Why can't Lutherans accept the Eucharist as a RC mass?

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GKC said:
Keep us advised on that. Until then, you’ll … what?

Follow the RCC rules?

GKC
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I suppose you think the world about yourself and you should. But my decision about receiving the holy Eucharist is between me and God.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
I suppose you think the world about yourself and you should. But my decision about receiving the holy Eucharist is between me and God.
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We all have our understanding of what constitutes integrity.

Your approach to how you should/may/ought to/deserve to/or intensely think you are free to receive the Eucharist looks somewhat self-centered to me. Personal opinion.

You seem quite aware that you are violating the rules of the RCC in so doing, but what the heck. I won’t bring it up if you don’t. Point seems otiose, by now.

GKC
 
GKC said:
We all have our understanding of what constitutes integrity.

Your approach to how you should/may/ought to/deserve to/or intensely think you are free to receive the Eucharist looks somewhat self-centered to me. Personal opinion.

You seem quite aware that you are violating the rules of the RCC in so doing, but what the heck. I won’t bring it up if you don’t. Point seems otiose, by now.

GKC
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Since we are getting “personal”; Christianity seems like a legal contract with you. Are you an attorney? Were you raised Calvinist?

Lutherans speak of the Law and Gospel. Now I ask you, have your read some of the dozen or so Lutheran-Catholic Dialogues?
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Since we are getting “personal”; Christianity seems like a legal contract with you. Are you an attorney? Were you raised Calvinist?

Lutherans speak of the Law and Gospel. Now I ask you, have your read some of the dozen or so Lutheran-Catholic Dialogues?
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Fascinating.

GKC
 
GKC said:
Fascinating.

GKC
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It’s part and parcel of the postmodern mindset, GKC. Rational, logical discourse is impossible. Any attempt to raise valid objections to an argument is seen as a personal attack and requires the most violent, obtuse reactions on the opinion being objected to.
 
Per_Crucem said:
It’s part and parcel of the postmodern mindset, GKC. Rational, logical discourse is impossible. Any attempt to raise valid objections to an argument is seen as a personal attack and requires the most violent, obtuse reactions on the opinion being objected to.
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I doubt that one would ever ask if you are an attorney, diplomacy notwithstanding.
 
Taking about Christ and living as He shows us is not often practiced by some on CAF.
 
Per_Crucem said:
It’s part and parcel of the postmodern mindset, GKC. Rational, logical discourse is impossible. Any attempt to raise valid objections to an argument is seen as a personal attack and requires the most violent, obtuse reactions on the opinion being objected to.
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And a personal attack on a personal entitlement, as self defined.

The thread is good only for post padding at this point. I’m not interested in that.

GKC
 
EvangelCatholic said:
But my decision about receiving the holy Eucharist is between me and God.
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:hmmm: So then do you believe that, if I were to approach an Orthodox priest for communion, he would have no right to deny me? (Note that, depending on your experience base, that could be a rhetorical question or a non-rhetorical question. If the latter, I’m sure there are plenty of Orthodox only too happy to tell you the Orthodox view of intercommunion with Catholics.)

If it isn’t a problem for Orthodox to disallow intercommunion with Rome, then why is it a problem for Rome to disallow intercommunion with protestants?
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Right now the Lutheran-Catholic Commission on Unity is suggesting that Lutherans could receive holy Communion in a Catholic Church just as Orthodox Christians are afforded. The 2017 Commemoration of the Reformation may be the occasion; at least the Lutheran World Federation is hoping so. Popes John Paul 23 and Benedict certainly voiced encouragement for intercommunion. Now we wait for Francis to decide.
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My sense is that Pope Benedict was encouraging continued dialogue, not eucharistic hospitality at this time. From his homily at the Lutheran Church in Rome in 2010:
“…we hear many complaints about the fact that there are no longer any new developments in ecumenism. Yet we can say with gratitude that there are many elements that unite us”.
“We must not content ourselves with the successes of ecumenism over recent years, because we still cannot drink from the same chalice or gather together around the same altar” “This cannot but make us sad because it is a situation of sin; and yet unity cannot be achieved by men. We must entrust ourselves to the Lord, because He is the only one Who can give us unity. Let us hope that He brings us to that goal”.
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Jon
 
Peter_J said:
:hmmm: So then do you believe that, if I were to approach an Orthodox priest for communion, he would have no right to deny me? (Note that, depending on your experience base, that could be a rhetorical question or a non-rhetorical question. If the latter, I’m sure there are plenty of Orthodox only too happy to tell you the Orthodox view of intercommunion with Catholics.)

If it isn’t a problem for Orthodox to disallow intercommunion with Rome, then why is it a problem for Rome to disallow intercommunion with protestants?
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My perspective is that the invitation by the priest, coupled with serious recommendations of the Dialogue, open the door. Because behind the ‘door’ is the Real Presence.

Recently read about relationships between Catholics and Lutherans starting with Vatican ll and, all the more, understand why blessed John XXlll even has a holy day on the Lutheran calendar. Also read about Lutheran archbishops meeting at the Vatican on special saints days: St Henry and St Brigitta. A chapel is designated to these saints where the Pope and Lutherans honor the patron saints of Finland and Sweden.
 
JonNC said:
My sense is that Pope Benedict was encouraging continued dialogue, not eucharistic hospitality at this time. From his homily at the Lutheran Church in Rome in 2010:

Jon
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Agree, however the ecumenical progress between Catholics and Lutherans is unprecedented. I’m reading the chronology of the Dialogue by a Catholic priest who served on the many panels. All the popes following John XXlll were closely involved in the Dialogues especially John Paul ll and Benedict.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Agree, however the ecumenical progress between Catholics and Lutherans is unprecedented. I’m reading the chronology of the Dialogue by a Catholic priest who served on the many panels. All the popes following John XXlll were closely involved in the Dialogues especially John Paul ll and Benedict.
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Still… a dialogue is just that, a dialogue.
 
Something to remember is we RECEIVE communion, we just don’t march into churches and TAKE communion without regard to their Holy Communion Practices.

Mary.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Agree, however the ecumenical progress between Catholics and Lutherans is unprecedented. I’m reading the chronology of the Dialogue by a Catholic priest who served on the many panels. All the popes following John XXlll were closely involved in the Dialogues especially John Paul ll and Benedict.
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I agree. The last 60 years have been remarkable. And we have this series of popes from John XXIII on to thank of that.
Still, however, we must be aware that we are not yet in unity, and we need to be patient, not pushing unity before doctrine catches up. Further, I think the push back you have received here is more related to getting the cart before the horse. Until the Magisterium
(and our individual synods’ leaderships) agrees to Eucharistic hospitality, we should always assume that the request that we not receive is still in place, and in Christian love and charity, honor that request.
While in the historic Church, it was Baptism that made one eligible to receive the Eucharist, that was before the divisions that exist now. We must solve those divisions before we can return to that paradigm. Pray the day comes soon.

Jon
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Agree, however the ecumenical progress between Catholics and Lutherans is unprecedented. I’m reading the chronology of the Dialogue by a Catholic priest who served on the many panels. All the popes following John XXlll were closely involved in the Dialogues especially John Paul ll and Benedict.
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I think this assessment is slightly skewed. I know we hear a lot (particularly on this forum) of Catholics complaining about how “unecumenical” (which might be better called “ecumenically conservative”) the Orthodox are, but that should not lead to overly negative assessments of Catholic-Orthodox dialogue. Certainly our leaders and ecumenically-minded Catholics are not all given to such complaining, and indeed among them there is generally a great deal of respect for the Orthodox being “ecumenically conservative”.

Anyhow, I’m not trying to change the subject, just making the point that I wouldn’t call the ecumenical progress between Catholics and Lutherans “unprecedented”.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
My perspective is that the invitation by the priest, coupled with serious recommendations of the Dialogue, open the door. Because behind the ‘door’ is the Real Presence.

Recently read about relationships between Catholics and Lutherans starting with Vatican ll and, all the more, understand why blessed John XXlll even has a holy day on the Lutheran calendar. Also read about Lutheran archbishops meeting at the Vatican on special saints days: St Henry and St Brigitta. A chapel is designated to these saints where the Pope and Lutherans honor the patron saints of Finland and Sweden.
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Alright. The highlighted is something I didn’t get at all from your previous remark:
EvangelCatholic said:
But my decision about receiving the holy Eucharist is between me and God.
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