Annihilation of the Soul

[devonsams]

Is it true that Annihilation of the Soul is a state of Hell that is might be possible in the catholic church?

Let me give an example: an atheist, he assumes and accepts an eternity of soul annihilation without God, and that may be his Hell. I mean, this state of his complete annihilation.

Is anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or something taught by the church that says it might be a possibility? The Immortality of Soul can have an end?

Let me give an example. God created us of the non existence, and they put ourselves into this existence, because he thought that life is a good in potential for people. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair, because he would be obligating someone to live an eternal life, with he didn’t want to be created in first?

Thanks.

 

[fermat]

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

366 The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not “produced” by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at death, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection.235

235 Cf. Pius XII, Humani Generis: DS 3896; Paul VI, CPG § 8; Lateran Council V (1513): DS 1440.

The soul cannot be annihilated or killed. It is as forever as anything gets.

 

[Rudy_Baga]

And when is the soul created? At the moment of conception? Or has the soul existed prior to then?
Jeremiah 1:15 suggest that the soul predates conception. “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

Yet the Catechism says it is created immediately? This is no small deviation for me in my search for truth. To the OP, I find the idea of complete annihilation of the soul hard to imagine or comprehend. How is one uncreated? And if the soul in in error in its desire to be annihilated, will it still so desire when it recognizes that fact after the point of physical death? If we believe that the soul survives beyond the death of the body, then we must agree that consciousness also survives. Once we are no longer bound by the limitations of a physical reality, I have to assume that we recognize spiritual truths the may seem more like mental concepts we choose to believe (or rather agree with…have faith in…) here on earth.

As for the atheist, God and soul survival will exist whether he chooses to believe it or not. He cannot choose to be created and we can surmise that he has little choice in the matter of choosing to be annihilated.

 

[Holly3278]

It is not possible. The Bible attests to the fact that Hell is eternal and so is the suffering in Hell:

"At that time shall arise Michael, the great prince who has charge of your people. And there shall be a time of trouble, such as never has been since there was a nation till that time; but at that time your people shall be delivered, every one whose name shall be found written in the book. And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the firmament; and those who turn many to righteousness, like the stars for ever and ever.
(Daniel 12:1-3 RSV-CE)

And another angel, a third, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If any one worships the beast and its image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, he also shall drink the wine of God’s wrath, poured unmixed into the cup of his anger, and he shall be tormented with fire and sulphur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up for ever and ever; and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”
(Revelation 14:9-11 RSV-CE)

Then he will say to those at his left hand, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels; for I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ Then they also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see thee hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to thee?’ Then he will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it not to one of the least of these, you did it not to me.’ And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."
(Matthew 25:41-46 RSV-CE)

This is evidence of the righteous judgment of God, that you may be made worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are suffering-- since indeed God deems it just to repay with affliction those who afflict you, and to grant rest with us to you who are afflicted, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels in flaming fire, inflicting vengeance upon those who do not know God and upon those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They shall suffer the punishment of eternal destruction and exclusion from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might, when he comes on that day to be glorified in his saints, and to be marveled at in all who have believed, because our testimony to you was believed. To this end we always pray for you, that our God may make you worthy of his call, and may fulfil every good resolve and work of faith by his power, so that the name of our Lord Jesus may be glorified in you, and you in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.
(2 Thessalonians 1:5-12 RSV-CE)

And they marched up over the broad earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city; but fire came down from heaven and consumed them, and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulphur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
(Revelation 20:9-10 RSV-CE)

 

[Bravo_6]

Is it true that Annihilation of the Soul is a state of Hell that is might be possible in the catholic church?

Let me give an example: an atheist, he assumes and accepts an eternity of soul annihilation without God, and that may be his Hell. I mean, this state of his complete annihilation.

Is anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or something taught by the church that says it might be a possibility? The Immortality of Soul can have an end?

Let me give an example. God created us of the non existence, and they put ourselves into this existence, because he thought that life is a good in potential for people. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair, because he would be obligating someone to live an eternal life, with he didn’t want to be created in first?

Thanks.

The soul is immortal.End of story.The soul will, and indeed must, survive the death of the body is demonstrable from many points of view.Firstly, its essential structure forbids dissolution by death. Death is the disintegration of parts. Only composite things can die. Yet the soul is not composite. Its power of pure immaterial thought proves its independence of matter. It is endowed with spiritual faculties, and is as spiritual as the faculties it possesses, which will enable it to live and operate when separated from the body. Not being material, it can never be destroyed or fall to pieces like matter. Nor would God endow it with a nature essentially fitted to live on just for an idle freak, and with the intention of annihilating it after all.Secondly, every individual experiences a sense of moral obligation, and every obligation demands a sufficient sanction. If the State said, “This is the law,” and I replied, “What if I do not observe it,” it would be ludicrous were the State to reply, “Oh, nothing will happen. I say only that it is the law. If you break it, you break it, I suppose.” That would be a joke, not a law. I know that I shall have to answer some day for my attitude towards the interior sense of moral obligation. I can go right through this life without encountering anyone capable of judging me concerning it. The real answer must be given at the judgment seat of God, and my soul will have to be there. Consequently it must survive.Thirdly, a more universal view of human life shows us the many inequalities which offend against the sense of justice. We know that justice will be done some day, and as it is not always done in this life, it will be done in the next. This implies our presence, and therefore our living on after death.Fourthly, every soul naturally has an insatiable natural desire for happiness, and for lasting happiness. No earthly or temporal good can satisfy this hunger. Yet this innate natural tendency cannot lack its rightful object. You might as well try to conceive the existence of the human eye, perfectly adapted to sight, yet without the possibility of light anywhere to enable it to see.Reflection, then, upon the simple structure of the soul, upon the future administration of the sanctions attached to the moral law, upon the rectification of worldwide inequalities, and upon the teleological inclinations to a lasting and perfect good, makes it a violation of reason to deny the survival of the soul.

 

[Dorothy]

And when is the soul created? At the moment of conception? Or has the soul existed prior to then?
Jeremiah 1:15 suggest that the soul predates conception. “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

Yet the Catechism says it is created immediately? This is no small deviation for me in my search for truth. To the OP, I find the idea of complete annihilation of the soul hard to imagine or comprehend. How is one uncreated? And if the soul in in error in its desire to be annihilated, will it still so desire when it recognizes that fact after the point of physical death? If we believe that the soul survives beyond the death of the body, then we must agree that consciousness also survives. Once we are no longer bound by the limitations of a physical reality, I have to assume that we recognize spiritual truths the may seem more like mental concepts we choose to believe (or rather agree with…have faith in…) here on earth.

As for the atheist, God and soul survival will exist whether he chooses to believe it or not. He cannot choose to be created and we can surmise that he has little choice in the matter of choosing to be annihilated.

With regard to Jeremiah 1:15 I have heard that it means that we were in God’s mind before we were conceived. That means He wanted us, created us, loves us and knew when we would be brought into being by His Will. It has nothing to do with the soul being created and waiting to be put into a body.

Origen, a great thinker in the early Church, speculated? that souls existed before the bodies were created. That was considered heretical.

 

[1ke]

Is it true that Annihilation of the Soul is a state of Hell that is might be possible in the catholic church?

No. Hell is eternal. You are on the wrong road here, such an idea is not compatible with Church teaching.

Is anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or something taught by the church that says it might be a possibility? The Immortality of Soul can have an end?

Not to be flip,but you do know the meaning of the word immortal, right? So there’s your answer: NO. The soul is immortal and annihilation is a heretical teaching.

Let me give an example. God created us of the non existence, and they put ourselves into this existence, because he thought that life is a good in potential for people. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair, because he would be obligating someone to live an eternal life, with he didn’t want to be created in first?

Thanks.

Nope.

 

[mercytruth]

Is it true that Annihilation of the Soul is a state of Hell that is might be possible in the catholic church?

Let me give an example: an atheist, he assumes and accepts an eternity of soul annihilation without God, and that may be his Hell. I mean, this state of his complete annihilation.

Is anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or something taught by the church that says it might be a possibility? The Immortality of Soul can have an end?

Let me give an example. God created us of the non existence, and they put ourselves into this existence, because he thought that life is a good in potential for people. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair, because he would be obligating someone to live an eternal life, with he didn’t want to be created in first?

Thanks.

Jesus said, And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell. (Matt.10:28)

What Jesus meant by this, would be speculative.

God’s peace

Micah

 

[mercytruth]

Is it true that Annihilation of the Soul is a state of Hell that is might be possible in the catholic church?

Let me give an example: an atheist, he assumes and accepts an eternity of soul annihilation without God, and that may be his Hell. I mean, this state of his complete annihilation.

Is anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or something taught by the church that says it might be a possibility? The Immortality of Soul can have an end?

Let me give an example. God created us of the non existence, and they put ourselves into this existence, because he thought that life is a good in potential for people. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair, because he would be obligating someone to live an eternal life, with he didn’t want to be created in first?

Thanks.

Knowing the doctrine of the Catholic Church, to be fair, here are the rare exceptions from the quotations of the early church fathers:

But he who shall reject it, and prove himself ungrateful to his Maker, inasmuch as he has been created, and has not recognised Him who bestowed [the gift upon him], deprives himself of [the privilege of] continuance for ever and ever. And, for this reason, the Lord declared to those who showed themselves ungrateful towards Him: If you have not been faithful in that which is little, who will give you that which is great? indicating that those who, in this brief temporal life, have shown themselves ungrateful to Him who bestowed it, shall justly not receive from Him length of days for ever and ever.
Bishop Ireneaus, Against Heresies, Book II, chapter 34

newadvent.org/fathers/0103234.htm

Old Man: But I do not say, indeed, that all souls die; for that were truly a piece of good fortune to the evil. What then? The souls of the pious remain in a better place, while those of the unjust and wicked are in a worse, waiting for the time of judgment. Thus some which have appeared worthy of God never die; but others are punished so long as God wills them to exist and to be punished.
Justin Martyr, Dialogue with Trypho, Chapter V

newadvent.org/fathers/01281.htm

God’s peace

Micah

 

[NeedImprovement]

Is it true that Annihilation of the Soul is a state of Hell that is might be possible in the catholic church?

Let me give an example: an atheist, he assumes and accepts an eternity of soul annihilation without God, and that may be his Hell. I mean, this state of his complete annihilation.

Is anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or something taught by the church that says it might be a possibility? The Immortality of Soul can have an end?

Let me give an example. God created us of the non existence, and they put ourselves into this existence, because he thought that life is a good in potential for people. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair, because he would be obligating someone to live an eternal life, with he didn’t want to be created in first?

Thanks.

Nonexistence is not a state. For the condition of state, it is prerequisite that a substance or thing exist , whether spiritually or in the corporeal, or as in man’s case, both.

The definition of a state is a “condition or mode of being with regard to circumstances” – it indicates a form of existence . Nonexistence is absence of being.

The human body may be mortal, but each soul whom God breathes into the womb at the moment of conception, is immortal.

We are not permitted to take our own life or the life of another, because we are not the author of that life.

Furthermore ,when faced with eternity, after the moment of death, it is questionable whether a soul would ever desire this

. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair,

Rather preposterous to presume that a soul in Hell would ever be given the choice : Which would you rather hear God pronounce to you ? . . . –

“Be gone from my sight”, or “Be no more!”

Apart from the fact that a person would have to be asking God to “kill” them eternally, it is inordinately lopsided to assert that if God does not do this He is unfair. The only just judge is God. Any being who is in Hell is there because they chose it and because , according to justice, they deserve it and they are fully aware of the consequences God has already previously offered the soul – even at the final moment ,His Mercy as the way to avoid Hell. If the soul rejects God’s Mercy, then according to justice, the sentence must be served . Allowing a soul to duck out of serving that sentence without any intention of ever making reparation is actually what is unfair in terms of justice . You would be asking God to kill you

The “people who want to return to that nonexistence” are , as far as any of us know, well . . . ummm. . . nonexistent, :shrug ; simply because no one has ever gone to Hell to take a poll and return with the results.

From Modern Catholic Dictionary, Fr. John Hardon, S.J.
STATE OF BEING. The way in which a thing manifests its existence or the condition in which people find themselves under given circumstances. As such, state merely indicates a form of existence that has little or no relation to space or time. Thus the state of a person in divine grace, or in grave sin or, after death, in heaven, hell, or purgatory identifies the spiritual condition of the soul independent of matter or external factors.
ANNIHILATION. The act of wiping out the existence of something. According to the Christian faith, as God has freely created the whole universe, he is also free to annihilate any or all of it through withdrawing of his preserving influence and so allow it to relapse into nothingness. However, revelation teaches that, in point of fact, God has no intention of annihilating what he made. Even the material universe, it is believed, will not be put out of existence but will only be drastically changed.
SUICIDE. The direct killing of oneself on one’s own authority. It is a grave sin against the natural and revealed law. The suicide offends against the divine precept “You shall not kill.” One causes grave injury to the welfare of society and violates the virtue of charity to oneself. God is the supreme and exclusive owner of all things, so that exercising ownership over life is lawful only to God. He alone can take human life when he wills. The one who directly takes his or her own life violates the rights of God. (Etym. Latin sui, self + cidium, a killing.)

 

[NeedImprovement]

Is it true that Annihilation of the Soul is a state of Hell that is might be possible in the catholic church?

Let me give an example: an atheist, he assumes and accepts an eternity of soul annihilation without God, and that may be his Hell. I mean, this state of his complete annihilation.

Is anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or something taught by the church that says it might be a possibility? The Immortality of Soul can have an end?

Let me give an example. God created us of the non existence, and they put ourselves into this existence, because he thought that life is a good in potential for people. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair, because he would be obligating someone to live an eternal life, with he didn’t want to be created in first?

Thanks.

Nonexistence is not a state. For the condition of state, it is prerequisite that a substance or thing exist , whether spiritually or in the corporeal, or as in man’s case, both.

The definition of a state is a “condition or mode of being with regard to circumstances” – it indicates a form of existence . Nonexistence is absence of being.

As several members have already said :The human body may be mortal, but each soul whom God breathes into the womb at the moment of conception, is immortal.

We are not permitted to take our own life or the life of another, because we are not the author of that life.

Furthermore ,when faced with eternity, after the moment of death, it is questionable whether a soul would ever desire this

. But what about the people who wants to return to that non existence? God could give them the right to unexist forever, back to the original state if they want, right? Because if God couldn’t, he would be unfair,

Rather preposterous to suggest that a soul in Hell would ever be given the following choice : Which would you rather hear God pronounce to you after you’ve rejected Him and His Mercy ? . . . –

• “Be gone from my sight”, or
• “Be no more!”

Apart from the fact that a person would have to be asking God to “kill” them eternally, it is considerably lopsided to assert that if God does not do this He is unfair uch:. The only just judge is God. Any being who is in Hell is there because they chose it and because , according to justice, they deserve it and they are fully aware of the consequences.

God has already previously offered the soul – even at the final moment ,His Mercy as the way to avoid Hell. If the soul rejects God’s Mercy, then according to justice, the sentence must be served . Allowing a soul to duck out of serving that sentence without any intention of ever making reparation is actually much more congruent with what would be considered unfair in the eyes of justice . The “people who want to return to that nonexistence” are , as far as any of us know, well . . . ummm. . . nonexistent, ; simply because no one has ever gone to Hell to take a poll and return with the results.

From Modern Catholic Dictionary, Fr. John Hardon, S.J.

STATE OF BEING. The way in which a thing manifests its existence or the condition in which people find themselves under given circumstances. As such, state merely indicates a form of existence that has little or no relation to space or time. Thus the state of a person in divine grace, or in grave sin or, after death, in heaven, hell, or purgatory identifies the spiritual condition of the soul independent of matter or external factors.

ANNIHILATION. The act of wiping out the existence of something. According to the Christian faith, as God has freely created the whole universe, he is also free to annihilate any or all of it through withdrawing of his preserving influence and so allow it to relapse into nothingness. However, revelation teaches that, in point of fact, God has no intention of annihilating what he made. Even the material universe, it is believed, will not be put out of existence but will only be drastically changed.

SUICIDE. The direct killing of oneself on one’s own authority. It is a grave sin against the natural and revealed law. The suicide offends against the divine precept “You shall not kill.” One causes grave injury to the welfare of society and violates the virtue of charity to oneself. God is the supreme and exclusive owner of all things, so that exercising ownership over life is lawful only to God. He alone can take human life when he wills. The one who directly takes his or her own life violates the rights of God. (Etym. Latin sui, self + cidium, a killing.)

 

[fred_conty]

The bible says that God created everything and that it was good. It was good because it came from God who is all good. So nothing that was made was anything but good.

Therefore man is good. But man is more than just good, he is spirit as well. Being spirit, made in the image of God who is spirit, he cannot corrupt and therefore cannot non exist. Since his spirit is good and it was made to always exist by its nature being of spirit, God would not annihilate his spirit since that would be the same as God changing his mind, or making a mistake, and rubbing out something he intended to last for the rest of eternity. But God dosen’t make mistakes. So man is everlasting and will not be a nothing.

But then it might be said that some men have become evil and therefore should be annihilated since they are no longer good as God made them.

But this is a misunderstanding. Evil men are good in the absolute sense of being men, the only thing that has changed is that of their own condition, not their actual being. Even they are good in their being. They are evil only in the sense that they no longer have the accidental grace in their soul.
But this dosen’t change them essentially or in their being. As beings they still give glory to God as creations of God, created in his image of spirit.

From their point of view they would probably say, “it would have been better for me never to have been born.”

Just a thought.