Acts 2:38-39 . .

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ziapueblo

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Glory to Jesus Christ-

So I was having a discussion with acquaintance of mine who happens to be Southern Baptist. We were talking about baptism, so I of course brought up Acts 2:38-39, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the holy Spirit. For the promise is made to you and to your children and to all those far off, whomever the Lord our God will call.” His response was one I have never heard before and it has to do with the word for. Here was his response:

The thing I wonder about when I hear that water baptism saves us is what the word for means in the passage. Does it mean that we are baptized “so that” our sins can be forgiven? Or does it mean that we get baptized “because” our sins are forgiven. In the English language, the word “for” can be used in either way. If you have a clear understanding of Greek, I would appreciate their insight.

Has anyone come across this? Would love some help 🙂

Thanks and God bless,
ZP
 
The sentence is in future tense then ‘so that’ would be correct. Here it is from the New Jerusalem Bible.
’You must repent,’ Peter answered, ‘and every one of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ’ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit
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What is interesting is that the word “for” is used in the same way in the creed…

“We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father [and the Son],
who with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins…”

Something that you may want to point out in the same passage you quote is Peter’s promise is made, “to you and to your children.”

Since Peter is specifically speaking of baptism, he is saying that baptism applies to children as well as adults.

I agree with Andy in the previous post. The passage is future tense, therefore “so that” is the correct form of the word.

Subrosa
 
Note that a few sentences later, in that Acts passage, it is baptism that incorporates the believers into the body of Christ, the Church. First they believed Peter’s preaching and because of that obeyed his command to be baptiszed. Belief without Baptism was not sufficient.
Acts 2:41 So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.

Then I would point out to him that there are other passages that also speak of Baptism and are very clear that it is through Baptism that one is cleansed and regenerated.

Acts 22: 12-16 “ ……said to me, ‘Brother Saul, receive your sight’ ……And now why do you (Saul/Paul) wait? Rise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on his name.’

1 Cor 6:11 And such (grave sinners) were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Titus 3:5 he saved us, not because of deeds done by us in righteousness, but in virtue of his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal in the Holy Spirit,

1 Peter 3:20-21 …in the days of Noah, during the building of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were saved through water. Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
 
This is a nice resource I use often: Online Interlinear

Is has for this passage eis = INTO so the passage literally reads:

AND LET-BE-BEING-DIPizED EACH OF-YOU ON THE NAME OF-JESUS ANOINTED (Christ) INTO FROM-LETTing misses

Don’t see “because” fitting there.
 
It is not the water that is doing the saving. It is God working through the water that is washing our sins. Jesus Christ said it Himself that a person is born of water and Spirit when Nicodemus asked how a person is born again in Jn 3: 3-7. A protestant person from the website gotquestions.org explained baptism to me beautifully in saying how we are born in water and flesh, we are born again in water and Spirit. We came into this world through water (i.e. amniotic fluid). We are born spiritually the same way because it is God using the water.

1 Pt 3: 20-21 is a good example. It says Noah and his family were saved through water and that symbolize baptism which saves us now. The world was evil in Noah days, and God got rid of the evil and started a new human race through Noah’s generation by using water. That symbolize how we start a new life as Christians by God using the water in baptism.

1 Cor 10: 2 is also a good example when St. Paul said the Israelites were baptize by the cloud and sea. God (through Moses) freed the Israelites from Egyptian slavery by departing the Red Sea and washing away the Egyptian soldiers after they crossed. God uses the water in baptism to was away our old life and free us from slavery to sin.

To answer your question, the greek word for “for” in Acts 2: 38 is “Eis,” and it could mean it will happen or it already happened. From studylight.org, their explaination on this word says:
“For” (as used in Acts 2:38 “for the forgiveness…”) could have two meanings. If you saw a poster saying “Jesse James wanted for robbery”, “for” could mean Jesse is wanted so he can commit a robbery, or is wanted because he has committed a robbery. The later sense is the correct one. So too in this passage, the word “for” signifies an action in the past. Otherwise, it would violate the entire tenor of the NT teaching on salvation by grace and not by works.
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The part in bold is base on their belief in salvation by faith alone. I would beg to differ because this same website is saying that Peter was speaking in future tense. Therefore, Peter saying it will happen and not saying it already happened.

You can check it out yourself on the website and click on 5695 in verse 2: 38 to read how Peter was speaking

studylight.org/desk/?l=en&query=Acts+2%3A39&section=0&translation=str&oq=ac%25202%3A39&new=1&sr=1&nb=ac&ngt=Go+To%3A&ng=2&ncc=2
 
ziapueblo said:
Glory to Jesus Christ-

So I was having a discussion with acquaintance of mine who happens to be Southern Baptist. We were talking about baptism, so I of course brought up Acts 2:38-39, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the holy Spirit. For the promise is made to you and to your children and to all those far off, whomever the Lord our God will call.” His response was one I have never heard before and it has to do with the word for. Here was his response:

The thing I wonder about when I hear that water baptism saves us is what the word for means in the passage. Does it mean that we are baptized “so that” our sins can be forgiven? Or does it mean that we get baptized “because” our sins are forgiven. In the English language, the word “for” can be used in either way. If you have a clear understanding of Greek, I would appreciate their insight.

Has anyone come across this? Would love some help 🙂

Thanks and God bless,
ZP
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I found this for you on the faith database.

Greek 38: petroV <4074> de <1161> {AND PETER} efh <5346> (5713) {SAID} proV <4314> {TO} autouV <846> {THEM,} metanohsate <3340> (5657) {REPENT,} kai <2532> {AND} baptisqhtw <907> (5682) {BE BAPTIZED} ekastoV <1538> {EACH} umwn <5216> {OF YOU} epi <1909> {IN} tw <3588> {THE} onomati <3686> {NAME} ihsou <2424> {OF JESUS} cristou <5547> {CHRIST,} eiV <1519> {FOR} afesin <859> {REMISSION} amartiwn <266> {OF SINS,} kai <2532> {AND} lhyesqe <2983> (5695) {YE WILL RECEIVE} thn <3588> {THE} dwrean <1431> {GIFT} tou <3588> {OF THE} agiou <40> {HOLY} pneumatoV <4151> {SPIRIT.}

**eis {ice} a primary preposition; TDNT - 2:420,211; prep 1) into, unto, to, towards, for, among ++++ “For” (as used in Acts 2:38 “for the forgiveness…”) could have two meanings. If you saw a poster saying “Jesse James wanted for robbery”, “for” could mean Jesse is wanted so he can commit a robbery, or is wanted because he has committed a robbery. The later sense is the correct one. So too in this passage, the word “for” signifies an action in the past. Otherwise, it would violate the entire tenor of the NT teaching on salvation by grace and not by works.

**RSV 38: And Peter said to them, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

NRSV 38: Peter said to them, `Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins may be forgiven; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Douay 38: But Peter said to them: Do penance, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of your sins: and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

NAB 38: Peter (said) to them, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the holy Spirit.

KJV 38: Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

WEB 38: Peter said to them, "Repent, and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

ESV 38: And Peter said to them, "Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

NASB 38: Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

NIV 38: Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

YOUNG 38: and Peter said unto them, `Reform, and be baptized each of you on the name of Jesus Christ, to remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit,

Vulgate 38: Petrus vero ad illos paenitentiam inquit agite et baptizetur unusquisque vestrum in nomine Iesu Christi in remissionem peccatorum vestrorum et accipietis donum Sancti Spiritus

ASV 38: And Peter said unto them, Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ unto the remission of your sins; and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Darby 38And Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptised, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ, for remission of sins, and ye will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
 
ziapueblo said:
Glory to Jesus Christ-

So I was having a discussion with acquaintance of mine who happens to be Southern Baptist. We were talking about baptism, so I of course brought up Acts 2:38-39, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the holy Spirit. For the promise is made to you and to your children and to all those far off, whomever the Lord our God will call.” His response was one I have never heard before and it has to do with the word for. Here was his response:

The thing I wonder about when I hear that water baptism saves us is what the word for means in the passage. Does it mean that we are baptized “so that” our sins can be forgiven? Or does it mean that we get baptized “because” our sins are forgiven. In the English language, the word “for” can be used in either way. If you have a clear understanding of Greek, I would appreciate their insight.

Has anyone come across this? Would love some help 🙂

Thanks and God bless,
ZP
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Well the FOR cant be in place of “because” If your sins are aleady forgiven. If thats the case then whats the point of the baptism? I know protestants say its an outward sign of that forgiveness. I answer them with…“To whom”? Wouldnt God already know this? Why do I need to show it to you?

The passage also notes the you “will” receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, it doesnt say you have the gift of the Holy Spirit which could reasonably be expected if sins had already been forgiven.
 
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