Are SSPX and ICKSP Propers the same for tomorrow’s Sunday Latin Mass?

[holy_roamer]

I believe that tomorrow is the 14th Sunday after Pentecost? Here is the SSPX link that someone here on the forum gave me:

angelqueen.org/missal/

Someone else told me that these Propers are not always the same. Is that true?

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[tradcathconvert]

They should be the same.

 

[holy_roamer]

They should be the same.

I’m just a Charismatic who got interested in Saint Margaret Mary Alacoque’s indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Without opening a can of worms, I have stumbled on a few inconsistencies. Besides the SSPX and ICKSP Propers there also is the Gregorian Chant Propers that are sung by Saint Paul’s Episcopal Church Choir twice a month during our Tridentine Mass at Saint Margaret Mary Catholic Church. Here is the link for that choir informing us about their twice a month:

pacificcollegium.org/about.html

Most of the Gregorian Chants are the same as the Chants listed at the Saint Benedict Monastery in Brazil. Here is that link:

198.62.75.1/www2/cantgreg/calend_ensaios_eng.html

Anyway, we are having a lot of fun, and the Protestant Choir does sound more professional, plus they have Concerts.

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[AcaciaFern]

The Pacific Collegium Choir last sang at St. Margaret Mary Church on July 1, 2007, and are scheduled to sing there today (September 2) at the 12:30 PM mass. In the rest of July and August we had the random people who sing when no one else is scheduled. The Propers are all from the Liber Usualis.

 

[holy_roamer]

The Pacific Collegium Choir last sang at St. Margaret Mary Church on July 1, 2007, and are scheduled to sing there today (September 2) at the 12:30 PM mass. In the rest of July and August we had the random people who sing when no one else is scheduled. The Propers are all from the Liber Usualis.

Dang, I had to miss Mass yesterday, so I missed the Pacific Collegium Choir.

It was time to give my wife some equal time and go to a Charismatic Church with her. Otherwise, I would have to change my handle to holy_divorce. She knows hundreds of Protestants there because of her working at a private Christian school for the past 19 years.

How will I know you when I am at Saint Margaret Mary? I always meditate at the Saint Margaret Mary Alacoque Shrine up at front on the right side. You will be able to see that I am a Charismatic.

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[bpbasilphx]

Here’s a little known fact: The propers sung by the Choir (Introit, Gradual, etc) are taken from the Liber Usualis or Graduale Romanum, and are not always exactly the same as those given in the Altar edition of the Missale Romanum.

Sometimes they are mere textual variants (one version of the Psalms used instead of another), and sometimes they are quite different.

 

[Swiss_Guard]

SSPX and ICR say the same Mass, so it would be the same.

The only time it wouldn’t be the same is on a Sunday ICR celebrates a particular feast for their order. For example, the last Sunday in May ICR says the Mass for the Divine Infant of Prague. They may also say the Mass of St. Francis de Sales if it falls on a Sunday since he is one of their patrons.

 

[holy_roamer]

AcaciaFern , bpbasilphx , and tradcathconvert thanks a million. I need all the help that I can get.

I found part of my problem in finding the correct Gregorian Chants.

At the bottom of the last chant page (Kyie, Gloria, Sanchus, Agnus) in the Booklet Missal from St. Margaret Mary’s it says, “Graduale Romanum, 1974 Edition Abbaye Saint-Pierre De Solesmes, France. I have been getting my Kyriale from Saint Benedicts in Brazil. Maybe they are different?

Here is the link from Brazil:

198.62.75.1/www2/cantgreg/kyriale_eng.html

This page from Brazil gives about 17 different sets, and I don’t know which set is the same one as the Booklet Missal? Can anyone help me?

I missed last Sunday, but I was there the week before. I recognized some of the Gregorian Chants from this page for that Sunday from Brazil:

198.62.75.1/www2/cantgreg/trid_dXIIIpostPentecosten.html

For sure, the choir sang (Respice, Domine) from the above page at St. Benedict’s. They also rehearsed it before Mass. I also recognized the Alleluia (Domine, refugium) and was able to sing along with the chorus only. Humble beginnings, but as a Charismatic when I know the melody I can sing along whether or not I know the Latin Words.

I am in the infant stages, so any help at all will be greatly appreciated.

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[holy_roamer]

SSPX and ICR say the same Mass, so it would be the same.

The only time it wouldn’t be the same is on a Sunday ICR celebrates a particular feast for their order. For example, the last Sunday in May ICR says the Mass for the Divine Infant of Prague. They may also say the Mass of St. Francis de Sales if it falls on a Sunday since he is one of their patrons.

Thanks for the help, because the Bulletin only gives the current Sunday High Mass and the following weekday Low Masses. If next Sunday’s Mass is listed in the Bulletin I haven’t found it yet.

When I search the Internet I get a lot of political stuff about the Traditional Latin Mass. I try to avoid the politics, because it destroys my testimony. Charismatics are non-denominational, so we could care less about who belongs where. But of course, I should know who is who in order to keep out of trouble. Like, is the FSSP the same organization as the SSPX?

There is no less than 3 Traditional Tridentine Latin Masses within easy driving distance from where I live. There are two ICKSP Catholic Churches, one in Oakland and one in San Jose. Then there is one SSPX in Los Gatos. But, there is no FSSP listed, that is why I’m wondering if SSPX is the same as FSSP, because they both have SSP?

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[AJV]

Here’s a little known fact: The propers sung by the Choir (Introit, Gradual, etc) are taken from the Liber Usualis or Graduale Romanum, and are not always exactly the same as those given in the Altar edition of the Missale Romanum.

Sometimes they are mere textual variants (one version of the Psalms used instead of another), and sometimes they are quite different.

This is interesting! Could you expand more on it, please? I mean the quite different ones.

I’ve heard of some, like the Stigmata of St. Francis but I thought they had mostly been cleared up in the 1920 and 1953 Missals

 

[holy_roamer]

Questions-Questions-Questions? This Thursday, the 6th, is marked on your calendar as, “Thursday before First Friday - Holy Hour 7:00 PM” . Then, First Friday Sacred Heart Devotions on Friday the 7th. Will these devotions be part of the Tridentine Latin Mass?

Is it customary for Saint Margaret Mary’s Church devotionals to practice the Third Vision and lie prostrate for an hour, face to the earth? Any faith healing going on? Like, has there been any of the miracles and healing at your church that were recorded with events surrounding Saint Margaret Mary Alacoque?

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[holy_roamer]

While searching the Internet I found that according to the European interpretation, Margaret Mary’s hour lying prostrate was from eleven to midnight on the eve of the first Friday. That would be Thursday evening at 11:00 PM. Your Church Bulletin says, “Thursday before First Friday - Holy Hour 7:00 PM, so that’s pretty close. It only missed the European interpretation my 4 hours.

Margaret Mary was inspired by Christ to establish the Holy Hour and to pray lying prostrate with her face to the ground from eleven till midnight on the eve of the first Friday of each month, to share in the mortal sadness.

Here is the link for that Quote:

ewtn.com/new_evangelization/europe/holiness/saints3.htm

Are we going to do this?

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[holy_roamer]

This is interesting! Could you expand more on it, please? I mean the quite different ones.

I’ve heard of some, like the Stigmata of St. Francis but I thought they had mostly been cleared up in the 1920 and 1953 Missals

I was at church last night and found a professional looking Guide to Responses from last Sundays High Mass with the Pacific Collegium Choir. I can scan it if you want, because it’s not marked copy write. The Kyrie, Gloria, and Sanctus were all Mass XI - Orbis factor. Agnus Dei was also Mass XI. The choir is from Saint Paul’s Episcopal Church.

I have been having trouble getting on the same page with that church. Last night was the eve of the First Friday, so I went up to the shrine and laid prostrate for an hour with my face to the earth like Saint Margaret Mary did on the eve of First Friday. While laying there I could hear that that their First Thursday service was a special prayer for their priests, religious & seminarians. Luckily, I didn’t disrupt the service, because I was behind a short wall up at the shrine where no one could see me. As a holy roller I have spent many hours on the floor praying, so it was like old times. I left the service feeling like a new person again. These Internet Forums can drag me down sometimes.

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