Bible Alone?

[Duane1966]

Duane!

I answered the above yesterday but where’s my answer??

Here’s what it said:

Duane1966

God Bless You!

99% of the people I know don’t even know the two terms!

So however we want to understand it is fine because we’re saying the same thing using different terms.

(of course justfcn is also ongoing - if that ended so would sanctfn!)

The important thing is to endure till the end!

In Christ
Fran

My internet has been spotty, and I hate posting from my phone. It should be fixed today as tech is coming to look at it. I hope to answer you by tonight.

 

[Peter_J]

but at the same time it’s rude to ignore a persons points so I answer as quickly as possible .

To me it’s more a question of which ones. One can’t possibly read, much less respond to, everything. Everybody has to makes choices (conscious or unconscious) about whom they partner with.

 

[Duane1966]

Duane!

I answered the above yesterday but where’s my answer??

Fran

Sorry took so long for my reply, as I said, internet issues, and when I got them fixed, was working a lot, did not mean to ignore your question. Here is the best answer I can give, from Robert Sungeneis:

They are “virtually interchangeable” as opposed to “always interchangeable” since, though similar, they are speaking about two different aspects of salvation that occur at the same time. “Justification” is usually used to give the reason we can be just before a holy God. In other words, it shows us the “justifiable” reason God can saves us, that is, because of Christ’s atonement He can give grace to the human soul.

"Sanctification" is usually used to show the state of grace, that is, whenever you receive saving grace you are sanctified. You are in a state of grace, which if you died, would allow you to go to heaven.

**But since in the Catholic faith both justification and sanctification occur simultaneously **and continuously, and perform the same function, that is, to provide grace in the soul for salvation, then they are synonymous and virtually interchangeable, which is why the NT often interchanges them. The NT separates justification and sanctification usually when it is trying to focus on one of the two aspects I mentioned above, i.e., the reason for, as opposed to the state of, grace.

Robert Sungenis
Catholic Apologetics International

 

[frangiuliano115]

Sorry took so long for my reply, as I said, internet issues, and when I got them fixed, was working a lot, did not mean to ignore your question. Here is the best answer I can give, from Robert Sungeneis:

Duane,

Here is what you posted:

They are “virtually interchangeable” as opposed to “always interchangeable” since, though similar, they are speaking about two different aspects of salvation that occur at the same time. “Justification” is usually used to give the reason we can be just before a holy God. In other words, it shows us the “justifiable” reason God can saves us, that is, because of Christ’s atonement He can give grace to the human soul.

“Sanctification” is usually used to show the state of grace, that is, whenever you receive saving grace you are sanctified. You are in a state of grace, which if you died, would allow you to go to heaven.

But since in the Catholic faith both justification and sanctification occur simultaneously and continuously, and perform the same function, that is, to provide grace in the soul for salvation, then they are synonymous and virtually interchangeable, which is why the NT often interchanges them. The NT separates justification and sanctification usually when it is trying to focus on one of the** two aspects I mentioned above, i.e., the reason for, as opposed to the state of, grace.**

Robert Sungenis
Catholic Apologetics International

Mr. Sungenis is saying what I’ve been trying to say. The words are difficult to define because they are so inter-related. He does a good job.

He does mention the words “two aspects” as being the reason for as opposed to the state of.

He even explains how they work. I don’t see what’s different between this and what I was trying to say. I just hate arguing and give up after a few posts.

What I was saying is that since there are two different words, there must be a difference between them. If someone asks you at bible study what the words mean, you have to differentiate - which I believe Sungenis did.

Here are my words and then we should end it here:
Both J and S happen at the same time. J is being made just before God. It’s being accepted into His family. It’s Him saying, okay, you’re one of mine.

S is exactly what it says. Sanctifying, being made holy - it’s a continuous process that is life-long if you’re willing to accept it because God forces nothing on us.

Now, since we are also justified, J is also ongoing - because if that stopped so would sanctification. See what I mean?

Like I said - we’re saying the same thing and maybe using different words.

I also like to say that God justifies wholly on His own, we cannot justify ourselves, but we have a part in sanctification and take part with cooperating with God’s sanctifying grace. This would include works, or our walk with God.

Thanks for the reply.

Fran