Bibilical support for the Soul as "form" and the Body as "material"

[catholictiger]

simple question CCCC 365 says

The unity of soul and body is so profound that one has to consider the soul to be the “form” of the body:234 i.e., it is because of its spiritual soul that the body made of matter becomes a living, human body; spirit and matter, in man, are not two natures united, but rather their union forms a single nature.

and I’m also pretty sure that the Church teaches that the Body is Material.

So could you help back me up with scripture, the CCCC uses a council which I don’t doubt but when debating people who don’t listen to those councils it doesn’t help out much at all.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Off-hand, I think you might be able to get mileage from an honest person through:

Matthew 10:28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

and

1 Thes. 5:23 May the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be kept sound and blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

and

Matthew 26:41 Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

and

Luke 24:39 See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself; handle me, and see; for a spirit has not flesh and bones as you see that I have.

Thought it might be tough to get exactly “form” of the body out of Scripture. Maybe someone else has insight or a Biblical type in mind.

 

[catholictiger]

Off-hand, I think you might be able to get mileage from an honest person through:

Matthew 10:28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

and

1 Thes. 5:23 May the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be kept sound and blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

and

Matthew 26:41 Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

and

Luke 24:39 See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself; handle me, and see; for a spirit has not flesh and bones as you see that I have.

Thought it might be tough to get exactly “form” of the body out of Scripture. Maybe someone else has insight or a Biblical type in mind.

you probably have to do some reasoning with people to get people to that point, using scripture to prove a point that leads to another point which leads to the soul as form.

The problem is I don’t know how to go through this process and when I’m discussing these things with people on the internet mainly, and I can’t provide scripture to back up my point I feel like I lose the person. Because many of the people I deal with come at me with the show it to me in scripture thing. If I can’t answer their question I think they kinda lose respect of me, and probably just look over the reasons I give and come back with look at it this way.

thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut though.

 

[grannymh]

simple question CCCC 365 says

and I’m also pretty sure that the Church teaches that the Body is Material.

So could you help back me up with scripture, the CCCC uses a council which I don’t doubt but when debating people who don’t listen to those councils it doesn’t help out much at all.

Footnote 232 for the paragraph CCC 364 has these quotes.* 1 Corinthians 6: 19-20* and 1 Corinthians 15: 44-45. However it would be good to read 1 Corinthians 15: 36-58 for context. Better yet, read the entire chapter 15.

 

[Verbum]

Hi Tiger,

The matter and form terminology is part of Aristotelian-Thomistic philosopy, It is the philosophy prescribed by the Church for seminaries and recommended for Catholic schools. That is because, through St. Thomas Aquinas, it shows that the various teachings of the Catholic Church do not go against reason. St. Thomas called philosophy “the handmaid of theology”.

However, any philosophy is a human invention and is not part of Revelation. It is conceivable that other philosophical systems could be effective in supporting Catholic teaching.

Verbum

 

[TimothyH]

Maybe the creation story itself can help?

the LORD God formed man out of the clay of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and so man became a living being. (Genesis 2:7)

The word spirit comes from the Latin word “Spiritus” which means breath. Greek pneuma, Hebrew Ruach. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirit is actually quite interesting regarding spirit, soul and breath. Blowing the “Breath of life” is used to describe how God imparts his spirit into man and in who’s image we are created. God first formed the human out of clay and then “Breathed” his spirit into man (giving him a spiritual soul) so that “man became a living being.”

Also reference the many other passages which correlate moving air with God’s life giving spirit, most notably Genesis 1:1 where the Mighty Wind/Spirit of God (translation dependant) is the creating force which brings the universe into existence. I like the story of the dry bones in Ezekiel 37 which includes references to wind, spirit and life…

Then he said to me: Prophesy to the spirit, prophesy, son of man, and say to the spirit: Thus says the Lord GOD: From the four winds come, O spirit, and breathe into these slain that they may come to life. (Ezekiel 37:9)

Also John 20 - Jesus breathed on them and said “Recieve the Holy Spirit.” He then went on to give them the authority to forgive sins, which removes the stain of sin from one’s soul, so to speak.

There is also a reference to the four winds in revelation 7. Interestingly enough, God commands the wind - the life giving spirit of God - to stop at the end of time.

Not sure this is exactly what you are looking for but I hope it helps.

-Tim-