At what point does life support intervene with Gods will?

[Disciple_of_God]

My wife and were discussing what has been going on in the news lately regarding Terri Schiavo and the Pope. We were wondering at what point we are intervening in Gods will when it comes to life support, if any. By using machines to keep people alive, not like Terri Schiavo or the Pope, is this what God wants us to do?

Also, is there anything in the bible or from the early Church Fathers that might address this?

Thank you and God Bless.:tiphat:

 

[davidv]

Disciple of God:

My wife and were discussing what has been going on in the news lately regarding Terri Schiavo and the Pope. We were wondering at what point we are intervening in Gods will when it comes to life support, if any. By using machines to keep people alive, not like Terri Schiavo or the Pope, is this what God wants us to do?

Also, is there anything in the bible or from the early Church Fathers that might address this?

Thank you and God Bless.:tiphat:

How about:

Do not cast me off in the time of old age;
do not forsake me when my strength is spent.
Psalms 71:9 (NRSV)

 

[dcmac]

Let the Lexicon war begin!

Feeding tubes are not “artificial life support” as has been reported by the secular progressive left and media. A fair statement would make mention of a breathing tube, or a dialysis machine. Those are machines that require an extraordinary effort to maintain life and are not required by Church teaching.

However, nutrition and hydration are not extraordinary and therefore to remove them in order to die are strictly against Church teaching.

Speaking from a medical perspective I concur with the Church in its assessment.

As a side bar: how is it that we can not kill animals by the removal of nutrition and hydration, yet we can allow an unfaithful husband to do so?

Another side bar: how is it in a country that values the sacrament and institution of marriage so much that it encourages divorce and remarriage again and again and again and drive through marriage and divorce in Sin City Las Vegas, can give the authority to murder a woman to her estranged spouse who is involved with another woman to the extent that they have children when a loving blood famimly is ready, willing and able to step in for the love, support and care of the woman?

Good grief Charlie Brown.

I wait in sadness for the chastisement that is duly ours as a nation…

 

[Disciple_of_God]

Wait a second,

I am not saying that we should pull feeding tubes and things like that; I’m just asking if there is** any** point in ones life that the Church feels we are going too far in keeping someone alive. I totally agree with you on everything dcmac. I’m not trying to debate anyone I’m just asking what the Church teaches when it comes to the extreme cases of life support. That’s all.

I apologize if I came across as saying we should pull the plug on people. That is not what I’m asking.

I think **davidv **answered my question with Psalms 71:9. Thank you.

 

[dcmac]

I’m sorry, for I did not mean to imply you per se.

I expected this thread to pick some lively debate regarding “end of life” issues and therefore lobbied the first salvo at those who think that nutrition and hydration are “extraordinary” means. Hence my writing of dialysis etc.

So, this salvo was at those I expected to start to post in light of Terri Marie Schindler Chiavo. I’m Sorry, again, if you thought I meant you in particular.

 

[demolitionman65]

I wonder about the feeding tube, sometimes. I’m personally not clear on that.

What I am unutterably opposed to is the removal of hydration. That causes a most tortuous death. . .and it is what killed Terri Schiavo.

I stumbled upon autopsy pictures (nevermind how I found them, and I will not post a link. If you really want to find them, you can on your own), and they clearly show the ravages not of hunger, but of thirst.

[rant] I now want to spout my vociferous and decidedly unChristian thoughts regarding Michael Schiavo. . . .[/rant]

:leaves thread to avoid getting banned:

 

[Disciple_of_God]

dcmac,

It’s not a problem. I completely understand. This topic is a very sensitive one especially since what has taken place recently. There are no hard feelings whatsoever. Thank you for clarifying.

God Bless

 

[buttons]

A question was ask of me: What is the differents between the Terri Schiavo case & the Pope. Couldn’t the Pope be put on machines to keep him alive? Please help me explain this. Also the person asking the question thinks that the feeding tube is a form of life support.

 

[eptatorata]

buttons:

A question was ask of me: What is the differents between the Terri Schiavo case & the Pope. Couldn’t the Pope be put on machines to keep him alive? Please help me explain this. Also the person asking the question thinks that the feeding tube is a form of life support.

As far as I can tell from the publically accessible legal paperwork, Terri Schiave suffered devastating brain damage, resulting with her being in a permanent vegetative state and requiring artificial life support. Her body could have been kept alive until the money for her care ran out.

As opposed to that, the Pope was old and marked by Parkinson’s Disease. I haven’t read up exactly which medical condition he succumbed to, but of the two he clearly was in a much worse shape. I don’t know if extreme medical intervention could have delayed the inevitable a few days longer, but I suspect it wasn’t even an option. When your body is terminally worn out, there is only so much anybody can do.

 

[Mom_of_one]

buttons:

A question was ask of me: What is the differents between the Terri Schiavo case & the Pope. Couldn’t the Pope be put on machines to keep him alive? Please help me explain this. Also the person asking the question thinks that the feeding tube is a form of life support.

The difference is the Pope was dying. His organs were failing, and his organ systems were shutting down. This is a natural part of the dying process. He did not HAVE to accept machines to “keep” him alive. Terri Shavio was not dying, nor was she brain dead. Her systems functioned just fine. One part of her digestive system (her swallowing mechanism) may or may not have been working properly, but that is different from her whole system not working. The feeding tube was inserted not to “keep” her alive, any more than a baby bottle “keeps” a baby alive. Nutrition and hydration are normal, even if the mechanism is “artifical”. I hope this helps.