A Thought on the Immaculate Conception

[Kenny_Kamel]

I am a Roman/Latin Rite Catholic that has been seriously considering a transfer to the Byzantine Rite recently and I have been struggling with coming to terms with many differing beliefs between the rites. This week I have been thinking and praying about the Immaculate Conception and had a thought I felt I should share.

Whether you adhere to this Latin/Roman dogma or the Eastern view, Mary would have been conceived without sin either way. I have struggled in so many ways with the Immaculate Conception dogma for years but frankly it seems to me that in light of this thought perhaps it should not be a point of contention.

 

[TK421]

If it were a point of contention, wouldn’t it be metaphysically impossible for the Catholic Byzantine & Catholic Latin Rites to be in full communion because of the principle of non-contradiction? So it’s impossible for it to be contentious otherwise the communion would be a fiction.

What is the background issue here? I am curious.

 

[Kenny_Kamel]

From my limited understanding of Eastern Catholic beliefs, they do not believe that the act of procreation is inherently sinful. Thus none of us are conceived in sin, so both Eastern and Western Churches are unified in their belief that Mary was conceived without sin.

 

[chimo]

The issue of Mary’s immaculate conception should never be a barrier for the Churches to become united. The teaching of Mary been sinless has no bearing on the redemption and sanctity of mankind. Mary was sinless which I believe to be so but I do not proclaim it from the rooftop because it has no redemptive value as it is in the case of Her Son. Mary would like to see Her Son as the front runner in the redemptive process. The fact that Mary was sinless is incredible. Why? It is because she was only human and not divine like Her Son. Yes we can go to Mary because of all the people ever created she can lead us to her Son. The Immaculate Conception was given to Mary to prepare her for the greatest vocation ever for a person. She would be the Church in advance for Her Son. The image of the Church found in Mary is very important. If we are to be the Church for Her Son we must look to Mary who is the prime example. Mary’s sinless life points to the Church’s own glorification that we will receive after death. While the Church still sins in this life the glorification after death is too wonderful to mention. We must see this glorification in the person of Mary. Our full glorification will resemble Mary’s after death yet we can all receive a portion of that glorification now by growing in the sanctification which we can receive by growing with the acquisition of the Holy Spirit.

 

[adamhovey1988]

I am a Roman/Latin Rite Catholic that has been seriously considering a transfer to the Byzantine Rite recently and I have been struggling with coming to terms with many differing beliefs between the rites. This week I have been thinking and praying about the Immaculate Conception and had a thought I felt I should share.

Whether you adhere to this Latin/Roman dogma or the Eastern view, Mary would have been conceived without sin either way. I have struggled in so many ways with the Immaculate Conception dogma for years but frankly it seems to me that in light of this thought perhaps it should not be a point of contention.

The Immaculate Conception is a Dogma of the Church
ewtn.com/LIBRARY/PAPALDOC/P9INEFF.htm
All Catholics (Eastern included) are bound by union with the Bishop of Rome to believe it.

 

[Augustine]

The dogma of the Immaculate Conception is necessary to the Roman Church because she of the Augustinian doctrine of original sin. The Eastern Churches have no such doctrine, only that from Adam’s sin, all die (v. Rm 5:12). Both the Roman and the Eastern Churches teach that the Mother of God has never sinned, but, since the Romans posit that all are born with original sin, it was necessary to make an exception from original sin for her. On the other hand, because the Easterners make no such statement, there is no need to except the Virgin Mary from anything, rendering the dogma of the Immaculate Conception unnecessary.

The corollary of the difference in understanding of the mystery of the Mother of God is also reflected in her Assumption. To Easterners, since she never sinned, she slept (Dormition), an ambiguous term that may mean either sleep or death, making way for the possibility that the Virgin Mary has never suffered death, yet without affirming it categorically, since it is ultimately a mystery. On the other hand, the Roman Church states that she did die, though I’m not sure how much emphasis is placed on this position.

The fundamental point that unites the Roman and the Eastern Churches is that their teachings do not contradict each other, for one says the Mother of God was conceived without original sin and the other, that she never sinned.

Christos anesti!

 

[Vico]

I am a Roman/Latin Rite Catholic that has been seriously considering a transfer to the Byzantine Rite recently and I have been struggling with coming to terms with many differing beliefs between the rites. This week I have been thinking and praying about the Immaculate Conception and had a thought I felt I should share.

Whether you adhere to this Latin/Roman dogma or the Eastern view, Mary would have been conceived without sin either way. I have struggled in so many ways with the Immaculate Conception dogma for years but frankly it seems to me that in light of this thought perhaps it should not be a point of contention.

Ineffiable Deus, expressing the dogma of the Immaculate Conception, used the phrase “originalis culpa labe”, which is a portion of the result of the sin of Adam and Eve that we are born with. Infants are baptized, although sinless, for they are lacking something brought by death, true in Latin or Eastern Catholic or Orthodox theology; They need the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, as St. John Chrysostom explains:

“You have seen how numerous are the gifts of baptism. Although many men think that the only gift it confers is the remission of sins, we have counted its honors to the number of ten. It is on this account that we baptize even infants, although they are sinless, that they may be given the further gifts of sanctification, justice, filial adoption, and inheritance, that they may be brothers and members of Christ, and become dwelling places of the Spirit.”

— St. John Chrysostom, Baptismal Instruction 3:6.
Ancient Christian Writers, p. 57

books.google.com/books?id=xC9GAdUGX5sC&pg=PA581&lpg=PA581&dq=ancient+christian+baptismal+instructions&source=bl&ots=BsaK0-HWzv&sig=qzr0ByV4c89cbpTuO1pU7fxjdhI&hl=en&ei=fii_TtbJDM-1tge_75C8Bg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9&ved=0CFUQ6AEwCDgU#v=onepage&q=ancient%20christian%20baptismal%20instructions&f=false

From 3:6:
1 remission of sins
2 sanctification
3 justice
4 filial adoption
5 inheritance
6 brothers of Christ
7 members of Christ
8 dwelling places for the Holy Spirit

From 12:6:
9 purity of soul
10 kingdom of heaven