Are Lucifer and Satan the same?

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Little_One0307

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Hi All,

I had a question. Are Satan and Lucifer the same? I have heard some people say that they are, and some say that they are different. I know that Satanists believe them to be two different entities if you will. Does Church Tradition have anything to say of this? I know that the book Interview with an exorcist, the author said that Satan and Lucifer are two different demons. He is not the only one who holds this position.

I do not need opinions here, I need some good Church documents if I may ask for them. Please if you got any references or citations by all means post them here.

God Bless

Little One0307
 
Little_One0307 said:
I do not need opinions here, I need some good Church documents if I may ask for them.
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Sorry, you will not find any such documents cited here. The Deposit of Faith entrusted to the Church does not include titles for the devil. The Church has no doctrine in this regard.
 
DavidFilmer said:
Sorry, you will not find any such documents cited here. The Deposit of Faith entrusted to the Church does not include titles for the devil. The Church has no doctrine in this regard.
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I think that David is correct. In general, the Church does not spend her time studying demons. Certain individuals, such as exorcists, may have encountered information which is not widely known. They may or may not be correct.

The fight against the devil is not the usual type of battle. Knowledge of our enemy is not useful. Knowledge of God and how to achieve His grace is the only knowledge that helps. God has all power.
 
Interesting question. I did a quick bit of research on the terms and came up with this.

Lucifer is the name of the angel who led the revolt in heaven. It is rendered “heylel” in Hebrew and means “Morning Star” So the term Lucifer refers to the name of a specific individual creature - in this case the leader of the fallen angels.

Satan appears to be a more General term.
According to “Strong’s Concordance” Satan derives from the Hebrew for “Arch-enemy” or “opponent”. In the Greek there appears to be several different words that are rendered “Satan” in translation.
See thse links for HEBREW and GREEK

Hope that helps.

Peace
James
 
Thanks for responding guys. And yes JRKH that does help. I just was thinking about this question the other day at 0300 hrs lol and so decided to write it in.

God Bless.
 
JRKH said:
Lucifer is the name of the angel who led the revolt in heaven. It is rendered “heylel” in Hebrew and means “Morning Star” So the term Lucifer refers to the name of a specific individual creature - in this case the leader of the fallen angels.
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The morning star is more commonly associated with the Roman god, Mars. Is there any connection, however indirect?
 
Now that you guys brought up the title Morning Star? Why and how did The Blessed Virgin get this title? I have heard many interpreations, but am unable to find the Church’s official teaching. I have done much searching for this and cannot find a satisfactory answer.

Thanks guys. God Bless.

Little One0307
 
just some extra info for those interested in demonology,

There is only 1 scriptural reference to Lucifer (Isa 14:12) and is the Latin translation ‘light-bearer’ (cf. Vulgate) whereas the title Satan has numerous references from Job in the O.T. to the being who tempts and attacks Jesus (N.T.) and hinders Paul’s missionary activity and is the power behind false miracles during the coming of the anti-christ (2 Thess.2:9).

There is a malevolent power in our world who is aligned against us but should be seen as defeated by the Cross (Col.2:15)

And we have been “rescued…from the dominion of darkness and brought … into the kingdom of the Son He loves, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.”(Col.1:13-14)👍
 
Little_One0307 said:
Now that you guys brought up the title Morning Star? Why and how did The Blessed Virgin get this title? I have heard many interpreations, but am unable to find the Church’s official teaching. I have done much searching for this and cannot find a satisfactory answer.

Thanks guys. God Bless.

Little One0307
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You won’t find anything in the Church’s official teachings because AFAIK there is nothing.

Some of the mystics of the Middle Ages conjectured on such matters and made associations such as seven days of the week = the seven planets (that were known at the time) = seven colours in the rainbow = seven notes on the musical octave and lots of other things that in light of today’s scientific knowledge don’t make much sense and are at best pure coincidence or at worse seeking connections where there obviously aren’t any. Thus they associated each of the visible planets with a saint or angel. Like a lot of mysiticism, this was mostly pure speculation and not based on any Church teachings or biblical evidence. Therefore it is just that, interesting trivia but there is nothing canonical about it.
 
Scripture and Tradition do call the devil “satan”, the Hebrew word for “adversary.” That’s the only proper name that comes to us by divine revelation for the evil one.

Lucifer comes from the Vulgate of Isaiah 14:12 referring to the king of Babylon who fell from the sky (Heb. heleyl, “daystar”) and is a common, not proper noun. It is not a revealed name for the devil (and if I remember right, was not used for the devil before the middle ages). In fact, there was a Catholic bishop named Lucifer with his diocese in Cagliari in Sardinia (where he is revered as a saint), who strongly opposed the Arian heresy and led a small schism around the time of St. Jerome.
 
porthos11 said:
Scripture and Tradition do call the devil “satan”, the Hebrew word for “adversary.” That’s the only proper name that comes to us by divine revelation for the evil one.

Lucifer comes from the Vulgate of Isaiah 14:12 referring to the king of Babylon who fell from the sky (Heb. heleyl, “daystar”) and is a common, not proper noun. It is not a revealed name for the devil (and if I remember right, was not used for the devil before the middle ages). In fact, there was a Catholic bishop named Lucifer with his diocese in Cagliari in Sardinia (where he is revered as a saint), who strongly opposed the Arian heresy and led a small schism around the time of St. Jerome.
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Porthos11,

Interesting. Thanks for sharing.

If I find anything on why Mary is given the title Morning Star, I sure will post it in this thread or start another topic.

Little One0307
 
john_aurelius said:
just some extra info for those interested in demonology,

There is only 1 scriptural reference to Lucifer (Isa 14:12) and is the Latin translation ‘light-bearer’ (cf. Vulgate) whereas the title Satan has numerous references from Job in the O.T. to the being who tempts and attacks Jesus (N.T.) and hinders Paul’s missionary activity and is the power behind false miracles during the coming of the anti-christ (2 Thess.2:9).

There is a malevolent power in our world who is aligned against us but should be seen as defeated by the Cross (Col.2:15)

And we have been “rescued…from the dominion of darkness and brought … into the kingdom of the Son He loves, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.”(Col.1:13-14)👍
Click to expand...
👍
 
I have known all my life that Lucifer was the arch-angel who rebelled against God and was cast out of heaven and given the name Satan. Surely Christians of all kinds have known this from the year dot.

I see no reason to change my belief on this one, even though I have needed to change a great many beliefs when I converted to the Catholic faith.
 
Yes, the point that some early Christians were NAMED Lucifer is an excellent point. No one is named Lucifer in the bible, not even Satan before his fall. Lucifer in the bible is simply a description referring to the "day-star.’ In fact in the Latin Vulgate, the same bible from which we get Lucifer in Isaiah 14:12, we get in 2 Peter 1:19:
Code: 
et habemus firmiorem propheticum sermonem cui bene facitis adtendentes quasi lucernae lucenti in caliginoso loco donec dies inlucescat et **lucifer **oriatur in cordibus vestris
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The English Translation being:
Code: 
And so, we have an even firmer prophetic word, to which you would do well to listen, as to a light shining within a dark place, until the day dawns, and the **daystar [Lucifer]** rises, in your hearts.
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Hence, even Our Lord Himself is called lucifer in the Sacred Scripture.

Any belief that Lucifer was/is the proper name of Satan is foolish, and largely based on the King James Version in Isaiah 14:12, where it keeps the Latin word lucifer
 
All Interesting stuff.
What a great thread to come out of a seemingly simple question…👍

Peace
James
 
Mary’s title of “morning star” (stella matutina) is about her holiness being bright, but of course not nearly as bright as that of the Sun of Justice, Jesus. The morning star is seen before the Sun comes up, also, and thus announces the dawn as Mary announced Jesus’ coming to Joseph and to Elizabeth, in the Magnificat.

In the common wordplay game/poetic/rhetorical device of making up etymologies for Biblical names, it was very common in the Middle Ages (and maybe earlier) to claim that Mary’s name “came from” stella matutina, stella maris/marina, and so forth. Sometimes Esther got brought into it, because “Esther” means “star”. (People knew from the Bible the Hebrew stuff about Mary coming from “bitter” and “sea water”, Miriam, etc.)

(Before anyone asks, “star of the sea” (stella maris) refers to Mary’s example and prayers as a sort of guiding star in times of trouble.)
 
Mintaka said:
Mary’s title of “morning star” (stella matutina) is about her holiness being bright, but of course not nearly as bright as that of the Sun of Justice, Jesus. The morning star is seen before the Sun comes up, also, and thus announces the dawn as Mary announced Jesus’ coming to Joseph and to Elizabeth, in the Magnificat.

In the common wordplay game/poetic/rhetorical device of making up etymologies for Biblical names, it was very common in the Middle Ages (and maybe earlier) to claim that Mary’s name “came from” stella matutina, stella maris/marina, and so forth. Sometimes Esther got brought into it, because “Esther” means “star”. (People knew from the Bible the Hebrew stuff about Mary coming from “bitter” and “sea water”, Miriam, etc.)

(Before anyone asks, “star of the sea” (stella maris) refers to Mary’s example and prayers as a sort of guiding star in times of trouble.)
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Mintaka,

Hi. Morning. Thanks for posting this. I had never thought of that. And thanks for posting the title Mary star of the sea, because that was my next question to whomever posted this answer. Thanks for taking the time to look for it.

JRKH,

Yeah you know where all this started was reading the Ritual of Excorcism that addresses both Satan and I believe Lucifer, though I have to go and read it to make sure. I was reading the Scriptures too.

And of course thrown in thinking about it at 0300 hrs. 😉

God bless.

Little One0307
 
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