“May I please speak to my Daddy?”

[JimG]

So often, in divorce, in same sex marriage, in IVF, children are the unacknowledged victims, while the adults “work out” their own issues. I found this article from The Public Discourse to be both heartrending and enlightening.

thepublicdiscourse.com/2017/03/18769/

 

[Vanny]

Thank you for sharing this. I read this article on Mercatornet. It really spoke to me as I myself am over 60, and my parents divorced when I was still in middle school. My Dad remarried shortly thereafter and I faced the same situation. I’m not going to go into detail although my parents are now deceased but suffice it to say that divorce hurts children, my siblings and I have carried around a certain amount of pain for years.
When my folks divorced in the 1960’s, divorce wasn’t nearly as common, but sad to say, it is now.
In the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s the mantra was: the kids will do fine, they aren’t happy if the parents aren’t happy- so I forgive my parents. But today, I believe we know different.

I want to make it clear that I am not speaking about abusive situations, where one spouse or the other MUST get out with the kids, or in situations where a spouse has been divorced without their consent, and must make the best of it, as our no-fault divorce laws have made it so.
This is why it is such a touchy subject.

 

[Regular_Atheist]

Thank you for sharing this. I read this article on Mercatornet. It really spoke to me as I myself am over 60, and my parents divorced when I was still in middle school. My Dad remarried shortly thereafter and I faced the same situation. I’m not going to go into detail although my parents are now deceased but suffice it to say that divorce hurts children, my siblings and I have carried around a certain amount of pain for years.
When my folks divorced in the 1960’s, divorce wasn’t nearly as common, but sad to say, it is now.
In the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s the mantra was: the kids will do fine, they aren’t happy if the parents aren’t happy- so I forgive my parents. But today, I believe we know different.

I want to make it clear that I am not speaking about abusive situations, where one spouse or the other MUST get out with the kids, or in situations where a spouse has been divorced without their consent, and must make the best of it, as our no-fault divorce laws have made it so.
This is why it is such a touchy subject.

I don’t doubt your own personal experience with divorce, but I know a person who lived in a non-abusive household as a child but said their childhood was wretched while their parents remained together, because the relationship was so toxic. Although not ideal, it was a positive thing for them and their family that their parents eventually divorced. People forcing themselves to remain together in a toxic and unhappy relationship is not always beneficial for their children.

 

[kozlosap]

I don’t doubt your own personal experience with divorce, but I know a person who lived in a non-abusive household as a child but said their childhood was wretched while their parents remained together, because the relationship was so toxic. Although not ideal, it was a positive thing for them and their family that their parents eventually divorced. People forcing themselves to remain together in a toxic and unhappy relationship is not always beneficial for their children.

Watching your parents seethe and grimace at each other for years, certainly isn’t a way to grow up. I’ve had in depth conversations with several of my students who were very relieved when their parents finally decided to split up and live separately instead of continuing to put up a “happy family” facade. In these cases there was no physical abuse, just humans who, for whatever reason, fell “out” of love. If only parents in these situations would talk with their older kids and teens, I think they would be surprised about their advise.

 

[gardenswithkids]

So often, in divorce, in same sex marriage, in IVF, children are the unacknowledged victims, while the adults “work out” their own issues. I found this article from The Public Discourse to be both heartrending and enlightening.

thepublicdiscourse.com/2017/03/18769/

“Heart rending yet enlightening” describes that article well.

Thank you for sharing it.

 

[gardenswithkids]

So often, in divorce, in same sex marriage, in IVF, children are the unacknowledged victims, while the adults “work out” their own issues. I found this article from The Public Discourse to be both heartrending and enlightening.

thepublicdiscourse.com/2017/03/18769/

“Heart rending yet enlightening” describes that article well.

Thank you for sharing it.

 

[exnihilo]

I don’t doubt your own personal experience with divorce, but I know a person who lived in a non-abusive household as a child but said their childhood was wretched while their parents remained together, because the relationship was so toxic. Although not ideal, it was a positive thing for them and their family that their parents eventually divorced. People forcing themselves to remain together in a toxic and unhappy relationship is not always beneficial for their children.

Watching your parents seethe and grimace at each other for years, certainly isn’t a way to grow up. I’ve had in depth conversations with several of my students who were very relieved when their parents finally decided to split up and live separately instead of continuing to put up a “happy family” facade. In these cases there was no physical abuse, just humans who, for whatever reason, fell “out” of love. If only parents in these situations would talk with their older kids and teens, I think they would be surprised about their advise.

My parents divorced. Prior to the divorce they fought and the home life was bad. After the divorce, surprise, they still fought. But now we had two households and dad married another woman. The toxic environment didn’t become untoxic just because they lived apart. The parents who didn’t love each other enough to work together didn’t suddenly start working together. The parents are always happier with the divorce. There may be some situations where the kids are better off, but I believe that is extremely rare. Regardless it’s not the ideal. Divorce is just giving up not fixing the problem.

 

[10gr8kids]

Watching your parents seethe and grimace at each other for years, certainly isn’t a way to grow up. I’ve had in depth conversations with several of my students who were very relieved when their parents finally decided to split up and live separately instead of continuing to put up a “happy family” facade. In these cases there was no physical abuse, just humans who, for whatever reason, fell “out” of love. If only parents in these situations would talk with their older kids and teens, I think they would be surprised about their advise.

Maybe the best advice these parents could be given is to start loving each other. Love, contrary to what most people believe, isn’t an emotion.

 

[JimG]

In the article, the writer describes problems with his son after his divorce. He concluded the boy was not at fault, but he was. After 12 years of divorce, husband and wife and children once again became a family:

"To justify remaining divorced and maintaining two households, we adults were enforcing a charade, demanding everyone else around us—especially our own children—pretend that our selfish pursuits and our inability to “work things out” were just fine. In reality, we had done nothing more than slough off our problems and dysfunction on our kids. We were alleviating our own stresses by heaping them on our children.

Wonderfully, after a dozen years, we finally dropped the pretense and are once again husband and wife, married with children. There has been a lot of healing since then, some of which has been a complete surprise. And we’ll never know what additional potential difficulties our kids have been spared."

 

[Vonsalza]

While we can always “use the 1% to damn the other 99”, I’d like to forward that the choice for most families between “warring married parents” and “happy divorced parents” is a false dichotomy.

A marriage is just like anything else - if you want it to produce fruit, you gotta work on it. This work means sacrifice.

If both spouses are willing to save the marriage despite feeling like they’re married to a jerk, then it’s savable. In my experience, this describes the overwhelming majority of faltering marriages. Yes, yes, yes, I know exceptions exist.

Get counseling. You work to get ahead at work. So work to get ahead at your marriage.

 

[57classic]

Couples in Marriage Preparation courses need to be told that the marriage is their first creation cooperating with God and so needs to be nurtured, coddled and loved just as much as any children who come along. Not only is it sad that the marriage dies while the children are home, it is just as sad that when all the children leave home, two people look at each other and think, “who is that person and why are they still here?”

 

[MarkInOregon]

I don’t doubt your own personal experience with divorce, but I know a person who lived in a non-abusive household as a child but said their childhood was wretched while their parents remained together, because the relationship was so toxic. Although not ideal, it was a positive thing for them and their family that their parents eventually divorced. People forcing themselves to remain together in a toxic and unhappy relationship is not always beneficial for their children.

Yes and I have two relatives who grew up in such a household for a good number of years and whose parents then divorced–it didn’t help them–in fact it seems to have made it worse for them. It doesn’t really seem to have helped their mother either. Neither your example or mine speak to what is best for children in general. Can we acknowledge that we adults often put ourselves–our wants and desires ahead of our spouses and our children? That we often do not have the spirit of service that we are called to have? And that this is detrimental to the well being of our children and our society?

The peace of Christ,
Mark

 

[St_Francis]

Thank you for sharing this. I read this article on Mercatornet. It really spoke to me as I myself am over 60, and my parents divorced when I was still in middle school. My Dad remarried shortly thereafter and I faced the same situation. I’m not going to go into detail although my parents are now deceased but suffice it to say that divorce hurts children, my siblings and I have carried around a certain amount of pain for years.
When my folks divorced in the 1960’s, divorce wasn’t nearly as common, but sad to say, it is now.
In the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s the mantra was: **the kids will do fine, they aren’t happy if the parents aren’t happy- **so I forgive my parents. But today, I believe we know different.

I want to make it clear that I am not speaking about abusive situations, where one spouse or the other MUST get out with the kids, or in situations where a spouse has been divorced without their consent, and must make the best of it, as our no-fault divorce laws have made it so.
This is why it is such a touchy subject.

Re the part I bolded: I remember that at the time,mall sorts of studies were coming out showing the children were fine. It wasn’t til 2 or 3 decades had passed and the once-children had grown up that problems manifested and showed up in studies.

Now we also see the problems showing up when the children are still children.

 

[Michaeljc4]

Two comments (and if you respond, please do so with charity. I am not trying to provoke a fight).

First, as a public school teacher in a city, I see the effects of divorce and fatherless families every single day. It is heartbreaking. Divorce is less common now; it is ‘my parents never got married, and I have siblings from different men’ that’s become the new norm. The social chaos these kids live in staggers the mind. Economically, socially, and spiritually, these kinds are in trouble.

Second, I have known about a dozen children of same-sex couples. These children are perfectly well-adjusted and well-cared for. The data is not available on how these kids will turn out as adults, but in my observation of children and their families (over a thousand kids at this point!) the children of same sex couples are better off than the children of divorced or never married adults.

One married gay couple that I know adopted two black children from DSS. Both children were born with drugs and alcohol in their systems, and were abandoned by their mothers in the hospital. Both children are thriving, healthy, and well-adjusted. Could that change? Absolutely, but as of now–about ten years in–these kids are doing very well.