Brothers of Jesus

[Yehuda_Dion]

Please read the reply of Yehuda Dion, who explains it. As for the greek, I am not talking of modern Greek, but Ancient Greek which is what was spoken at the time of Christ, and is the original language of the New Testament

Thankyou for forgiving my outburst. I understand now that you probably were just writing out of your beliefs, which were clashing with mine. You brightened my day immensely. May God bless you.

 

[LilyM]

You “defy” me? And who am I to even be “defied”? I don’t even need tradition to know that a rich, pious man such as St. Joachim wouldn’t give his precious daughter, the Mother of the Messiah, to a widower.

St Joachim was not rich, or he would’ve given Mary a sufficient dowry that she would’ve been able to afford a bit better than a stinky stable to give birth to Our Lord!

 

[Michael_Allen]

St Joachim was not rich, or he would’ve given Mary a sufficient dowry that she would’ve been able to afford a bit better than a stinky stable to give birth to Our Lord!

I don’t think scripture teaches either that (1) Mary gave birth in a stable (some traditions hold it would have likely been a cave close to the town), or (2) that they were lacking money for accommodation.

 

[LilyM]

I don’t think scripture teaches either that (1) Mary gave birth in a stable (some traditions hold it would have likely been a cave close to the town), or (2) that they were lacking money for accommodation.

Someone who has plenty of money doesn’t get turned away from an inn - poorer customers would have been booted out to make room for them.

Besides which, when they presented Him in the Temple they could only afford two birds, which was the sacrifice offered by the poorest.

 

[Michael_Allen]

Someone who has plenty of money doesn’t get turned away from an inn - poorer customers would have been booted out to make room for them.

Besides which, when they presented Him in the Temple they could only afford two birds, which was the sacrifice offered by the poorest.

The problem is, that’s what you say, but it is not what scripture says. Scripture says that there was no room at the inn. You add a layer of interpretation on top of that (that actually there was room, but the real reason was lack of money), which is extra to the text - you have to read in your interpretation rather than reading it out of scripture. That’s the difference between eisegesis and exegesis, and I, for one, are much happier sticking to the latter. I think speculation is fine, so long as we acknowledge that it is speculation and not something in the scripture itself.

 

[InJesusItrust]

I don’t think scripture teaches either that (1) Mary gave birth in a stable (some traditions hold it would have likely been a cave close to the town), or (2) that they were lacking money for accommodation.

The animals were in a cave I think.

 

[patrick457]

Someone who has plenty of money doesn’t get turned away from an inn - poorer customers would have been booted out to make room for them.

If there was even an ‘inn’, that is.

 

[LilyM]

The problem is, that’s what you say, but it is not what scripture says. Scripture says that there was no room at the inn. You add a layer of interpretation on top of that (that actually there was room, but the real reason was lack of money), which is extra to the text - you have to read in your interpretation rather than reading it out of scripture. That’s the difference between eisegesis and exegesis, and I, for one, are much happier sticking to the latter. I think speculation is fine, so long as we acknowledge that it is speculation and not something in the scripture itself.

And the fact that they were so poor they could only afford to give two birds at the Temple when they presented Jesus, when Leviticus commands that people give more when they can afford it,is also only my opinion and eisegesis as well, I suppose?

 

[Miriam1947]

I believe there is more about Joseph in apocryphal writings. According to unreliable sources, he was a widower with 6 kids, one of whom was James. He was about 90 years old when he married the Virgin Mary. So Jesus may have had step-brothers, I guess.

So, Joseph was 90 when he married Mary?

He walks to Jerusalem for the Passover with Mary and Jesus and the rest of the group. Jesus is 12 so Joseph is now 102 years old. Approximately 80 miles so a three day trip, walking. What a guy!

On the journey back they find that Jesus is missing and Joseph and Mary have to go back to Jerusalem to find Jesus. Another day of walking at 102 years of age. And then the two days they spend searching for Jesus. After that they face 80 miles to get home, another three days of walking.

Joseph may have been middle-aged but 90? I don’t think so.

 

[Aloysium]

So, Joseph was 90 when he married Mary?

He walks to Jerusalem for the Passover with Mary and Jesus and the rest of the group. Jesus is 12 so Joseph is now 102 years old. Approximately 80 miles so a three day trip, walking. What a guy!

On the journey back they find that Jesus is missing and Joseph and Mary have to go back to Jerusalem to find Jesus. Another day of walking at 102 years of age. And then the two days they spend searching for Jesus. After that they face 80 miles to get home, another three days of walking.

Joseph may have been middle-aged but 90? I don’t think so.

yup, that’s why it’s not included in our Bible

things like this contribute to my decision to be Catholic, knowing that there are knowledgeable people sorting out/interpreting the various writings that have existed through the ages.

BTW, according to History of Joseph the Carpenter he was 111 when he died.

 

[doggieDaddy]

This question was asked and answered some 1600 years ago. The answers given then are the answers we Catholics give today. Thanks to the wonders of the web we can all read these answers from St. Jerome, here:

ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf206.vi.v.html

and here:

cin.org/users/james/files/helvidiu.htm

From the opening you know that St. Jerome isn’t going to treat Helvidius with kid gloves.

“I was requested by certain of the brethren not long ago to reply to a pamphlet written by one Helvidius. I have deferred doing so, not because it is a difficult matter to maintain the truth and refute an ignorant boor who has scarce known the first glimmer of learning, but because I was afraid my reply might make him appear worth defeating.”

Interesting reading.