagan heard something about Jesus, what did John tell him when he asked him, “tell me about this Jesus who you are proclaiming”

Did John start off by reading from the four Gospels? Did John tell the pagan,
2 Abraham was the father of Isaac,
and Isaac the father of Jacob, and
Jacob the father of Judah and his
brothers,
3 and Judah the father of Perez and
Zerah by Tamar, and Perez the father
of Hezron, and Hezron the father of
Ram,
etc.?

Of course not.

Did John answer by reading
“In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God, and the
Word was God.
2 He was in the beginning with God;
3 all things were made through him,
and without him was not anything made
that was made.
4 In him was life, and the life was
the light of men.”
?
Of course not.

It is obvious that the apostles did not proclaim the Gospel by reading the Gospels, or even by selecting quotes from the Gospels.

Now, what exactly did the apostles teach? The Gospel they preached and taught is written nowhere. The bible does not have a single book summarizing what they taught, nor a single chapter summarizing the Gospel they learned from Jesus and the Holy Spirit, which they taught. Since we have no books, how do we know what they taught? Well even an atheist can learn this info. All he has to do is learn what the early Christians, the early Church Fathers said they learned from the apostles. And as anyone can learn, these early Christians learned the same teachings that we teach today as the Catholic faith. They all worshipped in the mass, they all believed in the Eucharist, the sacraments, etc.
Thus, the Gospel that the apostles taught was the whole Catholic faith. And how did John teach this Gospel?
John had to teach it in a systematic way, in an organized way, so the the lister could learn it.
 
We know the apostles taught the Gospel by first telling the pagan that Jesus is the Son of God who came to free us from everything that oppresses us, especially sin and the evil one, and that He came to give us the right to be in heaven with Him.

Of course, next the pagan would ask about the Father, if Jesus is the Son, and if there are two Gods, etc. Thus, John would have to explain the Trinity. If the pagan was still interested, John would have to tell salvation history, how God created the world, man sinned, God promised a redeemer, God chose Abraham, the history of the chose people, etc. If the pagan was still interested, then John would explain each articles of the Creed, which teaches the main truths of the faith. Then he would teach about the sacraments, which is how we received the salvation Jesus merited. Then he would teach the commandments, which we need to live to enter heaven. And he would teach prayer, how we communicated with God.
That is why catechisms are arranged in the form of the Creed, Sacraments, Commandments and prayer. The catechisms simply present a summary of the same Gospel the apostles taught. The catechisms proclaim the Gospel, as the Popes say.
But don’t the catechisms proclaim the Catholic Faith? Of course, because the Gospel the apostles proclaimed was the Catholic Faith. Where do you think the Catholic faith came from ?

Thus, the Catholic faith comes from the apostles. It does not come from the bible. It does not come from subsequent Popes, bishops, theologians, etc. It comes from the apostles. It is simply the Gospel they taught and preached. Thus, the entire Gospel is handed down in Sacred Tradition. That is, the entire Gospel was taught and preached and handed down to each generation, total and complete in Tradition. That is how it comes to us today. Catechims are simply a summary of the Gospel the apostles tautht and preached. Later, some of the elements of Tradition were written in the Gospels, which are the narratives of the life of Jesus. But, since they are in the form of salvation history, and incomplete, it is impossible to learn the Gospel that was handed down in Tradition by reading scripture.
To learn the basic Gospel the apostles handed down, (the Caholic faith), you can study a approved basic catechism such as the baltimore Catechism # 2, and later the Roman Catechism and the new Catholic Catechism. But you also need to be taught, such as in RCIA, if it is a good RCIA program.
 
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TerryPaul:
Thanks, I’m doing that … is the Catholic Church built on three facets? 1) Bible 2) Tradition & 3) Magist.?

If so, I have a Bible & the Cat. of the church … is there a document(s) for Tradition?

Terry
If you have a Catechism, I’d read the section of Sacred Tradition. If you want more, I’d recommend Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma by Dr. Ludwig Ott.

This may be of some help, too:

…Of course one must differentiate between Tradition (upper-case “T”) that is part of divine Revelation, on the one hand, and, on the other hand, Church traditions (lower-case “t”) that, although good, have developed in the Church later and are not part of the Deposit of Faith. An example of something that is part of Tradition would be infant Baptism; an example of a Church tradition would be the Church’s calendar of feast days of Saints. Anything that is part of Tradition is of divine origin and hence unchangeable, while Church traditions are changeable by the Church. Sacred Tradition serves as a rule of faith by showing what the Church has believed consistently through the centuries and how it is always understood any given portion of the Bible. One of the main ways in which Tradition has been passed down to us is in the doctrine contained in the ancient texts of the liturgy, the Church’s public worship.

source: geocities.com/thecatholicconvert/solascriptura21.html
 
The fullness of the Catholic Faith is found in following Jesus. Jesus came to preach the good news of God’s kingdom - by word and example. We achieve the fullness of our faith by following that word and example. The sacraments and tradition of the Church are part of it but the most essential part is seeking God’s kingdom in all aspects of our lives.

Peace

Jim
 
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trogiah:
The fullness of the Catholic Faith is found in following Jesus. Jesus came to preach the good news of God’s kingdom - by word and example. We achieve the fullness of our faith by following that word and example. The sacraments and tradition of the Church are part of it but the most essential part is seeking God’s kingdom in all aspects of our lives.
Jim
But how can we know what God’s kingdom is if we don’t know the Gospel that Jesus handed down?.
Jesus gave us the Gospel in order to know how to follow Him.
This Gospel that Jesus gave to His apostles and that they handed down is the Catholic faith.

Where do you think the sacraments came from? They came from Jesus, who taught them to His apostles, who handed them down to their successors, till today. They were given to us in order to give us the grace to follow Jesus and His teachings. They came from the apostles, who learned from Jesus. Thus, they are part of the Gospel the apostles taught and preached. They are part of the Gospel that Jesus preached.

Since Jesus is the fulfillment of everything, then His Gospel is the “source of all saving truth and moral discipline” as the Catechism teaches. This Gospel they taught is the entire Catholic Faith. Our Catholic faith comes to us from the apostles. The Gospel is NOT only the words and deeds of Jesus as written in the bible.
This is the false heresy spread by Catholic theologians and scholars.
The Church teaches that Gospel is everything Jesus taught to His apostles. Through Sacred Tradition the apostles handed this everything down to their successors as the Catholic faith. The catechisms summarize the teachings of the Catholic faith, thus the teachings of the Gospel.
The ONLY way to learn the Gospel is to be taught is to teach the Catholic faith. The teachers MUST teach the faith, the Gospel, in an organized and systematic way, just as the apostles did. Thus, the Catechism is a “sure norm for teaching the faith” as Pope JP II teaches, and thus as the Church teaches.

Scripture is salvation history. The four gospels are the four narratives of the life of Jesus. As part of salvation history they contain some of parts of the teachings of Jesus, in the form of a historical context. Wheras ALL the teachings of Jesus are handed down in Tradition, only some of these teachings are contained in scripture, and they are not present in an explicit form. That is why all scripture must be interpreted according to the teachings in Sacred Tradition
 
Thus, without scripture the Church would have the same exact teachings, since the entire Gospel is handed down in Tradition, that is in the teaching, practice and life of the Church. But we use scripture as a “witness” to the teachings of the Church. We use scripture to “illuminate” the teachings of the Church. Scripture is not the source of the Gospel, thus it is not the source of the Catholic faith. But, since it does contain some of the teachings of the Gospel, we use it as a witness to the teachings of the Gospel that the Church hands down.

Since the scriptures are in the form of salvation history, and since they don’t explain themselves, nor do they teach by themselves, nor do they contain all teachings, there is no way anyone can learn the Gospel by reading scripture. “No one can proclaim the Gospel to himself”, as the Church teaches. The Gospel can only be learned by learning it through the Church. Every Christian in the New Testament learned the Gospel, the Catholic Faith, through the Church.
Protestants try to learn the Gospel throught the bible, but there is not single book of the bible, nor a single chapter in the bible that claims to be a summary of the Gospel the apostles handed down. Since this Gospel the apostles taught and preached is NOT summarized in any book of the bible the real reason Protestants have over 35,000 different Gospels is that they cannot learn this Gospel by studing the bible. It isn’t summarized anywhere in the bible. The Catholic Faith alone is that Gospel the apostles taught and preached. The only way this Gospel can be handed down is by living the Catholic faith and by professing the Catholic faith. That is why the Catechism says the laity are to hand it down “by professing the faith, by living it in fraternal sharing, and by celebrating it in liturgy and prayer.”

Since the Catechism is a summary of the teachings of the Church, it is a summary of the teachings of the Gospel.

Notice what the Church teaches:
Directory for Catechesis
131 In local catechisms, the Church communicates the Gospel in a manner accessible to the human person so that it may be really perceived as the “Good News” of salvation.

In other words, by learning the basic Baltimore Catechism, “a local catechism” Catholics were learning the basic fundamental teachings of the Gospel. Those who rejected the basic Baltimore Catechism, like Raymond Brown, were rejecting the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

105 Catechesis is nothing other than the process of transmitting the Gospel, as the Christian community has received it, understands it, celebrates it, lives it and communicates it in many ways.

Most people think that Catechesis is ONLY the transmitting of the Catholic faith. They don’t realize the Catholic faith IS the Gospel the apostles handed down. Thus Catechesis is
"nothing other than the process of transmitting the Gospel."
 
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dcdurel:
The Gospel is NOT only the words and deeds of Jesus as written in the bible.
I don’t believe I stated that Jesus is only found in Scripture. I do believe it is a very good source of knowledge of Jesus. Important Church scholars have stated repeatedly that “ignorance of Scriptures is ignorance of Christ.”

Jesus is also found in the celebration of the Mass and in the other sacraments.

Jesus is also found in the hungry, lonely, and otherwise needy.

Jesus is also found in prayer on a deserted mountain top.

We achieve the fullness of the Catholic Faith when we look for and find Jesus in all those places. If we were to only look for Jesus in the teachings of Church officials we would fall short of the fullness of the Catholic Faith. In the end we must hear God’s voice if we would truly have a share of God’s kingdom. There is no church official that can follow us around and tell us what to do in each and every aspect of our lives. Only God can do that and such a relationship with God is what we are called to.

-Jim
 
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dcdurel:
. But we use scripture as a “witness” to the teachings of the Church. We use scripture to “illuminate” the teachings of the Church.
I have to say that this seems to be turned around. My understanding is that the Apostles and the Church are called to be witnesses, not to be witnessed to.

-Jim
 
ok so if I wanted to give someone a crash course in the overall picture of the Catholic Faith, I could hand them a Catechism and they could get a good overview? Correct?

Terry
 
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TerryPaul:
ok so if I want to give someone a crash course in the overall picture of the Catholic Faith, I hand them a Catechism and they could get a good overview? Correct?

Terry
I would first give them a little booklet called Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth available here catholic.com/library/Pillar.asp

In NZ we have the Catholic Enquiry Centre which sends out literature designed to give non-Cs a ‘crash course’, do you have something similar?
 
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TerryPaul:
Hello,

I’d like to study our faith better and wonder what components make up the Catholic faith?

I have heard that the Catholic faith is based on 1) Bible 2) Tradition & 3) Magisterial

Is this accurate? So is this the fullness of the Catholic Faith?

Thanks,
Terry
the fullness of the Catholic faith is the person of Jesus Christ, second Person of the Blessed Trinity, son of the God, the Father almighty who created heaven and earth, God from God, Light from Light, Jesus who was incaranate in the womb of Mary, ever virgin, through the power of the Holy Spirit, third Person of the Blessed Trinity, Jesus who was born of the virgin Mary, suffered, was crucified died and was buried, and rose again in fulfillment of the Scriptures. He ascended into heaven, and is seated at the right hand of the God the Father almighty, from whence he shall come to judge the living and the dead. Because of Jesus Christ we know of the Holy Spirit, we know the meaning of those Scriptures, we have the communion of the saints, the one, holy, Catholic, and aposolic Church, and we believe in the resurrection of the body.

This faith is revealed by God, preserved and transmitted through Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition, and handed on and interpreted free from error by the Catholic Church, founded by Jesus and guided and protected by the Holy Spirit for this purpose.

the summary of this faith is concisely and precisely stated in the Nicene Creed. all else, the sacramental economy of the Church, the dogma, the teaching, the liturgical and prayer activity of the Church all illuminate, explain, transmit, and respond to this revelation and honor and worship the Source and Fullness of this Revelation, the completion, fulfillment and good news of which is contained in the Gospels.
 
I just started this program.Its a free home study,although they do ask for a donation.Great books,I started with the survey of the Cathoilic Faith and it has lots of info.

Frank

amm.org/chss.htm
 
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