"...and with your spirit"...to euch. ministers?

[TheAdvocate]

If a Eucharistic minister visits you in the hospital and says “the Lord be with you,” are we to respond to them “and with your Spirit,” given that they are not ordained? I thought “and with your Spirit” was an acknowledgment of the charism of the gift of the Spirit at work within the ordained priest.

 

[Philomeena]

If a Eucharistic minister visits you in the hospital and says “the Lord be with you,” are we to respond to them “and with your Spirit,” given that they are not ordained? I thought “and with your Spirit” was an acknowledgment of the charism of the gift of the Spirit at work within the ordained priest.

My understanding is that “and with your spirit” is addressing the ordained nature of the minister so when I bring communion to people outside of mass I instruct them not to say “and with your spirit”

 

[marty1818]

No, you should not respond “and with your spirit”. But the EMHC should also not be saying “the Lord be with you” either.

blog.adw.org/2010/05/and-with-your-spirit-its-not-what-you-think/

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

No, you should not respond “and with your spirit”. But the EMHC should also not be saying “the Lord be with you” either.

blog.adw.org/2010/05/and-with-your-spirit-its-not-what-you-think/

Interesting. Why not? What would be the difference between “the Lord be with you” and “God bless you” (the latter of which, as far as I know, would be no problem?)

What if a non-ordained person were to say, “Peace be with you”, would that be problematic in your view?

 

[aemcpa]

If a Eucharistic minister visits you in the hospital and says “the Lord be with you,” are we to respond to them “and with your Spirit,” given that they are not ordained? I thought “and with your Spirit” was an acknowledgment of the charism of the gift of the Spirit at work within the ordained priest.

I think extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion are supposed to omit that exchange, so you shouldn’t be put in the position of having to respond.

 

[aemcpa]

What if a non-ordained person were to say, “Peace be with you”, would that be problematic in your view?

That’s even worse - that greeting is reserved to bishops!

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

That’s even worse - that greeting is reserved to bishops!

Huh? Can you provide a source for that claim?

Not that I think you’re lying or anything, but I’ve never heard anything like that and it strikes me as odd that there would be so many rules for what one is/isn’t allowed to say, especially considering none of these phrases are vulgar and they all have good intentions behind them.

Re:Bishops, Priests that are not Bishops say this phrase during the mass, do they not?

Also, personally, what do you say to the people near you during the exchange of peace? I always say peace be with you and people say it to me all the time.

So yeah, I would like to see a source on this one.

 

[aemcpa]

Huh? Can you provide a source for that claim?

Not that I think you’re lying or anything, but I’ve never heard anything like that and it strikes me as odd that there would be so many rules for what one is/isn’t allowed to say, especially considering none of these phrases are vulgar and they all have good intentions behind them.

Re:Bishops, Priests that are not Bishops say this phrase during the mass, do they not?

Also, personally, what do you say to the people near you during the exchange of peace? I always say peace be with you and people say it to me all the time.

So yeah, I would like to see a source on this one.

The “Dominus Vobiscum” within the context of the liturgy, which is the context of the original post, reserves “Pax vobis” to bishops.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontifical_High_Mass#Celebration_by_a_bishop_other_than_the_pope

Having sung the Exsultet as a lay cantor at the Easter Vigil, I was instructed to omit the “Dominus Vobiscum” altogether as it is specified in the Roman Missal as a prayer proper to clerics.

 

[quies]

Huh? Can you provide a source for that claim?..So yeah, I would like to see a source on this one.

"The Introductory Rites…

Priest: The Lord be with you.
People: And with your spirit.

In this first greeting a Bishop, instead of The Lord be with you, says:

Bishop: Peace be with you.
People: And with your spirit…"

*pgs 464-465
Saint Paul Sunday Missal
Copyright © 2012, Daughters of St. Paul
Pauline Books & Media
*

 

[paperwight66]

"The Introductory Rites…

Priest: The Lord be with you.
People: And with your spirit.

In this first greeting a Bishop, instead of The Lord be with you, says:

Bishop: Peace be with you.
People: And with your spirit…"

*pgs 464-465
Saint Paul Sunday Missal
Copyright © 2012, Daughters of St. Paul
Pauline Books & Media
*

Yes, but that doesn’t say ONLY a Bishop is allowed to say those words ever. Only that a Bishop does say them at that moment.

As pointed out, people say ‘peace be with you’ at the Sign of Peace quite often - I know they do in our parish, as something formal seems to be called for, rather than ‘hi’,

 

[John_Lilburne]

From the liturgical book “Holy Communion and the Worship of the Eucharist Outside of Mass”. Under the heading “RITE OF DISTRIBUTING HOLY COMMUNION OUTSIDE MASS”. No. 27:

INTRODUCTORY RITES
27. …

GREETING
If he is a priest or deacon, he says:
The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ …
The people answer: And also with you.

If the minister is not a priest or deacon, he greets those present with these or similar words:

Brothers and sisters,
the Lord invites us …

The people answer: Blessed be God for ever.

From The Rites Volume One, Liturgical Press, 1990, page 649.

 

[Elizabeth779]

It’s silly to be told we are not allowed to say that…silly, overly legalistic, scrupulous…and I’m one of those legalistic, scrupulous, law and rule loving people!!!

oh brother…

It’s like…"… blah blah blah" to quote wasshisname…haha

 

[aemcpa]

It’s silly to be told we are not allowed to say that…silly, overly legalistic, scrupulous…and I’m one of those legalistic, scrupulous, law and rule loving people!!!

oh brother…

It’s like…"… blah blah blah" to quote wasshisname…haha

This question is not about the general usage of the phrase, as if in some superstitious way it’s wrong to ever utter these phrases. The original post is about the proper liturgical rite to be used by an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion in the exercise of that function. Some charity and better reading comprehension are in order, I think.

 

[Brendan]

It’s silly to be told we are not allowed to say that…

Why is it ‘silly’, it goes the heart of it means to have received the Sacrament of Holy Orders. Holy Orders places an indelible mark on the soul, it literally changes the person, infusing them with the Holy Spirit in a way that does not occur with the laity.

It is the recognition of that particular indwelling of the Spirit that is present in the priest and deacon that we acknowledge.

And it would be foolish to make that same acknowledgement to a layperson.

So the ‘silliness’ or foolishness would be in the act of using that to address a layperson, NOT in the following of the Church’s instructions.

Now that doesn’t mean that you cannot use the phrase “the Lord be with you” or “Peace be with you” OUTSIDE of an approved liturgical action of the Church.

But the response would NEVER be ‘and with your spirit’. It would be more like "Thanks! And same to you "

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

This question is not about the general usage of the phrase, as if in some superstitious way it’s wrong to ever utter these phrases. The original post is about the proper liturgical rite to be used by an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion in the exercise of that function. Some charity and better reading comprehension are in order, I think.

I am so sorry for that, I misunderstood. It all makes sense now.

 

[ProVobis]

The “Dominus Vobiscum” within the context of the liturgy, which is the context of the original post, reserves “Pax vobis” to bishops.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontifical_High_Mass#Celebration_by_a_bishop_other_than_the_pope

Having sung the Exsultet as a lay cantor at the Easter Vigil, I was instructed to omit the “Dominus Vobiscum” altogether as it is specified in the Roman Missal as a prayer proper to clerics.

I believe you are correct, at least in the Latin.

But it seems “Peace” or “Peace to you” or “Peace be with you” or “El paz” has been accepted as a valid exchange greeting at the appropriate place in the Mass, by virtue of the fact that the exchange starts at the altar.