Angry at God

[crystal_waters]

Why douse a “loving god” create a torcher chamber to send most of his creations. I could understand if this was for behavior modification but there is no chance of forgiveness. Douse god give us a fire prof body? How douse someone burn for all eternity? Is burning is being consumed by fire?

anybody who is in hell has had a lifetime to seek forgiveness…they are there of their own choosing…they chose to turn away from god rather than apologise to him and seek forgiveness …heaven wouldnt be heaven if the inhabitants of hell were allowed there…

 

[Flavius_Aetius]

I’d like to thank everyone who posted here for support; I’ve been looking over what has been typed repeatedly and thus far seeing what has been written + time to cool down has seemed to leave me at a simmer.

I still feel bleak, and thus far can’t bring myself to embrace God just yet. I can’t comprehend why such a perfect creation could become less than animals all because of sin. I say less because at the end of the day if we’re driven down to the point of survivalist instincts Humanity can become as savage as animals-and do so with the full knowledge of their actions unlike say a hungry wolf. Not only that but time and time again we’ve shown how even when our needs are satisfied humanity must seek to destroy one another in genocides and other atrocities.

I mean what victory is there to God if maybe only a few million of people enter Heaven compared to the Billions that either will choose Hell actively or passively lead themselves to Hell?!

 

[praxising]

I’m feeling furious at God right now…mostly for being so @#*% mysterious and hidden away!

I’m so angry…in my head I can honestly picture myself just hitting Jesus in the gut out of anger…and the thought just leaves me feeling like a filthy animal!

I’m feeling anger and hate for God and myself and I can’t explain it…it makes me want to tear out my hair I feel so broken!

I remember once being in my bedroom calling God every bad name I could think of. HOW could He let happen what happened? Rage it was.

I didn’t get an answer then because God is the smartest Father ever. I wouldn’t have heard Him, as He knew. The answer came to me quietly, in Church, hanging out in a pew, not even praying, not expecting a thing. A few weeks later.

The troubling part of your post is that you say you don’t know why you are so angry. But I’ll tell you what my RCIA sponsor told me: God loves you, He’ll take it all. God is big enough for your anger. You can’t drive Him away. Talk to Him. Yell at Him if you must. This is the other things she said: Think of the brightest light and how it casts the deepest shadow. Feeling like you are in darkness, can really mean you are closest to Him. Turn around and tell Him what’s in your heart and head. And keep doing that.

Prayin’ for ya…

 

[Flavius_Aetius]

I’m sorry but just responding to a few threads on this forum has reminded me why I hate God so much…

He’s a horrible Father and Creator!

Apparently all because of Original Sin, God turned our bodies into ineffective hormonal messes that has allowed a whole maggots nest of Sin to fill our lives.

We sinned, but it was GOD that choose to punish us with homosexuality, transgenderism, and diseases to reproductive organs that allow the Church to be fine with indirect abortions.

How are we ever to return to him if God didn’t even leave us with stability in our own bodies?! God is responsible and now Up is down, Black is White, and even something as simple as gender is worthless opinion.

God gave me a diseased gutter of a world to live in, why should I worship and honor him!

 

[praxising]

God is responsible and now Up is down, Black is White, and even something as simple as gender is worthless opinion.

Huh. Interesting. Well, there isn’t anything simple about gender, never has been. If you study the animal world, there are all kinds of shifts that take place, females turning into males, complete absence of sexual function, same sex attachments, all sorts of things. Same stuff we have as physical beings. So gender has always been a pretty slippery concept. When we are young and our biological urges seem pretty overwhelming, those issues seem like the most important things that can be. That passes as the spirit becomes stronger, and acquiring things and sexual matters become relatively far less important.

There are a lot of deep issues involved in what you are asking. But I think right now you are dealing with something personal. The only thing I know for sure is God loves you. And you can’t do anything to change that. The problem with us is, we want that love to be something we decide it should be. It isn’t. It’s what God knows we need.

God made a perfect Eternal world for you to live in forever. To get there, you have to briefly pass through here. Life in Time is sometimes terrible and sometimes pretty great. But it’s temporary. And relative.

 

[odile53]

Read Job. Job shook his fist in the face of heaven, after being stripped of everything worthwhile in this life, including his health, and even the silly gourd plant that provided the scant consolation of a little shade under which he sat with a potshard and scraped his itchy boils.

God gave him the courtesy of a response, and a challenge. And when Job was able to see God’s sovereignty, God blessed him even more than Job had been blessed before.

Go ahead and yell at God: He’s big enough to take it. And if you listen very closely after you vent, after you get it all out of your system, you will then be in a better frame of mind to hear His response to your rage.

 

[EmeraldWings]

(post 1 of 2)

I’m sorry but just responding to a few threads on this forum has reminded me why I hate God so much…

He’s a horrible Father and Creator!

Apparently all because of Original Sin, God turned our bodies into ineffective hormonal messes that has allowed a whole maggots nest of Sin to fill our lives.

We sinned, but it was GOD that choose to punish us with homosexuality, transgenderism, and diseases to reproductive organs that allow the Church to be fine with indirect abortions.

How are we ever to return to him if God didn’t even leave us with stability in our own bodies?! God is responsible and now Up is down, Black is White, and even something as simple as gender is worthless opinion.

God gave me a diseased gutter of a world to live in, why should I worship and honor him!

those things are not just punishments resulting from God, they are also consequences resulting from our own actions, God warned us more than enough times,

you can see the backwardness of the world, but you have the blame placed backwards also,
these things have only so drastically come about in the past 50 years or so, it’s never been this bad on a worldly scale,
and the reason for that you will find here - olrl.org/prophecy/goodsuccess.shtml
just read that,
you must see, that the way you are feeling really doesn’t make things better, not for yourself or anyone else, it is only a slavery, anger enslaves you, you feel so overwhelmed with passionate displeasure that you can’t reason anything out…and you need to calm down,

it is true that there is very much suffering in the world, but what makes you think that suffering is merely a punishment? it’s not…it is mercy, imagine the world with only sin and no consequences, imagine Jesus coming to save us, and no way to “show” His love…
God has done and is doing His part, but what are we doing? if you want to blame anyone, blame us Catholics, we’re the ones that are supposed to be praying, doing penances, evangelizing…but what are we doing? kicking back, relaxing, just trying to “get by” in life?..
you have alot of questions that have been asked time and time again, almost everyone wonders these things, but there are answers, everything you just said has an answer, i’ve looked for them myself, and found them, you have to be patient, anger won’t get you anything but a headache,

so, i will try to explain to you what i have come to know about suffering and sin,
and if you’re still angry, go calm down, and come back and read this when you’re feeling better…

first i want to start with love, we are told that God is love, and being “love itself” He works only according to love,
and what is love? it is not an emotion or a feeling, but instead an act of the will, it is to will good to another, and is only genuinely love when done without self motive,
and because it is only genuine without self motive, then love cannot be forced onto someone, and cannot be taken from someone, it must be chosen, otherwise it is simply not love,
but love, by its very nature, cannot be contained, love cannot “be” unless it is pored out, because love is completely selfless, so it cannot be kept to ones self,
and so if it cannot be kept to ones self, then God, Who is love, must love, and in order to love, He must create someone to love, which is us, but as love cannot be forced or taken, so God gave us a free will to choose,
but how are we free to choose if there is nothing to choose between?
that is where evil comes in,
but evil, as i have come to learn, is not a “thing” but a lack thereof, it is a lack of God, it is where God is not,
it is the choice between accepting or rejecting God,
so when we choose good, we choose God, because as we are told, “God alone is good”, and when we choose evil, we are choosing to reject God, or to be absent from Him,
between these two things, good and evil, there is no other choice,
but evil, sin, and hell, are all proofs of our freedom, they mean that we have a choice other than God, so that if we do not want to love God, He will not force us.
so, in order to love, we must have a free will, because love must be chosen, otherwise it is not love, but in order to choose, there must be something to choose between,
and it’s not that God “made” or “chose” these things(evil, sin, and hell) as the alternate choices, but those things are simply what result naturally from a lack of God.

 

[EmeraldWings]

(post 2 of 2)

so, Adam and Eve sinned, of their own free will, and we have been sinning from then on…what did God do about it? He did what all good parents do, and disciplined.
now, when a good parent disciplines their child, what is it for? it’s for training them to act in accordance with the rules, which are placed there for their own good and safety…they don’t want their children to suffer this way, but if they do not discipline them, then they will suffer far worse down the road,
that is just a simple way to look at it, God on the other hand has an entire world to deal with, and it’s not always easy to understand His ways, as we are told “For my thoughts are not your thoughts: nor your ways my ways, saith the Lord.” Isaias 55:8
but we have to consider, God knows all things, whereas we know very little, and are more inclined to think as sinners, proudly or irrationally or ignorantly, and so why would we know better? we have to ask ourselves…what the heck do we know about running the world? what? we don’t like pain and suffering, so that means it’s bad and doing no good…hm…that is an irrational opinion based on feelings, it’s not based on reason or facts or love…
the one thing we have to understand here is, God puts the soul first, and even if we may be suffering physically in the world, from Gods point of view, if that suffering saves the soul, then it is worth it,
if we were running things, we might put the body first, right? no suffering…and likewise no love, no repentance, no mercy…
The suffering going on right now will not last forever, and our world will not remain in the state it is forever, we are told that someday the Holy Ghost will “Renew the face of the earth”…and although you can’t see what God has in store for us right now, that doesn’t mean He’s not working towards that goal.
God knows what He’s doing, He doesn’t have to answer to you or do things on your time, you need to stop being angry and start worrying about what you can do to help, start doing your part, every little bit of help counts, and if you’re not doing your part to serve God and help save souls, then you are only adding to the very problem you are complaining about…God’s not asking you to save the world, the world is in His hands, and for that you should be grateful, because just imagine how unbearable things would be if the world was in your hands…chances are, the world wouldn’t even be here anymore…

i know you mean well, you have a great deal of compassion for those who suffer…but you have to consider that the suffering people endure may be their only ticket to heaven, or their only means of conversion in this life,
it is good to have compassion on those who suffer and to help ease their suffering by whatever means the circumstance calls for(especially prayer) but if you were given the choice to stop all the suffering in the world, but the consequences of that would be that most people would end up choosing, of their own free will, to go to hell…then would you do it?
you might wonder though, why would anyone “choose” to go to hell? well, the simple answer to that is, heaven is the place we go to love God forever, and hell is the place we go when we don’t want to love God, but even in hell the sufferings are Gods mercy, because the pains of hell are really only a distraction from the true pain, which is the loss of God,
God won’t force us into heaven, and we can’t force our way in, and neither would we want to, because if we do not love God, then even heaven would be like hell to us,
Bishop Fulton J. Sheen put it a good way, (i can’t quote it exactly) he said to imagine you are walking through a beautiful garden, everything is beautiful, everything is placed just perfectly, the trees and flowers, and you think to yourself “this must be heaven!”, but then you notice by a stream a fish, which is just laying right outside the water, and the fish is just flopping around violently…even though this is heaven, for that fish, it is hell.
and it’s the same for us, we need to love God of our own free will, otherwise we will not want to go to heaven.

well, before i go on to long i’ll end it there, but i just want to say…if you want to know the answer to these questions you have, then seek them! the church has the answers, especially in older Catholic books(such as Benziger Brothers books) you don’t have to have this anger and frustration, you can have the truth, and i know you don’t want to be angry, because anger does not feel good, i know.

and you need to stop looking at the suffering of the world all in one lump sum…we all have our cross to carry, but you can’t know how each individuals sufferings will help them down the road or in the next life, you just can’t know…but you can help them either to benefit from their suffering or to help ease their burden by praying for them…

ok so i hope this helps…and i will be praying for you, but also check these out for additional information and advice -
audiosancto.org/
keepthefaith.org/
youtube.com/user/CatholicClips#g/p
fultonsheen.com/Fulton-Sheen-MP3.cfm

take care.

 

[wild_thing]

Thank you, EmeraldWings, for that article on Our Lady and Ven. Marianna- that was so interesting! I am not one for private revelations, but that one I had never heard before and it really captivated me.

If you are willing, Flavius, and if you haven’t already, I would read St. Therese’s Story of a Soul. There is something about that book, despite the Victorian sensibilities, that stays with you. Every time I read it I constantly find new insights into the faith. St. Therese also focuses on the God of LOVE. Sometimes people dwell too much on God’s justice and His supposed wrath instead of His unbelievable mercy.

Here is one of the things she wrote:

“I know that the Lord is infinitely just and it is this justice, which terrifies so many souls, which is the object of my joy and confidence…I hope for as much from the justice of God as from His mercy. It is because He is just that He is compassionate and full of gentleness, slow to punish and abounding in mercy, for He knows our frailty. He remembers that we are nothing but dust.”

 

[Joseph_Kemp]

Flavius, you said: “I mean what victory is there to God if maybe only a few million of people enter Heaven compared to the Billions that either will choose Hell actively or passively lead themselves to Hell?!”

The idea that very few people enter Heaven is not officially taught by the Roman Catholic Church. Some people say it here and there. But people say many things. It is not official Church teaching. Such opinions do not need to be followed. They can actually be quite dangerous to a person’s moral life. The idea that very few people ever enter Heaven can make a person believe there is no point in even BEING Catholic, and can easily lead to despair and hopelessness.

You said: “I’m sorry but just responding to a few threads on this forum has reminded me why I hate God so much…He’s a horrible Father and Creator!”

Be very, very careful when you look on the Internet. There is almost no regulation of information flow. People can say virtually anything, no matter how bizarre. And almost no one objects. If I let myself believe every opinion I read, I, too, would have long ago concluded that God is “a horrible Father and Creator.” That is exactly how He often comes across, in much of the reasoning of other people – a cold, demanding, inherently arbitrary Being.

A Being that demands sacrifice. A Being that is harsh and judgmental. A Thing that sends you to Hell for almost no reason at all.

But such views of God are not representative of official Church teaching or philosophy. They are gross distortions. I would advise you to stop engaging in any Internet discussions that are making you uneasy, or that are feeding you reasoning like this. It is flatly wrong. Such things can lead only to misery.

You said: I’ve never thought God could leave me feeling like someone out of an HP Lovecraft novel who just encountered one of his cosmic beings, but here I am! I feel utterly worthless, a meaningless existance…”

I am interested that you mention H. P. Lovecraft. Lovecraft was a person of logic. I assume that you, too, are a person of logic. So am I. And I understand entirely the frustration that can arise when people of logic look for rational, balanced information about God, but do not find it. Where opinions loom large, rational people often find themselves feeling frustrated, hopeless and alone. Just like characters in a Lovecraft novel.

You wrote: “I…can’t bring myself to embrace God just yet. I can’t comprehend why such a perfect creation could become less than animals all because of sin. I say less because at the end of the day if we’re driven down to the point of survivalist instincts Humanity can become as savage as animals-and do so with the full knowledge of their actions unlike say a hungry wolf.”

There is absolutely nothing in Vatican teaching, the Catechism, Canon Law, or any papal publication or encyclical that requires us to look at human beings as “irredeemably depraved.” People who speak as if everything is sinful and worthy of damnation are stating a very, very unhealthy opinion. I encounter it often, in people with an unhealthy sense of sin. Everything is depraved. Everything is evil. Nothing is “pure.” We’re all probably going to Hell, no matter what. This is not the official view of the Roman Catholic Church. And no Catholic is under any obligation to believe such bizarre opinions in any way whatsoever.

I believe you are suffering from fears brought on by bad reasoning. Such fears are more common than you may think. They can be caused by reading extremist books, or by talking to people with harshly conservative views on Catholic belief.

This is very important to recognize. Just because it is written in a “Catholic” book does not automatically make it true. Just because a Catholic says it doesn’t qualify its’ authenticity.

Catholic philosopher G. K. Chesterton once wrote that a Catholic can reach a point in his/her spiritual life, when nothing a Protestant or a non-believer says can shake their faith. But a single bad word from another Catholic can be absolutely devastating. I believe you are at that point now.

Stop reading anything that is causing you difficulty. If what you are reading sounds too harsh to be true, then it probably is. It can be difficult to find accurate information about Catholic belief. But the Internet is one of the worst places to do it. I have never in my life encountered so many unbalanced opinions about anything, anywhere. The Internet, in general, is an absolute treasure trove of bad reasoning.

The Catholic Church is very gentle on its followers. Its teachings are very undemanding and kind. Anyone who says otherwise is simply wrong. It is very easy to be Catholic, and it is a comfort to millions of people. I cannot express my sadness when I see others attempting to make something so gentle seem so needlessly difficult. There is no reason for it. It’s just weird.

PS – There is a website called “Scrupulous Anonymous” run by the Redemptorist Order, to help Catholics suffering from needless fears about their salvation. It might be very helpful to you. The people who run it are very knowledgeable about the Catholic faith. Their information is accurate and precise. It has helped thousands of people, and it may be useful to calm various fears.

 

[praxising]

The Catholic Church is very gentle on its followers. Its teachings are very undemanding and kind. Anyone who says otherwise is simply wrong. It is very easy to be Catholic, and it is a comfort to millions of people. I cannot express my sadness when I see others attempting to make something so gentle seem so needlessly difficult. There is no reason for it. It’s just weird…

Welcome. I hope you stick around.

 

[Flavius_Aetius]

Welcome. I hope you stick around.

As do I, reading what you said gave me a powerful epiphany. I have learned that despite having felt I knew enough to pass judgment on God, the truth is I don’t know anything about him or what really follow the Catholic Church means. I mean the most knowledge I have is from an admittedly poor confirmation training, and skimming through the Catechism when I was twelve. The main reason I have felt that I understand God is due to the internet, I haven’t spoken to a priest in years and likewise haven’t attended a Mass just as long; I have however been on this forum seeing view points from both the extreme right and left (and as you said these words coming from fellow Catholics). I’ve yet to truly understand the Bible, and have never finished the Catechism front and back with the teachings understood.

For all my faith solely being in logic I really haven’t contemplated this logically…

So I have decided I won’t be using the Apologetic board on Catholic Answers, I can’t keep up hearing an occasional truth mixed in with a hundred opinions. Furthermore I’m going to work on reading the Bible and the Catechism before I take on any opinion toward God. I hope when I actually have knowledge about my Lord it will be impossible not to love and honor him.

I’m going to take this slowly though, I feel returning to a Confessional is going to be the hardest part-as I have 3-4 years worth of Sin stacked against me. I will definitely check Scrupulous Anonymous; I feel I will need it.

I want to Thank everyone who responded in this thread, I don’t feel anger at God anymore. Right now I suppose it could be best described as feeling fearful of God because I don’t know anything about Him outside of the shadow that he envelopes over me.

 

[Nelka]

I’m feeling furious at God right now…mostly for being so @#*% mysterious and hidden away!

I’m so angry…in my head I can honestly picture myself just hitting Jesus in the gut out of anger…and the thought just leaves me feeling like a filthy animal!

I’m feeling anger and hate for God and myself and I can’t explain it…it makes me want to tear out my hair I feel so broken!

Jesus loves you.

Why do you feel like this?

 

[praxising]

So I have decided I won’t be using the Apologetic board on Catholic Answers, I can’t keep up hearing an occasional truth mixed in with a hundred opinions. Furthermore I’m going to work on reading the Bible and the Catechism before I take on any opinion toward God. I hope when I actually have knowledge about my Lord it will be impossible not to love and honor him.

I’m going to take this slowly though, I feel returning to a Confessional is going to be the hardest part-as I have 3-4 years worth of Sin stacked against me. I will definitely check Scrupulous Anonymous; I feel I will need it.

I want to Thank everyone who responded in this thread, I don’t feel anger at God anymore. Right now I suppose it could be best described as feeling fearful of God because I don’t know anything about Him outside of the shadow that he envelopes over me.

This all sounds very wise and Spirit-inspired. I don’t know if you know this, but it’s not uncommon to have adult but lapsed Catholics go through RCIA with the other seekers. I’m not saying you should run out and sign up, but I wanted you to know it’s an option. Also makes Confession less scary when you go with a group who have decades of sins to take in with them. And then you don’t have to go through the Bible or Catechism without any direction and guidance.

 

[Joseph_Kemp]

You wrote: “I have decided I won’t be using the Apologetic board on Catholic Answers, I can’t keep up hearing an occasional truth mixed in with a hundred opinions.”

This is absolutely the right thing to do. Some accurate information does indeed exist on Catholic Answers. But it can be almost impossible to find. Especially if you are desperately looking, and upset. I would recommend that you make use of Catholic Answers only if you have absolutely no other source of information. It can be very confusing.

You said: ”Furthermore I’m going to work on reading the Bible and the Catechism before I take on any opinion toward God. I hope when I actually have knowledge about my Lord it will be impossible not to love and honor him.”

This is a fine decision. But proceed carefully. New converts and people returning to the faith after many years can sometimes have difficulties with the Bible and the Catechism.

The Catechism, for example, can seem (at times) a little forbidding - little better than an ironclad rulebook. The usual “Don’t do this. Don’t do that. This is sin. That is forbidden.”

This not how the Catechism is to be understood. I spoke to a Vatican Catechist Professor a few years ago. He said very specifically that there is an awful lot of flexibility in the Catechism, as well as in Church Canon Law. Most of it cannot be taken exactly as written.

For instance, there is a section of the Catechism that forbids lying. It sounds really ironclad. But it’s not. Children lie all the time. It’s not a mortal sin. Adults lie often. But it’s often not a mortal sin in any way. Lying can usually be very trivial. But the way some versions of the Catechism put it, it doesn’t sound trivial at all. It can sound like a mortal sin, even though it doesn’t say that. Just keep in mind that this is not how the Catechism is to be taken – as some kind of fearsome rulebook. It is mostly common sense.

The Bible is an immensely complex historical document. It is fine to read it. But make sure you have someone knowledgeable to consult with if it seems harsh or contradictory at times.

One small example. In the New Testament, Jesus asks a rich young man to sell all he owns and give the money to the poor. Christ says “It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter Heaven.” So it would seem that rich people cannot enter Heaven. It is sinful to be rich. But in Proverbs, it says “A fortune gained quickly is quickly spent. But wealth accumulated slowly, steadily grows.” So it would seem that gaining wealth is a sign of wisdom. It is pleasing before God. This would seem to contradict the words of Christ.

And in another Parable (story), the Bible condemns a man who stores up much money for his own comfort. He is sent to Hell (not literally – it is a figurative story.) But in the Parable of the Talents, a different story, God rewards the man who makes much money. He punishes the man who makes nothing.

For every passage that says that being rich is a fine thing, you will find another that says that being rich is bad. Back and forth, back and forth. Contradiction after contradiction. How to resolve it?

First, the Bible must be understood as a unified whole. It cannot be picked apart in pieces. If you read it this way, you will get a very unbalanced, harsh, limited understanding of it. A unified understanding of the Bible is called “exegesis.” You cannot approach the Bible without it.

In my example, the rich young man asked Christ what to do to get to Heaven. Christ told him “You know the Commandments: ‘Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother.’" It is only when the young man pressed Jesus for what else he should do that Christ said: "Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven.”

Thus, keeping the Commandments was all that Christ required for entering Heaven. Nothing else! Until the young man pushed for more.

Being rich is not a bad thing at all. The Catholic Church does not teach that it is. Anyone who says so is wrong. The story of the man who stored up much money for his comfort, and who was sent to Hell (not literally) is interpreted by the Church as simply telling people that one should not forget that one’s wealth comes from God. Nobody should feel threatened by this. Simply remember God. That is all.

And God is certainly not going to punish you for making a lot of money (or perhaps none.) This is simply absurd.

You wrote: “I feel returning to a Confessional is going to be the hardest part-as I have 3-4 years worth of Sin stacked against me. I will definitely check Scrupulous Anonymous; I feel I will need it.”

Scrupulous Anonymous will certainly help with this, and with many things about the Bible and Catholic belief.

There is no need to stress about years of sin. Simply mention what you can in confession. Keep it short. God does not require perfection. Try to be honest and brief. That is all. When the priest has absolved you, DO NOT feel you should go back and confess other sins you might remember. People who are overly worried about sin are advised never to do this. Confession COMPLETELY absolves you of sin, whether you remember all your sins or not.

If you are looking for the answer to a specific question on the Scrupulous Anonymous website, it may take some time to find it. Do not stress about this. Just read patiently. The content is deliberately non-threatening. You will emerge with a much clearer understanding of the gentleness of Catholic belief from this.

Also, reading the Scrupulous Anonymous website can make the Catholic faith look extraordinarily intricate. It isn’t. The problems that people can have with the Church can be very intricate, but the Church itself is very simple. It is very undemanding. Nobody should feel intimidated or stressed about following it.