Angels and Hell

[calinorth86]

Is there a passage in the old testament that says that lucifer and the angels were cast out of heaven and into hell or earth?

 

[calinorth86]

Thank you for your reply

 

[cjforJesus]

Angels and humans cannot mate as angels do not have a body, they are spirit. This lie has been propagated by many and will probably be utilized in an end time scenario.

 

[JerryZ]

The problem lies with what do we mean when we use the word “Angel” and what the ancient Israelites or even before (The Israelites are the descendants of Israel the son of Isaac who was one of the 2 son of Abraham), meant by that word.

Similar by the way with the meaning of the word “Brother”.

Angel for us has come to mean the Spiritual beings created by GOD before the creation of the material world. Although GOD may allow them to interact with the world from time to time in order to execute HIS will. They “APPEAR” as humans to us but that is NOT their normal status of existence. Jesus describes Angels as those who can see GOD face to face. And also that GOD appoints each and every one of us a Guardian Angel. It would seem that the issue with Lucifer and the rest of the fallen Angels was precisely that. They would NOT serve “inferior” beings. Although the real issue is that it is not us they would have served, rather they rejected GOD’s will. Serve HIM to watch over us.

Now the ancients used the word in a different manner or rather it could mean the same thing BUT it also means “MESSENGER”.

And though we now also implicitly have that understanding they would use the same word for someone who was not a spiritual being who carried a message. Here is an example of this:

My Catholic Public Domain Bible in II Kings 6:32

Now Elisha was sitting in his house, and the elders were sitting with him. And so he sent a man ahead. And before that messenger arrived, he said to the elders: “Do you not know that this son of a murderer is sending someone to cut off my head? Therefore, watch, and when the messenger arrives, close the door. And you shall not permit him to enter. For behold, the sound of his lord’s feet is behind him.”

The LXX same verse II Kings 6:32

και ελισαιε εκαθητο εν τω οικω αυτου και οι πρεσβυτεροι εκαθηντο μετ αυτου και απεστειλεν ανδρα προ προσωπου αυτου πριν ελθειν τον αγγελον προς αυτον και αυτος ειπεν προς τους πρεσβυτερους ει οιδατε οτι απεστειλεν ο υιος του φονευτου ουτος αφελειν την κεφαλην μου ιδετε ως αν ελθη ο αγγελος αποκλεισατε την θυραν και παραθλιψατε αυτον εν τη θυρα ουχι φωνη των ποδων του κυριου αυτου κατοπισθεν αυτου

Notice the Greek text uses the word “αγγελον” = Angel.

Therefore we have to be careful because in the past the translations were not always precise and there can be misunderstanding specially when from the context is not clear if the author meant an “Angelic Messenger” OR just A Messenger.

…

 

[cjforJesus]

The problem lies with what do we mean when we use the word “Angel” and what the ancient Israelites or even before (The Israelites are the descendants of Israel the son of Isaac who was one of the 2 son of Abraham), meant by that word.

Similar by the way with the meaning of the word “Brother”.

Angel for us has come to mean the Spiritual beings created by GOD before the creation of the material world. Although GOD may allow them to interact with the world from time to time in order to execute HIS will. They “APPEAR” as humans to us but that is NOT their normal status of existence. Jesus describes Angels as those who can see GOD face to face. And also that GOD appoints each and every one of us a Guardian Angel. It would seem that the issue with Lucifer and the rest of the fallen Angels was precisely that. They would NOT serve “inferior” beings. Although the real issue is that it is not us they would have served, rather they rejected GOD’s will. Serve HIM to watch over us.

Now the ancients used the word in a different manner or rather it could mean the same thing BUT it also means “MESSENGER”.

And though we now also implicitly have that understanding they would use the same word for someone who was not a spiritual being who carried a message. Here is an example of this:

My Catholic Public Domain Bible in II Kings 6:32

The LXX same verse II Kings 6:32

Notice the Greek text uses the word “αγγελον” = Angel.

Therefore we have to be careful because in the past the translations were not always precise and there can be misunderstanding specially when from the context is not clear if the author meant an “Angelic Messenger” OR just A Messenger.

…

Regardless, the “sons of God” referenced in Genesis that many attribute to fallen angels are simply good men. The son’s of God took to them wives from the carnal “sons of men”. Baruch goes on to elaborate on this large and violent race of humans.

 

[Julian0404]

Is there a passage in the old testament that says that lucifer and the angels were cast out of heaven and into hell or earth?

New Testament:
Matthew 10:18 JESUS “. . . and I saw satan fall from heaven like lighting…” paraphrase.

 

[mikekle]

Angels and humans cannot mate as angels do not have a body, they are spirit. This lie has been propagated by many and will probably be utilized in an end time scenario.

This has been explained for a long time, you are right, the fallen angels themselves DID NOT actually mate with the human females, but they did possess human males, who then mated with the females.

Im not claiming to know the details of this, but somehow, the fallen angels were able to ‘pass’ some of their ‘being’ into the females while this was taking place, the offspring were the giants. ( the logistics of this is beyond our comprehension though).

Im thinking of a verse, cant remember exactly, but it says something along the lines of ‘never allowing the giants to rise again, that even their memory be erased from history’.

Of course, this was just a tactic of satan to corrupt the human seed, so Jesus could not be born. I asked the senior priest at my parish ( has a PHD in history), about the Nephilim awhile back, he gave me a great explanation, it all boils down to satan trying to corrupt the human seed, failing, and trying to erase all evidence they ever existed, remember he does not want anyone knowing he actually exists, this is why you dont see Nephilim artifacts in major museums. However they are in some.

 

[JerryZ]

Regardless, the “sons of God” referenced in Genesis that many attribute to fallen angels are simply good men. The son’s of God took to them wives from the carnal “sons of men”. Baruch goes on to elaborate on this large and violent race of humans.

Ah yes “Sons of GOD” well they are NOT angels because we see that they used that word to describe messengers in flesh and bones AND the spiritual beings at the service of GOD who could from time to time appear in human form but one would guess they identified themselves as “Angels”.

Nope these “Sons of GOD” seem to belong to a different category of beings. One that is not clear who they are exactly or where they come from.
They are not apparently genetically totally compatible with the human species judging from the fact that the offspring were “different” from both father and mother.
A hybrid species perhaps? Who knows, until we find evidence of these “giants” is all speculation.

…,

 

[eazyduzit]

Ah yes “Sons of GOD” well they are NOT angels because we see that they used that word to describe messengers in flesh and bones AND the spiritual beings at the service of GOD who could from time to time appear in human form but one would guess they identified themselves as “Angels”.

Nope these “Sons of GOD” seem to belong to a different category of beings. One that is not clear who they are exactly or where they come from.
They are not apparently genetically totally compatible with the human species judging from the fact that the offspring were “different” from both father and mother.
A hybrid species perhaps? Who knows, until we find evidence of these “giants” is all speculation.

…,

Actually, there is much skeletal evidence of a giant race of humans. It has been mysteriously kept secret. There are skeletons in the Smithsonian, but they won’t admit it. However it’s all out there on YouTube if you want to see it. And yes they really have 12 fingers and 12 toes just as the Bible says.

 

[cjforJesus]

This has been explained for a long time, you are right, the fallen angels themselves DID NOT actually mate with the human females, but they did possess human males, who then mated with the females.

Im not claiming to know the details of this, but somehow, the fallen angels were able to ‘pass’ some of their ‘being’ into the females while this was taking place, the offspring were the giants. ( the logistics of this is beyond our comprehension though).

Im thinking of a verse, cant remember exactly, but it says something along the lines of ‘never allowing the giants to rise again, that even their memory be erased from history’.

Of course, this was just a tactic of satan to corrupt the human seed, so Jesus could not be born. I asked the senior priest at my parish ( has a PHD in history), about the Nephilim awhile back, he gave me a great explanation, it all boils down to satan trying to corrupt the human seed, failing, and trying to erase all evidence they ever existed, remember he does not want anyone knowing he actually exists, this is why you dont see Nephilim artifacts in major museums. However they are in some.

Baruch 3
There were the giants, those renowned men that were from the beginning, of great stature, expert in war. [27] The Lord chose not them, neither did they find the way of knowledge: therefore did they perish. [28] And because they had not wisdom, they perished through their folly.

They were just very tall viking like people who were skillled in war.Nothing hybrid or supernatural about them.

As far as I know the Catholic church does not teach that they were angel human hybrids.

 

[JerryZ]

Actually, there is much skeletal evidence of a giant race of humans. It has been mysteriously kept secret. There are skeletons in the Smithsonian, but they won’t admit it. However it’s all out there on YouTube if you want to see it. And yes they really have 12 fingers and 12 toes just as the Bible says.

Well sure there are IS a lot on YouTube, but a lot of it is just garbage. Conspiracy theories are very popular on the internet, except they distract from the truth of Jesus.
Most the followers of these theories dismiss the Church that Jesus established to guide HIS flock to safety.

…

 

[Tim_D]

Actually, there is much skeletal evidence of a giant race of humans. It has been mysteriously kept secret. There are skeletons in the Smithsonian, but they won’t admit it.

So, there is “much skeletal evidence” of these giants, its been kept a secret, the Smithsonian has bones of them, though they won’t admit it, but you know about it? How?

 

[mikekle]

So, there is “much skeletal evidence” of these giants, its been kept a secret, the Smithsonian has bones of them, though they won’t admit it, but you know about it? How?

Yes, this is correct, there is a serpent mound and a small museum about 60 miles from me, it is in southern OH, ( I think its Adams county), they have Nephilim artifacts here, and one skull, there is a definite difference in human and Nephilim skulls, humans have a certain number of skull ‘plates’, Nephilim do not have these, some also have double rows of teeth, size is also different (obviously). The artifacts are incredible, the axe head they have is massive. There are other museums out there that have these things too.

The main reason why the larger museums do not show or discuss this is because this was a result of Satan and the fallen angels, they failed, since Satan tries to hide in the shadows nowadays, he has been successful at convincing alot of people he does not exist, if most of the public knew about these Nephilim and Satans involvement, that is not good for him trying to convince people he doesnt exist.

If you want to learn more about this, LA Marzulli (not sure of spelling of his last name), he has done incredible research on the Nephilim.