An issue I came across from a Covenant Eyes ad (how to debate people about porn from a scientific standpoint)

[vash88]

Reader discretion advised.

Hi everyone,

(not sure if this is the right forum. I explain at the end why this isn’t in the moral theology forum, so I apologize if that’s where it should be. Please move if necessary) I can’t find it at the moment, but a couple of days ago I saw an ad for Covenant Eyes on Facebook. The comments, unfortunately, were mostly negative/cynical/pessimistic from people with (seemingly) a secular worldview. The general response from those people were that all of the warping that masturbation and porn does to the brain is no different than that of any other type of addiction. A person who is an alcoholic is just as trapped for example. And some of the people in the comments were even talking about how (discretion is perhaps advised for this part), they and their partners “pleasure themselves mutually” and doing so “brings them closer together” since they “learn more about what turns the other on.”

That got me thinking… those two points go against what people like Matt Fradd constantly mention when promoting Covenant Eyes. Fradd has said that porn specifically warps the brain in such a way that it isolates a person and makes them lonelier. But apparently there are couples who watch porn together and it brings them closer. And it seems like the warping of the brain happens more when it becomes an addiction, like anything else – not exclusive to porn or masturbation.

I then looked things up online and read various medical journals from doctors. There were some that talked about the negative side effects of masturbation, but in general most doctors said the health side-effects that people hear about are myths, and in fact, when it’s done in moderation, there are even health benefits.

What I want to know is, how do you debate people from a scientific/health perspective that porn/masturbation in and of itself (meaning putting the addiction aspect aside) is wrong. Apparently alcohol addiction has the same effects, but drinking alcohol in and of itself is not a sin. I KNOW porn/masturbation is a sin, because it goes against the purpose of sex that God intended! I DO NOT NEED CONVINCING OF THAT! I’m just wondering how to debate people from a medical perspective. This thread is not meant to be read from a moral point of view, which is why I didn’t initially put it in the moral theology forum

 

[Guest1]

 

[Guest1]

Don’t forget the possible abortions that might have taken place because a woman who was a porn star got pregnant.

 

[anon91549587]

Masturbation and porn promotes instant gratification instead of developing social and problem solving skills needed for intimacy in marriage. Like the wolf that watches the alpha get their paws dirty and eat but they can only watch.

 

[FiveLinden]

As far as I am aware the Catholic teaching on neither of these things is based on whether or not it is good for you. If the teaching were based on this it would run into the immediate problem that human relationships and experiences are so wide and varied that they both must be good for at least some people. So morality would become situational. Many other religions and most people with no religion are fine with situation ethics. The Catholic Church is not.

 

[TheLittleLady]

. And some of the people in the comments were even talking about how (discretion is perhaps advised for this part), they and their partners “pleasure themselves mutually” and doing so “brings them closer together” since they “learn more about what turns the other on.”

For decades this was taught in many non-Catholic Christian marriage prep. The idea that porn damages marriages is rather new and rather “radical”.

The thing to remember, even if pornography DOES bring people closer to each other, it is still a sin. The sinfulness has nothing to do with brain warps or isolation.

The Catechism lays out the reasons:

CCC 2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. “Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action.” “The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose.” For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."

And that pornography is sinful:

2354 Pornography consists in removing real or simulated sexual acts from the intimacy of the partners, in order to display them deliberately to third parties. It offends against chastity because it perverts the conjugal act, the intimate giving of spouses to each other. It does grave injury to the dignity of its participants (actors, vendors, the public), since each one becomes an object of base pleasure and illicit profit for others. It immerses all who are involved in the illusion of a fantasy world. It is a grave offense. Civil authorities should prevent the production and distribution of pornographic materials

So, one can argue Church teaching on those points OR one can argue from a “brain warp/isolation” position. Just know where the line is between these points of view.

 

[vash88]

The reason I brought this topic up is because promotion for Covenant Eyes often includes a bunch of the brain warping and isolation arguments of porn and masturbation. It seemed like a lot of those points were arguable from what I saw in those comments. I know the sinfulness of those things has nothing to do with health-related stuff. But since people who promote Covenant Eyes often bring up the health-related stuff, I thought it was necessary to bring this topic up.

Having said that, thank you all for the replies thus far. It’s been very helpful in clearing it up.