Burial / Cremation

[Michael_C]

I received the below rant from a seda vacanist:

So, as long you claim that you are not getting cremated for the express purpose of contradicting a dogma – but rather, for instance, because you want your ashes to rest on your favorite golf course – cremation is allowed by the Vatican II sect. This is a very serious issue because the traditional practice of the Catholic Church, as reflected in the 1917 Code of Canon Law, forbids cremation under pain of mortal sin and further stipulates that those who requested it cannot receive Christian burial. This shows us a clear difference between the two religions.
1917 Code of Canon Law, Canon 1203 § 1-2: “The bodies of the faithful departed shall be buried, their cremation being reprobated. 2. If anyone by any manner orders that his body be cremated, it is illicit to execute that desire; and if this was added to any contract or testament or any other act.”

1917 Code of Canon Law, Canon 1240 § 1-5: “Unless they gave before death a sign of repentance, the following are deprived of ecclesiastical burial: 1. Notorious apostates from the Christian faith, or those who notoriously gave their name to heretical sects or schismatic or Masonic sects, or other societies of this sort; 2. Excommunicates or those under interdict after a condemnatory sentence; 3. Those who killed themselves by deliberate counsel; 4. Those who died in a duel, or from wounds related thereto; 5. Those who ordered that their body be handed over for cremation; 6. Other public and manifest sinners.”

As I understand Cremation is not a dogma or doctrine thus the magiterium has the authority to make changes. He refers to Post Vatican II as a new religion.

I appreciate any thoughts you may have.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I received the below rant from a seda vacanist:

As I understand Cremation is not a dogma or doctrine thus the magiterium has the authority to make changes. He refers to Post Vatican II as a new religion.

I appreciate any thoughts you may have.

That is correct and the Code of Canon Law is also changable by the Pope. The 1917 code is no longer valid or binding.

 

[Epistemes]

The Catechism states,

2301 *Autopsies can be morally permitted for legal inquests or scientific research. The free gift of organs after death is legitimate and can be meritorious.

The Church permits cremation, provided that it does not demonstrate a denial of faith in the resurrection of the body.*

The Catechism cites the 1983 Code of Canon Law No. 1176 Section 3 as its reference:

§3. The Church earnestly recommends that the pious custom of burying the bodies of the deceased be observed; nevertheless, the Church does not prohibit cremation unless it was chosen for reasons contrary to Christian doctrine.

vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P4A.HTM

 

[Polaris]

I understand the history of why it was forbidden, but why is burial still prefered by the church in the current time. Why is a slow rotting and decay, or worse yet being stuffed with preservative that are horrible for the environment, so much better for the temple, then a flame that returns us to the dust from whence we came? I just do not understand the churches loves burial so much in the modern age?

 

[Joe_Kelley]

I understand the history of why it was forbidden, but why is burial still prefered by the church in the current time. Why is a slow rotting and decay, or worse yet being stuffed with preservative that are horrible for the environment, so much better for the temple, then a flame that returns us to the dust from whence we came? I just do not understand the churches loves burial so much in the modern age?

Re the environment - Crematoriums are now being opposed because they pollute the atmosphere with mercury from dental fillings.

 

[Windmill]

i’m a dentist, and you gave me a great laugh there

let me guess, the opposition is strongest in california

 

[Joe_Kelley]

i’m a dentist, and you gave me a great laugh there

let me guess, the opposition is strongest in california

Right. Someplace near San Francisco; Richmond I think.

 

[mercygate]

I received the below rant from a seda vacanist:

As I understand Cremation is not a dogma or doctrine thus the magiterium has the authority to make changes. He refers to Post Vatican II as a new religion.

I appreciate any thoughts you may have.

:yawn: So, the God of the Universe, who put the whole thing together out of nothing in six days, is gonna have a problem putting YOU back together when Gabriel sounds the last trumpet?

Yeah. Right.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

:yawn: So, the God of the Universe, who put the whole thing together out of nothing in six days, is gonna have a problem putting YOU back together when Gabriel sounds the last trumpet?

Yeah. Right.

That’s what I’ve always wondered.

I know too much about HOW they embalm to believe that cremation visits less dignity on the human remains.

 

[gorman64]

“The Church permits cremation, provided that it does not demonstrate a denial of faith in the resurrection of the body.”

I believe creamation societies were set up by the freemasons to promote the implicit denial of the resurrection of the body.

Also consider that fire does not completely reduce the body to ashes…the bones are left intact…they must be pulverized.

If the Saints had been creamated…there would be no relics. Catholic graveyards contain the bodies of unknown saints…should they have been creamated? I don’t think so.

Creamation promotes the denial of the resurrection of the body and that is why it is prohibited. Follow the 1917 Code.

 

[Epistemes]

“The Church permits cremation, provided that it does not demonstrate a denial of faith in the resurrection of the body.”

I believe creamation societies were set up by the freemasons to promote the implicit denial of the resurrection of the body.

Also consider that fire does not completely reduce the body to ashes…the bones are left intact…they must be pulverized.

If the Saints had been creamated…there would be no relics. Catholic graveyards contain the bodies of unknown saints…should they have been creamated? I don’t think so.

Creamation promotes the denial of the resurrection of the body and that is why it is prohibited. Follow the 1917 Code.

If the Church permits cremation, provided that the person being cremated does believe in the resurrection of the entire body, then how exactly does cremation promote the denial of the resurrection of the body?

Do you believe that the God who created the world *ex nihilo *could not reconstruct any and all bodies after being cremated on the day of resurrection? Is God so powerless?

 

[gorman64]

If the Church permits cremation, provided that the person being cremated does believe in the resurrection of the entire body, then how exactly does cremation promote the denial of the resurrection of the body?

It is an implicit denial of the resurrection of the body. Actions speak louder than words sometimes…and are more effective. As we pray, we believe…and as we act, we think. Read the article below, from the Catholic Encyclopedia, as well as the last paragraph that I quote below:

newadvent.org/cathen/04481c.htm
CE:

“In conclusion, it must be remembered that there is nothing directly opposed to any dogma of the Church in the practice of cremation, and that, if ever the leaders of this sinister movement so far control the governments of the world as to make this custom universal, it would not be a lapse in the faith confided to her were she obliged to conform.”

Given this, why would the post-Vatican II church allow it? And yes, I am a sedevacantist.

“Do you believe that the God who created the world ex nihilo could not reconstruct any and all bodies after being cremated on the day of resurrection? Is God so powerless?”

No, of course not… but this is a red herring. The Church allows cremation is the extraordinary circumstances of war and pestilence. It is not intrinsically evil. However, the Church always looked at cremation as contrary to her teaching on the resurrection of the body. Again, from the same CE reference:
CE:

“The Christians never burned their dead, but followed from earliest days the practice of the Semitic race and the personal example of their Divine Founder. It is recorded that in times of persecution many risked their lives to recover the bodies of martyrs for the holy rites of Christian burial. The pagans, to destroy faith in the resurrection of the body, often cast the corpses of martyred Christians into the flames, fondly believing thus to render impossible the resurrection of the body. What Christian faith has ever held in this regard is clearly put by the third-century writer Minucius Felix, in his dialogue “Octavius”, refuting the assertion that cremation made this resurrection an impossibility: “Nor do we fear, as you suppose, any harm from the [mode of] sepulture, but we adhere to the old, and better, custom” (“Nec, ut creditis, ullum damnum sepulturae timemus sed veterem et meliorem consuetudinem humandi frequentamus” – P.L., III, 362).

Gorman