1961 Roman Breviary - difficult?

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I’ve been praying the Divine Office (3-volume set) for a few months now and I am OK with its length and duration and I quite enjoy it. However, as I am from a Traditionalist Catholic background, I am looking to expand and try to pray the Roman Breviary, which, as I understand it, is much longer *.

I was wondering if anyone has taken turns reciting the Divine Office (or the Liturgy of the Hours - as approved for the USA) and then the Roman Breviary and if there be any quite shocking differences to look out for.

SIDE-NOTE: If I were to buy this Roman Breviary, it would be £241 ($405) so I would be looking to sell my version of the Divine Office (3 volume set) if anyone is interested. I also have the 4-volume Liturgy of the Hours Set and I can sell either/both. Also, if anyone has the Roman Breviary (Baronius Press) - baroniuspress.com/book.php?wid=56&bid=59#tab=tab-1 - and is willing to sell it for lower than £241, I would be willing to talk about it.

Thank you in advance for any answers.*
 
This site is very helpful for figuring out the divine office in the 1960 form: divinumofficium.com/cgi-bin/horas/officium.pl

It would also give you a good idea of what the hours look like so you could compare.

My understanding is that it’s the “Divine Office” regardless of whether it’s the current form (Liturgy of the Hours) or the old form (Breviary, which I actually thought referred to the book, rather than the recitation of the prayers, but I don’t know for sure).

I hope this helps.

–Jen
 
This site is very helpful for figuring out the divine office in the 1960 form: divinumofficium.com/cgi-bin/horas/officium.pl

It would also give you a good idea of what the hours look like so you could compare.

My understanding is that it’s the “Divine Office” regardless of whether it’s the current form (Liturgy of the Hours) or the old form (Breviary, which I actually thought referred to the book, rather than the recitation of the prayers, but I don’t know for sure).

I hope this helps.

–Jen
Divinumofficium is an excellent site. Complete with English translation. I would recommend you try that first before committing your money to buying an actual copy.
 
Being a “traditionalist” shouldn’t limit you to just the Breviarium Romanum. The current LOTH accomplishes the same tradition of prayer throughout the day. The Breviarium Monasticum and the little office of the blessed Virgin Mary are worth a bit of research too.
 
The 1961 Breviarium Romanum will definitely take you longer than the Liturgy of the Hours, especially if it is a Sunday. So, it can be hard if you don’t have the time.

But, go ahead and give it a shot! 👍
 
I’ve been praying the Divine Office (3-volume set) for a few months now and I am OK with its length and duration and I quite enjoy it. However, as I am from a Traditionalist Catholic background, I am looking to expand and try to pray the Roman Breviary, which, as I understand it, is much longer *.

I was wondering if anyone has taken turns reciting the Divine Office (or the Liturgy of the Hours - as approved for the USA) and then the Roman Breviary and if there be any quite shocking differences to look out for.*

By “Divine Office (3-volume set)” do you mean the 1963 bi-lingual Latin-English published by the Liturgical Press?
 
I’ve been praying the Divine Office (3-volume set) for a few months now and I am OK with its length and duration and I quite enjoy it. However, as I am from a Traditionalist Catholic background, I am looking to expand and try to pray the Roman Breviary, which, as I understand it, is much longer *.

I was wondering if anyone has taken turns reciting the Divine Office (or the Liturgy of the Hours - as approved for the USA) and then the Roman Breviary and if there be any quite shocking differences to look out for.

SIDE-NOTE: If I were to buy this Roman Breviary, it would be £241 ($405) so I would be looking to sell my version of the Divine Office (3 volume set) if anyone is interested. I also have the 4-volume Liturgy of the Hours Set and I can sell either/both. Also, if anyone has the Roman Breviary (Baronius Press) - baroniuspress.com/book.php?wid=56&bid=59#tab=tab-1* - and is willing to sell it for lower than £241, I would be willing to talk about it.

Thank you in advance for any answers.

Not the Roman Breviary, but I have alternated between the LOTH, and two post-Vatican II monastic versions of the LOTH. The first one, schema B (used by the abbey I’m associated with), is comparable in length to the 1961 Roman Breviary, in that it incorporates all 150 psalms in a week (and has long readings at Vigils); the second is the monastic schema of St. Benedict (goes back to the 6th century… now that’s tradition!). It’s 250 psalms a week.

Caveat: I chant Lauds, the mid-day Office, Vespers and Compline in Latin Gregorian chant; so that adds a fair bit of time to reciting the Office. My practice is to chant a psalm first then read it silently in French (my mother tongue, and I use Les Heures Grégoriennes which is in Latin-French).

My take is that the current LOTH is a very nice balance for laity and it has enough elements of tradition in it, that I don’t feel much discontinuity with small “t” tradition when praying it; particularly if it’s chanted in Gregorian chant. When praying the monastic versions I’d miss out on too many psalms due to having to skip offices for various reasons. The LOTH is such that although it takes 4 weeks to go through the psalter (minus the ones that were left out), I generally can get through an entire 4-week cycle without missing out on any of the “compulsory” (well, for those bound anyway) offices.

The big issue with the monastic versions is Vigils, especially on feast days when there’s a third nocturne. It can take close to an hour. I just don’t have that kind of time in the morning (or even the previous evening… I do have a life 😛 )

Doing it the way I do with the LOTH, “Vigils” (Office of Readings) takes 15 minutes at about 6:30 am; Lauds and Vespers about 20 minutes (7:30 am and 5 pm respectively), and mid-day (noon) and Compline (8:15 pm) just a hair over 10 minutes each. Terce and None I do optionally if I have time. The monastic added about 15 minutes for Vigils on ordinary days, and about 5 minutes for Lauds and Vespers (Compline is a bit shorter, as the Monastic is done without antiphon, no responsory and no Gospel canticle), with two additional minor hours (about 10 min. each). I do use Monastic Schema B from time to time to be in prayer union with the monks of my abbey.

My big beef with the 1961 Breviary is that it really isn’t all that traditional (dates only to 1910 and has many breaks with 1400 years of tradition up to that point); the LOTH has plenty of “traditional” elements in it if not for spreading the psalter over 4 weeks, and it lends itself very well to chanting. The only thing I don’t like about it: the NT canticles at Vespers, the questionable location of some psalms, the omission of cursing psalms and verses (at least Les Heures includes them), and relegating psalms 77, 104 and 105 to certain times of the year. But then no breviary is perfect. But it is the official liturgical prayer of the Church and the liturgy used by the vast majority of Catholics who pray the Office. One thing I don’t like about pre-Vatican II breviaries is that there are simply way too many feasts so that one loses the sense of regularity and orderliness that ferias of ordinary time can bring. A feast loses its meaning if almost every day is a feast and the ferias are the occasional days. As our prior says “I have a very great devotion to Saint Feria!”.

What I find is absolutely essential to praying the LOTH is to have balance in your prayer life. It shouldn’t be an excessive chore, and it should leave room in your life for other devotions such as lectio divina or charity work. It’s especially important that it doesn’t interfere with family obligations.
 
By “Divine Office (3-volume set)” do you mean the 1963 bi-lingual Latin-English published by the Liturgical Press?
No I think he means the British version of the LOTH. Their’s is in 3 volumes and is called “Divine Office”.
 
By “Divine Office (3-volume set)” do you mean the 1963 bi-lingual Latin-English published by the Liturgical Press?
No the Collins-published all-English 1974 Divine Office approved for England and Wales
 
Not the Roman Breviary, but I have alternated between the LOTH, and two post-Vatican II monastic versions of the LOTH. The first one, schema B (used by the abbey I’m associated with), is comparable in length to the 1961 Roman Breviary, in that it incorporates all 150 psalms in a week (and has long readings at Vigils); the second is the monastic schema of St. Benedict (goes back to the 6th century… now that’s tradition!). It’s 250 psalms a week.

Caveat: I chant Lauds, the mid-day Office, Vespers and Compline in Latin Gregorian chant; so that adds a fair bit of time to reciting the Office. My practice is to chant a psalm first then read it silently in French (my mother tongue, and I use Les Heures Grégoriennes which is in Latin-French).

My take is that the current LOTH is a very nice balance for laity and it has enough elements of tradition in it, that I don’t feel much discontinuity with small “t” tradition when praying it; particularly if it’s chanted in Gregorian chant. When praying the monastic versions I’d miss out on too many psalms due to having to skip offices for various reasons. The LOTH is such that although it takes 4 weeks to go through the psalter (minus the ones that were left out), I generally can get through an entire 4-week cycle without missing out on any of the “compulsory” (well, for those bound anyway) offices.

The big issue with the monastic versions is Vigils, especially on feast days when there’s a third nocturne. It can take close to an hour. I just don’t have that kind of time in the morning (or even the previous evening… I do have a life 😛 )

Doing it the way I do with the LOTH, “Vigils” (Office of Readings) takes 15 minutes at about 6:30 am; Lauds and Vespers about 20 minutes (7:30 am and 5 pm respectively), and mid-day (noon) and Compline (8:15 pm) just a hair over 10 minutes each. Terce and None I do optionally if I have time. The monastic added about 15 minutes for Vigils on ordinary days, and about 5 minutes for Lauds and Vespers (Compline is a bit shorter, as the Monastic is done without antiphon, no responsory and no Gospel canticle), with two additional minor hours (about 10 min. each). I do use Monastic Schema B from time to time to be in prayer union with the monks of my abbey.

My big beef with the 1961 Breviary is that it really isn’t all that traditional (dates only to 1910 and has many breaks with 1400 years of tradition up to that point); the LOTH has plenty of “traditional” elements in it if not for spreading the psalter over 4 weeks, and it lends itself very well to chanting. The only thing I don’t like about it: the NT canticles at Vespers, the questionable location of some psalms, the omission of cursing psalms and verses (at least Les Heures includes them), and relegating psalms 77, 104 and 105 to certain times of the year. But then no breviary is perfect. But it is the official liturgical prayer of the Church and the liturgy used by the vast majority of Catholics who pray the Office. One thing I don’t like about pre-Vatican II breviaries is that there are simply way too many feasts so that one loses the sense of regularity and orderliness that ferias of ordinary time can bring. A feast loses its meaning if almost every day is a feast and the ferias are the occasional days. As our prior says “I have a very great devotion to Saint Feria!”.

What I find is absolutely essential to praying the LOTH is to have balance in your prayer life. It shouldn’t be an excessive chore, and it should leave room in your life for other devotions such as lectio divina or charity work. It’s especially important that it doesn’t interfere with family obligations.
This is very detailed; thanks a lot.
In the morning, I wake up at 6am and have until 6:20 to say morning prayer (Lauds?). Do you think I would be able to celebrate the Lauds in that time if modern LOTH takes 15 mins?
No I think he means the British version of the LOTH. Their’s is in 3 volumes and is called “Divine Office”.
Yes. This is to what I was referring. Thank you 🙂
 
I’ve been praying the Divine Office (3-volume set) for a few months now and I am OK with its length and duration and I quite enjoy it. However, as I am from a Traditionalist Catholic background, I am looking to expand and try to pray the Roman Breviary, which, as I understand it, is much longer *.

I was wondering if anyone has taken turns reciting the Divine Office (or the Liturgy of the Hours - as approved for the USA) and then the Roman Breviary and if there be any quite shocking differences to look out for.

SIDE-NOTE: If I were to buy this Roman Breviary, it would be £241 ($405) so I would be looking to sell my version of the Divine Office (3 volume set) if anyone is interested. I also have the 4-volume Liturgy of the Hours Set and I can sell either/both. Also, if anyone has the Roman Breviary (Baronius Press) - baroniuspress.com/book.php?wid=56&bid=59#tab=tab-1* - and is willing to sell it for lower than £241, I would be willing to talk about it.

Thank you in advance for any answers.

I just wanted to say thank you for your thread. If you hadn’t created it, I would have probably never checked the Baronius Press site again. When their Roman Breviary originally came out I was on their e-mail wait-list, but missed my chance. I would always check their site to see if they were in stock but they never were. I had all but given up, that is until I saw this thread. Now I play the waiting game for the postman. 😃

God Bless.
 
I used to pray Lauds, Vespers and Compline from a Latin/English layman’s 1960 Roman Breviary, and it took about 30min, 30min, and 15min respectively.

I liked it a lot for the “old school” feel and because it lined up with the liturgical year of the Mass I experience (TLM). I agree with OeL that I often wished I was just praying through the weekly psalter instead of praying a feast day most days (because most feast days draw from the same psalms).

Since I got married and stopped commuting by train I no longer have the time for 80min of Office each day, I stopped. I’ve recently picked up the 1961 version of the Little Office of the BVM, and if you decide you don’t have the time for the Roman Office, this little one is very managable. Probably less than 10 minutes per major hour and just a few minutes per minor hour. It’s all repetition compared to the Roman Breviary, but I don’t mind it here so much.
 
malphono;11903926:
By “Divine Office (3-volume set)” do you mean the 1963 bi-lingual Latin-English published by the Liturgical Press?
No the Collins-published all-English 1974 Divine Office approved for England and Wales
Ah, I see. It might be worth your while to have a look for a copy of the 1963. It’s actually quite nice. 🙂
 
This is very detailed; thanks a lot.
In the morning, I wake up at 6am and have until 6:20 to say morning prayer (Lauds?). Do you think I would be able to celebrate the Lauds in that time if modern LOTH takes 15 mins?
I think Monastic Lauds can be done in 15 minutes if recited (not chanted), so the Roman Breviary should be doable in the same amount of time though it may be tight.
 
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