Are mental illnesses problems with our souls?

[rose.gold]

I’m not sure if I sound really stupid or if this is a valid question. Humans have souls and bodies. Souls are made up of intellect, will, and passions. Mental illnesses are problems with our minds (intellect?). So are mental illnesses spiritual problems since they’re not physical problems? Are they problems with our souls and not our bodies? Does that mean some souls have defects that don’t have anything to do with sin? I’m sorry if I’m not even being clear and if I sound dumb lol. But can someone help me understand this?

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

Mental illness and it’s causes are poorly understood.

ATM, it appears that in some diagnoses, there is a chemical or wiring malfunction (ie schizophrenia).

Some illnesses seem to alter brain function over time (addictions).

And others seem to have a huge component of wrong thinking that got cemented by life experiences and environment, but with possibly some inborn tendency towards it (like Borderline personality disorders).

But remember, our souls, minds and bodies are all interconnected, do distress in one area can have a ripple effect in another, and OTOH, healing in one area can also ripple effect in a good way.

We can’t give medical advice here, so if you or your loved one is in significant distress, please contact your doctor.

 

[FiveLinden]

No, they are not. They are problems with our brains and associated biochemical processes. In some cases they may appear as problems but are actually qualities preserved by evolutionary processes because people with those qualities contribute to group survival in some circumstances.

I did not realise that ‘intellect’ is considered a ‘spiritual’ quality in Catholic teaching. Is it? If so, why does it vary between people?

 

[CelticWarlord]

I’m sorry if I’m not even being clear and if I sound dumb lol

My dear friend, I have suffered from mental and emotional illness my whole adult life. I always assure people that there is no such thing as a dumb question when entering this arena. The first two responses answer your question most adequately so I won’t add anything more. But ask any further questions if you’d like.

 

[umamibella]

Mental illnesses have physical sources in many cases, just as physical illnesses have.

It is very rare that a mental illness is not really a mental illness and is really a person in need of exorcism.

 

[rose.gold]

Thanks guys!!

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

I did not realise that ‘intellect’ is considered a ‘spiritual’ quality in Catholic teaching. Is it?

In some older writings you can see references to it, and it means learning about God and applying what you know.

It’s a case of language shift, kind of like the way “curiosity” was considered a vice in the olden day’s, but the definition meant being a busybody, rather than being interested in learning how the world works.

 

[Vico]

…

Saint Thomas Aquinas gives in the Summa Theologiae that intellect, senses, will, and sense-appetite together constitute the soul’s completed intellectual power as an intellectual substance. The affections of the sensitive appetite are most properly called passions of the soul.

 

[Anrakyr]

Saint Thomas Aquinas give in the Summa Theologiae that intellect, senses, will, and sense-appetite together constitute the soul’s completed intellectual power as an intellectual substance. The affections of the sensitive appetite are most properly called passions of the soul .

Tread lightly.

 

[FiveLinden]

Thank you…

 

[AlbMagno]

That’s why I never liked Catholics citing Thomas Aquinas’ definition of a soul. His description of passions contradicts what we know of neurotransmitters, his description of intellect contradicts what we know of rationality, etc.

At this point, they usually answer that the brain somehow “connects” the soul faculties’ to the body, but they don’t realize that then they are approaching the same “Ghost in the machine” soul that Theologians always criticize.

To me, it would make much more sense to clasify the soul by its will and its capacity to make moral choices. Because that is what a soul surely is: counciousness and pure will, not intelligence necessarily, not feelings.

 

[blackforest]

Agreed. While holding steadfast to Scripture, reason, and tradition, Catholicism must necessarily morph as our understanding of science evolves.

 

[TK421]

That’s why I never liked Catholics citing Thomas Aquinas’ definition of a soul. His description of passions contradicts what we know of neurotransmitters, his description of intellect contradicts what we know of rationality, etc.

At this point, they usually answer that the brain somehow “connects” the soul faculties’ to the body, but they don’t realize that then they are approaching the same “Ghost in the machine” soul that Theologians always criticize.

To me, it would make much more sense to clasify the soul by its will and its capacity to make moral choices. Because that is what a soul surely is: counciousness and pure will, not intelligence necessarily, not feelings.

Another way to look at the brain is as a filter or a restraint. For one person who was put into a vegetative state from severe meningitis and whose cerebral cortex was dark on the medical charts (Eben Alexander) he had a mystical experience and traveled to Heaven and he was able to absorb information and concepts instantaneously in what normally would have taken years on Earth with a material brain. So according to that account, the soul is indeed the seat of a person’s true intellect and the brain is more of a filter to prevent the soul from absorbing knowledge and information instantaneously.

 

[AlbMagno]

That sounds reasonable, but the problem is, if the brain is a filter, and absorbing knowledge instantaneously isn’t necessarily bad (look at Angels), then why does God need to resurrect our brain? Wouldn’t our brain then act as a “crutch” to our true intellect in the Soul? We would end up in a sort of “Ghost in the machine” again.

That’s why I think, that the only meaningful way to clasify the body and the soul is to recognize them with different functions, complementing, but not sharing operations. That way, both the soul and the body would be necessary to have a “complete” human being.

 

[AlbMagno]

That’s where some Scholastics recoursed to the “Deus ex machina” to explain how a defunct person could think before the Resurrection. From what I’ve read in other threads, their answer is that God miraculously provides them with the faculty of thinking.

My personal opinion (this is not part of the Magisterium) is that Resurrection is still necessary for our mind to be whole; but, as souls enter into Eternity at death, they experience the general Resurrection instantaneously (yeah, I am denying the Beatific Vision, that’s the biggest hole to the theory…).

 

[Lost_Sheep]

I’m not sure if I sound really stupid or if this is a valid question. Humans have souls and bodies. Souls are made up of intellect, will, and passions. Mental illnesses are problems with our minds (intellect?). So are mental illnesses spiritual problems since they’re not physical problems? Are they problems with our souls and not our bodies? Does that mean some souls have defects that don’t have anything to do with sin? I’m sorry if I’m not even being clear and if I sound dumb lol. But can someone help me understand this?

First of all, there is no such thing as a Dumb Question, except maybe “Isn’t it about time you IRS people audited my return?”

Secondly, having suffered Clinical Depression nearly all my life I happen to know a little about the subject. So I will offer a layman’s explanation rather than a medical professional’s explanation.

Back in the old days, people were hesitant to use the term “Mental Illness” because of the stigma it carried so the term “Chemical Imbalance” was often politely substituted. But the term “Chemical Imbalance” really isn’t too far off the mark.

Years ago, Medical Science believed that the brain ran on an ongoing process of electrical impulses. Today, it is believed that the brain runs on a continuous series of chemical reactions. One of the key chemicals in this process is called Serotonin. I like to describe Serotonin as being “inversely similar” to Cholesterol. Your body needs Cholesterol and your body manufactures Cholesterol. Too much Cholesterol however can cause things like Heart Disease.

Like Cholesterol your body needs Serotonin. Your brain needs Serotonin and your brain manufactures Serotonin. But unlike Cholesterol, where too much can cause a problem, too little Serotonin can cause problems such as depression. So just as you may take a Statin-type medicine to lower Cholesterol, a medicine is often prescribed to raise, or at least maintain, a proper Serotonin level.

Other than things like Diet and Exercise, which are always prescribed as a way to better one’s health, there are, generally speaking, two types of drugs to help keep Serotonin levels elevated. One is something like Tryptophan which will stimulate the brain’s production of Serotonin so as to increase Serotonin levels, or some kind of Serotonin reuptake inhibitor (often called SSRIs for "Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor ") which slows down the brain’s consumption of Serotonin so as keep Serotonin at it’s desirable level.

But back to your original question, no, Mental Illness is not a problem with the Soul. But rather, as explained above, Mental Illness is really a physical disorder that manifests itself in the form of depressive illnesses. Now for some people this depressive illness may cause them to have irrational thoughts (“God doesn’t love me”, etc.) leading one to wrongly conclude that Mental Illness is a matter of faith (or lack thereof).

So to conclude, Mental Illness is not a problem with the Soul, but rather “problems with the Soul” might be the result of Mental Illness.

My Two-Cents. Hope it helps.

 

[tuffsmurf]

Most mental illnesses are at least partly hereditary. Many can be treated with medicine and some, like psychosis, are visible on brain scans. It is not a “spiritual defect”, but of course living with a mental illness can affect your spiritual life, just like if you are living with a serious somatic illness.

 

[Montrose]

I did not realise that ‘intellect’ is considered a ‘spiritual’ quality in Catholic teaching. Is it? If so, why does it vary between people?

Modern Catholic Dictionary:

INTELLECT. The spiritual power of cognition, knowing reality in a nonmaterial way. The faculty of thinking in a way essentially higher than with the senses and the imagination. It is possessed by human beings, disembodied souls, and the angels, both good and demonic.

 

[Vico]

AlbMagno:

To me, it would make much more sense to clasify the soul by its will and its capacity to make moral choices

How can “the soul” make any choices at all when the brain is asleep? It seems a soul should always be operational.

Aquinas thought that due to the nature of the human mind, it must intellectually depend on the senses, for otherwise it would be extremely difficult to function at all naturally.

 

[GEddie]

The human mind we perceive – both our own, and those of others – is not properly the soul, but the intersection between the soul and the head of the body.

As such, mental issues can arise from either side of that intersection, most often the body, as that is subject to the effects of mortality.

ICXC NIKA