Abortion doc George Tiller gunned down at church

[stuartsfeather]

Poor analogy. The rapist you speak of in the hypotheitical is not murdered.

And it also demonstrates for us that even the most heinous of acts can be forgiven in an instant.

Agreed. It is a safe bet that were he alive today he would be doing everything just as he had last week.

It is difficult to feel compassion for this man. But we need to remember that he was a child of God. At some point, he may well have accepted God’s love and repented of the sin that abortion is.
However, this murder removes his ability to repent…forever.
And (assuming things are what they appear) God may not have the joy of being with his child…forever.

So then it seems to me that you are implying that God by allowing this killing to happen did wrong, because Tiller in your opinion had not had sufficient time to repent of his evil deeds and therefore may have been caused to be sent to hell through the actions of the killer instead of his own actions?
Do you think that God did not do justice to Tiller? Do you think that in the brief instant before his death that Tiller was not given opportunity to repent. How do you know that while he was standing around doing his usher duty just before his executioner showed up he had not had a repentance experience?
Why try to question what God allows?

 

[limerick]

Originally Posted by gertabelle
We must keep this man and his family in our prayers! May god have mercy on his soul, on and the soul of his murderer. And may we allow god to use this event to draw each of us nearer to his sacred heart.

]NOW LIMERICK POSTED THIS

Abortion is murder.

The killing of Dr. Tiller is murder.

I’ll say it again: Abortion is murder.

The killing of Dr. Tiller is murder.

And just in case you missed it, I’ll say it one more time: abortion is murder.

In case you don’t want to see the parallel, the killing of Dr. Tiller is murder.

Speaking the truth in love does not cause people to murder.

Influencing a weak mind with the presumed righteousness of a singular rigid doctrine can easily lead one to carry out a violent act under the guise of righting a “wrong”.

Speaking your opinion, however, as you have done here, as if you and you alone have complete understanding of what caused this violence and how to stop it – well, that does nothing to bring about the change you wish to see in the world.

**So just because your opinion differs from those of us who believe and follow church teaching, that hardly makes the rest of us somehow inferior to your own reasoning **

Abortion is murder.

Murder is murder, any way you cut it, whatever the instigating factor.

And as part of the practice of my faith, I will take political, personal, and prayerful actions to bring an end to these murders, your opinion notwithstanding.

NOW LIMERICK’S INQUISITION TYPE QUESTION

What actions? What will they be? Please elaborate.

Gertie (the apparently grumpy graduate student)

Limerick - not grumpy, just dismayed

END OF LIMERICK’S POST.

BEGINNING OF MY POST (STUARTSFEATHER)

Limerick, what is your game,here? You ask Gertie to elaborate on what she will do when she has already stated that she would pray, and other normal legal and sane acts/methods of ending abortion.

No game. I asked Gertie to elaborate on what action she would take -“political, personal and prayerful”, she claimed. Nothing about her reference to “political action” automatically leads me to believe her intentions are normal, legal and same. All I was interested in was a description of how far she would go to ensure that her money, resources, efforts follow her mouth. Why do you perceive this as a game? I haven’t been on CAF for long, but in the time that I have been here, reading posts, evaluating actions taken by irate posters - particularly on this subject - I have found only a few clinic protesters, people who vote, and people who pray. There is so much banter about the outrage of abortion - why is it that the Catholic voters alone in the country cannot be more effective in mobilizing their efforts to change the law? Or is it that only the most conservative of Catholics believe abortion is actually “murder” and, because they are in the minority among Catholics, it is likely that this will not happen, at least in my lifetime. This is not a judgment about conservative Catholics; you represent the Church as doctrine requires you to represent it. Nouvelle Catholics are a different breed, a product of the evolution of society. I judge neither.

Seems to me that all you are trying to do is incite people on this board to make wild threats of action. Could it be that you are nothing more than a stupe for the Godless left fringes of our society?

**Threats of action? No. I am looking for promises of action and finding a lot of talk and no follow-through. **

Face it chum as long as there are people there will be violence and violent means will be used to obtain goals of individuals as well as nations. If you ever thought otherwise then you must be living in Mayberry with Goober.

**I have long thought Dr. Tiller was in considerable danger, as I’ve been familiar with his practice for years. And what was the goal of the person who shot him? To put a face on the *pro-life movement? *** Who influenced him to act? Do you personally support this suspect’s actions as appropriate given the goal? Surely everyone who has ever mouthed a word of inflammatory pro-life rhetoric is shrinking away from that culpability. It’s a convenient time to forget that words and attitudes have power to incite, and they also have a ripple effect.

Do not think for a minute folks that there are not scumbags on this forum that will try and bait you into incriminating statements that could eventually have a jackbooted homeland security goon at your house door.

Is this a reference to me? Do you believe I’m a “scumbag”? Do you know the origin of the word “scumbag”? It’s slang for a condom. I’m not sensitive to this sort of thing, but I don’t think, CHUM, that calling a 57-year-old woman a scumbag lends you one iota of credibility. And if a “jackbooted homeland security goon” is assigned to show up at your door, it’s because you have invited him with your incendiary observations on this forum. That goon SHOULD be at your door.

Limerick

Stuartsfeather

 

[limerick]

This so called murder was just another late term abortion. It dealt with what the abortionist saw as a problem very well. It is actually a pro-choice issue if you think about it. This person just chose that abortion can be done after birth too, not only before birth. I do not know what abortion supporters are getting angry about. Whereas pro-life people of course feel this is a very very sad and horrible murder.

**Your assessment of Dr. Tiller’s murder is incomparably callous. Which side are you on? If you think his death was a “very very sad and horrible murder” then speak for yourself and not for anyone else.

This death is really having an interesting effect of pro-life people. It’s truly bringing out the absolute and undeniable worst in them.

Limerick**

 

[vz71]

So then it seems to me that you are implying that God by allowing this killing to happen did wrong, because Tiller in your opinion had not had sufficient time to repent of his evil deeds and therefore may have been caused to be sent to hell through the actions of the killer instead of his own actions?

Are you placing the responsibility of this murder on God or on the killer?
The same question posed could be placed upon the footsteps of the abortionist…
Are we that claim to be pro-life advocating God is making mistakes when he allows the killing of these innocents?

I am not going to buy into that logic. Tiller was murdered.
The murder was an act of evil.

Do you think that God did not do justice to Tiller?

God’s justice is infinite.
The justice handed out by the killer was a sham.

Do you think that in the brief instant before his death that Tiller was not given opportunity to repent.

I do not know.
Only he and God know that answer.
But I do know that were he alive, he could have repented. But now he cannot.
And we should all find that tragic.

How do you know that while he was standing around doing his usher duty just before his executioner showed up he had not had a repentance experience?

He may have, he may not have.
I did not claim to know.

Why try to question what God allows?

Why protest abortion. God allows it…right?
Evil does not get a pass because someone claims it is ‘God’s will.’
Evil must be resisted always.
There is no question here that the man was murdered. Nor is there any question at all that the murder was an evil act.
A round of condemnations as well as the standard sentence for murder is deserved here.

Of course it will be interesting to compare the actual sentence the guilty party actually receives with what a standard sentence is.

 

[vz71]

I am finding it more and more disturbing as I read through the various threads and posts concerning the murder of this man that it appears that many who claim to be pro-life are only pro-life that they like.
And not pro-life if the life is not to their liking.

 

[rpp]

I am finding it more and more disturbing as I read through the various threads and posts concerning the murder of this man that it appears that many who claim to be pro-life are only pro-life that they like.
And not pro-life if the life is not to their liking.

I am mystified how you came to this conclusion. Perhaps StuartsFeather is correct in his assessment of the motives of some posters. I have not seen anyone suggest that violence is acceptable in the pro-life movement. I have seen one person show what the logical conclusion of being pro-abortion.

The only people that I have seen trying to incite violence or an angry response are those who euphemistically describe themselves as “pro-choice”.

The murder of Dr. Tiller was an evil act, no matter what the motive really was. There is no justification for it.

 

[Chris_LaRock]

I am finding it more and more disturbing as I read through the various threads and posts concerning the murder of this man that it appears that many who claim to be pro-life are only pro-life that they like.
And not pro-life if the life is not to their liking.

The same could be said of the pro-aborts who call it progress when 53,000,000 babies are killed, but mourn over one man who simply played a role in their agenda.

Agaiun, I’m glad this monster won’t be sucking the brains out of viable babies any more. No more baptizing dead babies before putting them into an oven.

The same people who mourn for tiller are the same misguided people who mourned when saddam was hanged.

 

[mkingdomlvr]

I am finding it more and more disturbing as I read through the various threads and posts concerning the murder of this man that it appears that many who claim to be pro-life are only pro-life that they like.
And not pro-life if the life is not to their liking.

I have to say I agree. I’ll admit I’m new here as a poster, but the things I’ve read that view anything about a man’s death as a positive event bother me.

No matter what this man did, he was still a child of God. He made poor choices, but his killer robbed him of any chance to repent of them.

If we condemn those who choose to abort for taking the decision of when life begins and ends out of God’s hands and placing it in their own, then we also must condemn those who kill people outside the womb for the same reason.

 

[rpp]

I have to say I agree. I’ll admit I’m new here as a poster, but the things I’ve read that view anything about a man’s death as a positive event bother me.

No matter what this man did, he was still a child of God. He made poor choices, but his killer robbed him of any chance to repent of them.

If we condemn those who choose to abort for taking the decision of when life begins and ends out of God’s hands and placing it in their own, then we also must condemn those who kill people outside the womb for the same reason.

Please point to the posts that make you so “disturbed”. Be specific. Your credibility is on the line.

 

[stuartsfeather]

limerick:
To start with Limerick how is anyone supposed to know that you are a 57 year old woman? You, like a lot of people online, are so very opinonated and quite vocal about throwing your thoughts at other people and then you want to say Oh I am just a little old 57 year old woman how dare you cross keyboards with me. You may be a 300 lb. talking gorilla for all I know and further more I do hot give a fig what your age or gender is, you are old enought to know better. The only reason you are on this site is to spew forth your bitternes toward the Roman Catholic Church, you know it, I know it and so does anyone who has read your posts. It figures that you would welcome a society that would accept those jackbooted goons at the doors of citizens. You are quite pitiful there limerick but take heart I will still pray for you

 

[stuartsfeather]

limerick:
There you go whinning again limerick .
To start with Limerick how is anyone supposed to know that you are a 57 year old woman? You, like a lot of people online, are so very opinonated and quite vocal about throwing your thoughts at other people and then you want to say Oh I am just a little old 57 year old woman how dare you cross keyboards with me. You may be a 300 lb. talking gorilla for all I know and further more I do hot give a fig what your age or gender is, you are old enought to know better. The only reason you are on this site is to spew forth your bitternes toward the Roman Catholic Church, you know it, I know it and so does anyone who has read your posts. It figures that you would welcome a society that would accept those jackbooted goons at the doors of citizens.

T
You are quite pitiful there limerick but take heart I will still pray for you

 

[stuartsfeather]

limerick:
limerick’s statements

I have long thought Dr. Tiller was in considerable danger, as I’ve been familiar with his practice for years. And what was the goal of the person who shot him? To put a face on the pro-life movement? Who influenced him to act? Do you personally support this suspect’s actions as appropriate given the goal? Surely everyone who has ever mouthed a word of inflammatory pro-life rhetoric is shrinking away from that culpability. It’s a convenient time to forget that words and attitudes have power to incite, and they also have a ripple effect.

Do not think for a minute folks that there are not scumbags on this forum that will try and bait you into incriminating statements that could eventually have a jackbooted homeland security goon at your house door.

Is this a reference to me? Do you believe I’m a “scumbag”? Do you know the origin of the word “scumbag”? It’s slang for a condom. I’m not sensitive to this sort of thing, but I don’t think, CHUM, that calling a 57-year-old woman a scumbag lends you one iota of credibility. And if a “jackbooted homeland security goon” is assigned to show up at your door, it’s because you have invited him with your incendiary observations on this forum. That goon SHOULD be at your door.

Limerick

Oh limerick there you go whinning again. Now just how is anyone supposed to know that you are a 57 year old woman and if that is true then you are old enough to know better that to shoot your mouth off and not be able to take in return. You are just like most other mouthy self righous know it alls. You hide behind the invisibility provided you on the internet and spew forth your bile without risking a punch in the mouth. Every post you make shows just what you really are and that is a tiny little person with a big hate for the Roman Catholic church.
So you are also the last word on definitions as well. I am refering to the scumbag comment. You are welcome to your definiton that’s a new one on me though but I guess in all your 57 years of living you have the answer for everything huh?

It figures that you would want to live in a country that would have jackbooted goons at the doors of people who say things you do not like to hear. Well like grandma says sweetcakes, just jump right in the garden and take all you want, only be sure you can chew it,swallow it and keep it down. YOu are one great big joke limerick get yourself a life. And if you really are a woman get out of the house more often and try a pedicure or spa treatment it will do wonders for your mindset.

Stuartsfeather

 

[juhothenero]

**Your assessment of Dr. Tiller’s murder is incomparably callous. Which side are you on? If you think his death was a “very very sad and horrible murder” then speak for yourself and not for anyone else.

This death is really having an interesting effect of pro-life people. It’s truly bringing out the absolute and undeniable worst in them.

Limerick**

What are you getting angry about? I am on the side that says it was murder and that is because I am very much pro-life. Killing any person for what so ever reason is not justified. But on my post I was merely expressing a point on how it must look from the pro-choice side. Or are you pro-choice and not happy about being told the truth of your world view?

 

[motstraumen]

And yet they had a high profile late term abortionist as an usher in their church? A man who killed viable unborn children and baptized their corpses before incinerating them?

Have you ever called another person a fool? You committed murder according to Jesus. Have you ever thought bad/lustful thoughts in your heart about a person of another gender? You committed adultery. Have you ever judged another? We know how Jesus treated those who were about to stone the adultress. What jobs do you do at your church. Give us the name so we can warn your pastor and chuch council that they have a terrible sinner in their midst. High profile or Low profile the church is a place for sinners to hear the word. And as pastors the job is to proclaim Law and Gospel, administer the sacraments and let the Holy Spirit work. And what proof do you have of the last statement.

 

[juhothenero]

I am finding it more and more disturbing as I read through the various threads and posts concerning the murder of this man that it appears that many who claim to be pro-life are only pro-life that they like.
And not pro-life if the life is not to their liking.

Real pro-life is pro-life no matter what. I wouldn’t have even killed Hitler if it would have been up to me.

 

[motstraumen]

The same could be said of the pro-aborts who call it progress when 53,000,000 babies are killed, but mourn over one man who simply played a role in their agenda.

Agaiun, I’m glad this monster won’t be sucking the brains out of viable babies any more. No more baptizing dead babies before putting them into an oven.

The same people who mourn for tiller are the same misguided people who mourned when saddam was hanged.

According to what you write you are no Christian, you are also not a pro-life person. I pity your dillusional state. May God cast out the demons that possess your rhetoric and your thinking. I do truly pray for you. If you desire to be prolife you need to reevaluate what the fullness of that word means, especially in light of who is the Way, The Truth, and Life, Jesus Christ, the one who utter from the cross “Forgive them, for they know not what they do.”

 

[mapleoak]

This so called murder was just another late term abortion. It dealt with what the abortionist saw as a problem very well. It is actually a pro-choice issue if you think about it. This person just chose that abortion can be done after birth too, not only before birth. I do not know what abortion supporters are getting angry about. Whereas pro-life people of course feel this is a very very sad and horrible murder.

You have quite succinctly illustrated the hypocrisy contained in the “pro-choice” pro-abortion mindset.

 

[Walt_Oliver]

Despite having been cleaned up yesterday and a warning placed in the thread, it has again degenerated into uncharitably cussing and discussing each other instead of the topic of the thread. Thread is now closed and will not reopen.