Are we supposed to be kind to others or persecute them for their beliefs?

[confusedgirl]

Online you will see it everywhere people being bullied for what they believe. I cannot even say things like Jesus died for all of us so that we all have a chance. The protestants swarm in like an angry pack of wolves on me. They’re all like where in the bible does it say that? (John 3:16 btw) It is like when you are kind to someone as a Christian you are seen as a traitor to them I guess? As if being catholic isn’t on reason for them to start something they need to find more. I don’t know if it is a need to convert people to whatever it is they believe but I wouldn’t want join a church that says I have to be mean to people?

Anyways I was told that I give Christianity a bad name because I don’t go up to Muslims and tell them they are going to hell even though the bible does say that judgment is God’s alone. I find that you win more souls by showing God’s mercy, grace, love, patience and everything else good to others than telling them that they are going to hell. I don’t think people followed Jesus because they were terrified of going to hell but because they saw him as someone that they could follow and saw him as someone that loved them and loved him in return. Jesus talks about love all throughout the gospels and somewhere down the road some people decided it was their job to inform people that they were going to hell.

Can anyone tell me the reason why people feel this need. Does the bible teach this? I mean the bible says that we are justified by our works and not only by our faith and a lot of churches don’t teach that… I know this may seem like a sola scriptura thing but I mean it more as are we supposed to just follow the bible or follow the love of Jesus?
It seems like a silly question when I ask it that way. Please be kind… I am still in training afterall

 

[MacQ]

Online you will see it everywhere people being bullied for what they believe. I cannot even say things like Jesus died for all of us so that we all have a chance. The protestants swarm in like an angry pack of wolves on me. They’re all like where in the bible does it say that? (John 3:16 btw) It is like when you are kind to someone as a Christian you are seen as a traitor to them I guess? As if being catholic isn’t on reason for them to start something they need to find more. I don’t know if it is a need to convert people to whatever it is they believe but I wouldn’t want join a church that says I have to be mean to people?

Anyways I was told that I give Christianity a bad name because I don’t go up to Muslims and tell them they are going to hell even though the bible does say that judgment is God’s alone. I find that you win more souls by showing God’s mercy, grace, love, patience and everything else good to others than telling them that they are going to hell. I don’t think people followed Jesus because they were terrified of going to hell but because they saw him as someone that they could follow and saw him as someone that loved them and loved him in return. Jesus talks about love all throughout the gospels and somewhere down the road some people decided it was their job to inform people that they were going to hell.

Can anyone tell me the reason why people feel this need. Does the bible teach this? I mean the bible says that we are justified by our works and not only by our faith and a lot of churches don’t teach that… I know this may seem like a sola scriptura thing but I mean it more as are we supposed to just follow the bible or follow the love of Jesus?
It seems like a silly question when I ask it that way. Please be kind… I am still in training afterall

First of all (and most important thing I’ll say): May God bless you on your journey!

I may be wrong about this, but I don’t think that all or even most mainstream protestants are anti-catholic, although they obviously privately (or sometimes publicly) disagree with some of our beliefs and doctrines…much of the time that’s due to their having been told something that is not so (that we don’t honor scripture for example)…and often it’s just that they misunderstand (that we’re not “worshipping” statues for example).

That said, there do seem to be some sects who say they are Christians, who are quite militant in their opposition to all things catholic. I have encountered them (and been shocked at the vehemence) mostly online. In my experience, these particular folk do not accept explanations (such as no, we’re not praying TO beads…)…if one is given, they just keep repeating it and move on to some other beef they have with us. Sometimes it gets very trivial…and it can be very disconcerting. And I’m with you…do they think they will convert us with hate?

However, to your question, I think that undoubtedly the Catholic answer is the one you have chosen…mercy, grace, love and patience. But I’d also say that includes gracefully disengaging when it becomes clear that the other person is not interested in understanding, but only in catholic-bashing.
Jesus did say we would be hated.

Finally, I would note that these folks often present scripture…and very often it is cherry picked and out of context. Amazing what you can find in the Bible if you do that.
But taken with good guidance, one doesn’t have to choose between the Bible and Jesus teachings (which are after all, given to us there).

You will note that they very rarely quote Jesus. They snip a bit out of Paul’s letters that they think prove that works don’t matter, for example, and ignore Jesus exhorting us to do for the least of these. Or again, something cut and pasted from Pauls letters to prove that gays are to be reviled…while ignoring Jesus exhortation to love your neighbor.
I usually counter them with something Jesus said.

You are right: it is not a Catholic thing to tell people they’re going to Hell.
I think you’re on the right track!
Godspeed!

 

[frizzgrig]

Can anyone tell me the reason why people feel this need. Does the bible teach this? I mean the bible says that we are justified by our works and not only by our faith and a lot of churches don’t teach that… I know this may seem like a sola scriptura thing but I mean it more as are we supposed to just follow the bible or follow the love of Jesus?
It seems like a silly question when I ask it that way. Please be kind… I am still in training afterall

This is a “both / and” situation.

The Bible says we are justified by the sacrifice of Jesus alone. James 2:14-26 (also part of the Bible) tells us faith without works is dead.

We are to follow the commandment Jesus gave us: love one another as he has loved us (John 13:34; John 15:12). Following this command leads to faith demonstrated by works.

Then there is Matthew 25:34-45 - “…What ever you did for the least …”

Justification is a gift from God thru Jesus Christ, you can not earn it by any number of works.

 

[tawny]

Welcome home confusedgirl. We as Catholics are to see Jesus in everyone, as we are all made in His image & likeness. Even if someone is not of our beliefs; we are to treat them with respect. Correctly inform them of our beliefs. As St. Francis was guoted as saying. Preach the Gospel at all times; and when neccessary use words. In other words; live the Gospel. God bless.

 

[JM3]

1 Corinthians 13

1 If I speak with the tongues of men, and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2 And if I should have prophecy and should know all mysteries, and all knowledge, and if I should have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And if I should distribute all my goods to feed the poor, and if I should deliver my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity is patient, is kind: charity envieth not, dealeth not perversely; is not puffed up;
5 Is not ambitious, seeketh not her own, is not provoked to anger, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth with the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

 

[cheezey]

First of all (and most important thing I’ll say): May God bless you on your journey!

I may be wrong about this, but I don’t think that all or even most mainstream protestants are anti-catholic, although they obviously privately (or sometimes publicly) disagree with some of our beliefs and doctrines…much of the time that’s due to their having been told something that is not so (that we don’t honor scripture for example)…and often it’s just that they misunderstand (that we’re not “worshipping” statues for example).

That said, there do seem to be some sects who say they are Christians, who are quite militant in their opposition to all things catholic. I have encountered them (and been shocked at the vehemence) mostly online. In my experience, these particular folk do not accept explanations (such as no, we’re not praying TO beads…)…if one is given, they just keep repeating it and move on to some other beef they have with us. Sometimes it gets very trivial…and it can be very disconcerting. And I’m with you…do they think they will convert us with hate?

However, to your question, I think that undoubtedly the Catholic answer is the one you have chosen…mercy, grace, love and patience. But I’d also say that includes gracefully disengaging when it becomes clear that the other person is not interested in understanding, but only in catholic-bashing.
Jesus did say we would be hated.

Finally, I would note that these folks often present scripture…and very often it is cherry picked and out of context. Amazing what you can find in the Bible if you do that.
But taken with good guidance, one doesn’t have to choose between the Bible and Jesus teachings (which are after all, given to us there).

You will note that they very rarely quote Jesus. They snip a bit out of Paul’s letters that they think prove that works don’t matter, for example, and ignore Jesus exhorting us to do for the least of these. Or again, something cut and pasted from Pauls letters to prove that gays are to be reviled…while ignoring Jesus exhortation to love your neighbor.
I usually counter them with something Jesus said.

You are right: it is not a Catholic thing to tell people they’re going to Hell.
I think you’re on the right track!
Godspeed!

Agreed, that not all Protestants are like this, and those who are, are loud, thus seeming like it’s most of them.
It goes both ways. Catholics who speak ill of Protestants to this same level are in the minority and equally called to be kind. Those who think otherwise may not be well catechised. Just as some Protestants were ill taught.

And I often quote Jesus. He was a fairly good speaker.

We are all called to be kind to one another. Period.
Not that that’s always easy.

 

[MacQ]

Agreed, that not all Protestants are like this, and those who are, are loud, thus seeming like it’s most of them.
It goes both ways. Catholics who speak ill of Protestants to this same level are in the minority and equally called to be kind. Those who think otherwise may not be well catechised. Just as some Protestants were ill taught.

And I often quote Jesus. He was a fairly good speaker.

We are all called to be kind to one another. Period.
Not that that’s always easy.

Quite so. Hard to see how any rudeness or ill will toward one another would be consistent with any sort of Christianity.

 

[cheezey]

Quite so. Hard to see how any rudeness or ill will toward one another would be consistent with any sort of Christianity.

Bingo.
Oh, sorry. That’s another thread…

 

[MacQ]

Bingo.
Oh, sorry. That’s another thread…

 

[JRKH]

Online you will see it everywhere people being bullied for what they believe.

Yes - there seems to be something about the anonymity of the internet…

I cannot even say things like Jesus died for all of us so that we all have a chance. The protestants swarm in like an angry pack of wolves on me.

Thankfully not all protestants are like that - and especially here.

They’re all like where in the bible does it say that? (John 3:16 btw) It is like when you are kind to someone as a Christian you are seen as a traitor to them I guess? As if being catholic isn’t on reason for them to start something they need to find more. I don’t know if it is a need to convert people to whatever it is they believe but I wouldn’t want join a church that says I have to be mean to people?

Me either.

Anyways I was told that I give Christianity a bad name because I don’t go up to Muslims and tell them they are going to hell even though the bible does say that judgment is God’s alone.I find that you win more souls by showing God’s mercy, grace, love, patience and everything else good to others than telling them that they are going to hell.

Jesus said that the world would know we are his disciples by our love…not by our evangeliszation.

I don’t think people followed Jesus because they were terrified of going to hell but because they saw him as someone that they could follow and saw him as someone that loved them and loved him in return. Jesus talks about love all throughout the gospels and somewhere down the road some people decided it was their job to inform people that they were going to hell.

Amen

Can anyone tell me the reason why people feel this need.

All I can say is it takes all kinds…

Does the bible teach this?

The Bible teaches that we need to share the good news…how we do that is up to us.

I mean the bible says that we are justified by our works and not only by our faith and a lot of churches don’t teach that…

True - and I’ve had some lively discussions with folks on that topic.

I know this may seem like a sola scriptura thing but I mean it more as are we supposed to just follow the bible or follow the love of Jesus?

We are to follow Jesus through His Church…which assembled the bible…

It seems like a silly question when I ask it that way. Please be kind… I am still in training afterall

Welcome home

Peace
James

 

[AbideWithMe]

Agreed, that not all Protestants are like this, and those who are, are loud, thus seeming like it’s most of them.
It goes both ways. Catholics who speak ill of Protestants to this same level are in the minority and equally called to be kind. Those who think otherwise may not be well catechised. Just as some Protestants were ill taught.

And I often quote Jesus. He was a fairly good speaker.

We are all called to be kind to one another. Period.
Not that that’s always easy.

Well said.

I’ve encountered Catholics, Orthodox, and Protestants online bashing each other to equal degrees. In real life…I really can’t think of a single Christian —Catholic, Orthodox, or Protestant—who treats other people, religious or not, so poorly.

I think it’s natural, unfortunately, for most of us to be less aware of when we’re stomping on another person’s toes, and overly sensitive to when our own toes are stomped on. I say this because I fairly often come across Catholics who think all the offense is coming from the Protestant side, while being seemingly oblivious to the roughness coming from their own group.

It’s so easy to forget the simple but profound command to follow the Golden Rule.

 

[ephesians4]

I don’t think people of other Christian denominations hold a candle to the mass killings around the world, or even just in Western society the tsunami of hatred one encounters from antitheists at the moment, the latter being something which I am sure is going to come to killings of Christians at some point, albeit probably not on the level it happens in other parts of the world. Yet.

If anything I feel some affinity towards Christians of other denominations and see them as brothers and sisters, especially where they are being persecuted by antitheists, islamists etc. I get the same vibe off other people, there is a sense we’re all in this together a bit, even if we do obviously realise that some of us are less heathen than others (I guess it bears mentioning at this point that I am not in the US, and culturally things are very different around the subject of religion where I live, to how they are in the US).

I think there are a few types of person who “hate other denominations” very vocally, and if it wasn’t other denominations it’d be other tribes, other races, anything really.

A case in point - one Catholic I know will occasionally wax lyrical on how every protestant has a special giant toasting fork reserved for their bottom in hell. Only one Catholic.

Equally, I used to know one proud protestant who used to talk about Catholicism in similar terms, say “abracadabra, hocus pocus” when the pope was on TV blessing people etc.

Same person. He’s a convert.

 

[AbideWithMe]

I think there are a few types of person who “hate other denominations” very vocally, and if it wasn’t other denominations it’d be other tribes, other races, anything really.

A case in point - one Catholic I know will occasionally wax lyrical on how every protestant has a special giant toasting fork reserved for their bottom in hell. Only one Catholic.

Equally, I used to know one proud protestant who used to talk about Catholicism in similar terms, say “abracadabra, hocus pocus” when the pope was on TV blessing people etc.

Same person. He’s a convert.

That’s a funny story…or else a really sad one.

 

[Avila123]

When I read the original post, I thought of when St Paul was in Athens and “grew exasperated at the sight of the city full of idols.” He talked to people who wanted to listen (irrespective of their motives) and he said “You Athenians, I see that in every respect you are very religious. For as I walked around looking carefully at your shrines, I even discovered an altar inscribed, ‘To an Unknown God.’ What therefore you unknowingly worship, I proclaim to you*”. Some scoffed and some join him and became believers (Acts 17: 15 onwards). I wonder whether anyone would have become believers if St Paul started out with “You are all going to hell”? St Paul had been where his audience were e.g. a non believer and even worse, a man who persecuted Christians and he (through the grace of God) recognised the searching within the souls and offered a respectful, loving and authoritative response.

Like many of the other posters, I am repelled by those who preach with hatred, dislike, prejudice, lies (intentional or otherwise), closed hearts, closed minds, closed ears and tunnel vision. Whatever or whoever they claim to worship, bears no resemblance to the One True Living God who is love. Those who speak gently, with love and with an open heart, mind, ears and eyes are ones who draw others, even if there is not full agreement, there is genuine Christ-filled discussion.

It seems to me that one problem is that many believe they are speaking with genuine love and openness but are then blind to the tone and that strange repelling and distasteful wrongness that is scattered within their words. Another problem is that “self” has moved center stage and the emphasis becomes on I AM RIGHT (no arguments) and you are wrong, and somehow God has moved on the side as a justification for the personal view. Often behind the yelling, one can almost see a small childish soul throwing a temper tantrum because the world is not how they want it to be. When a child is throwing a tantrum, they are not open to reason and sometimes a quiet withdrawal (accompanied by a prayer for them) is our best recourse.