Historically, the priest is supposed to “guard” the Chalice. In this modern age, many priests no longer do this and it can be impractical at times but this priest did what priests have done throughout all of Church history.
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mark_a
Guest
I really feel for this guy. More so maybe than I feel for Protestant pastors who would like to become Catholic, but just can’t summon the courage, even with help from the Coming Home Network, etc.
C
Cat
Guest
What do you think of my theory that he’s afraid to lose his job and be without a means of financial support?
Not everyone can be hired by CAF!
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Lochias
Guest
It’s a valid theory, I guess.
Does him being afraid for his livelihood automatically give him a free pass, though? He has his example from Jesus and the Apostles, who dropped everything and came to follow our Lord. I know we’re human, and that that kind of change has to be a terrifying thought, but still.
I guess I’m not so disappointed in him as sad for him.
J
johnnyc176
Guest
C
Country_Gal
Guest
Maybe there are other things about Catholic teaching that he strongly disagrees with. Birth control, for example. The teachings on Mary, Purgatory, the Papacy. There are many things a Protestant minister might disagree with. 
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Lochias
Guest
Indeed. If any of those are the case for this pastor, he should have respected the Church’s rules concerning the Eucharist, instead of knowingly and willfully violating them for years and then claiming to be and “feel” forgiven by God after an apology and praying to the ceiling for a few minutes.Maybe there are other things about Catholic teaching that he strongly disagrees with. Birth control, for example. The teachings on Mary, Purgatory, the Papacy. There are many things a Protestant minister might disagree with.
Not saying that’s exactly what happened, but still.
C
Country_Gal
Guest
You sound angry at me. I’m trying to give reasons why he may not convert, other than saving his career as a minister. Read the other posts above mine with speculation about that.Indeed. If any of those are the case for this pastor, he should have respected the Church’s rules concerning the Eucharist, instead of knowingly and willfully violating them for years and then claiming to be and “feel” forgiven by God after an apology and praying to the ceiling for a few minutes.
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Lochias
Guest
I’m not angry with you, and didn’t mean my post to imply as such. I’m more or less angry at the pastor mentioned in the OP.
M
mark_a
Guest
dingdingdingdingdingdingdingdingdingding
C
Cat
Guest
I agree with you. There are no doubt many areas in which the Protestant pastor disagrees with what he thinks the Catholic Church teaches.Maybe there are other things about Catholic teaching that he strongly disagrees with. Birth control, for example. The teachings on Mary, Purgatory, the Papacy. There are many things a Protestant minister might disagree with.
But mark a and others, please be careful about making assumptions about Protestants and birth control.
When we were kicked out of our Evangelical Protestant church 10 years ago, there was (and still is) a “movement” in the churches urging couples to have large families (“a quiver full of arrows,” as it says in the Bible). The pastor of our church had 9 children (one deceased at birth). The associate pastor had seven children. The head elder had 9 children, all living. Interestingly, all of their wives were absolutely slim and gorgeous! There were many families in our Evangelical Protestant church who had six children and were open to more. Many of these families also home-schooled their children.
In all the churches that I was part of growing up, four children was a very common number in families.
My mother was Baptist, and she had 10 siblings.
My father was raised Reformed. He was an only child, but his mother came from a family of nine children.
And there is a “joke” among Evangelical Protestants about missionaries–many missionary families serving overseas have at least four children! In fact, one of the denominations that we were part of created a policy that stated that the Mission Board would only provide financial support for four children; any additional children would have to be paid for by family members. They came up with that policy because many of the missionary families were having child after child, and it was expensive!
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Country_Gal
Guest
You got “kicked out” of a church?
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mark_a
Guest
I know about as many Protestants with large families as Catholics with large families. But generally speaking, Protestants are the ones changing the 1500 year old interpretation of scriptural Christian teaching to suit their own lack of self control.
My comment, however juvenile, was an opinion.
For all I know, this man has 14 kids by the same woman he is still married to. BTW, I know of only one Protestant pastor with more than 3 kids.
I would like to suggest the book “Godly Seed” by Allan Carlson.
But I guess I’m drifting off-topic as usua…zzzzzzzz.
C
Cat
Guest
Yes, in 2002. A “tribunal” was convened, consisting mainly of people we had never met and who had never met us. It ended with us being told to leave, and from then on, we were shunned.You got “kicked out” of a church?
But it was a horrific experience, and to this day, I have a lot of trust issues. However, I also am grateful, because it was the “beginning” of our eventual conversion to Catholicism. If we hadn’t been ousted from our beloved Evangelical Protestant church, we never, ever would have even considered investigating Catholicism.
I see that Anne Graham Lotz has just written a book called, Wounded by God’s People. The description says, “Have you been wounded by someone in the family of faith? While the brokenness and pain can seem unbearable, it’s not insurmountable.”
Interesting. Why would she write a book like this if it was a rare occurrence? You see, it isn’t a rare occurrence at all. It happens all too often–Christians are hurt, often severely, by other Christians that they trusted.
I plan to buy that book.
E
Elizabeth779
Guest
Thanks Cat for the link – very interesting article, and it was disappointing that he had not entered the Church…i was hoping while reading that would be the outcome – he will be on my prayer list – he and his family…
Cat, the whole wounded by church family is a great topic for a thread…I’m the daughter of a Baptist minister, and have a story to share that happened to my father, and also to our family by a committee in a baptist church…but don’t want to shanghai this thread…
Busted at Mass though – the poor pastor recognized the appearance of our Lord in Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity…it’s what I recovnigzed years ago when invited to a girlfriend’s baby’s baptism…the Real Presence…wil never forget…my sis (who is now Catholic also) attended a Mass with a boyfriend (now her husband) and called me before her car was even out of the parish parking lot to say, “You’re right – HE is THERE, just like you said.”…she recognized the Real Presence also.
Truthfully though it did take me many years to make the change from the protestant church to the Catholic Church, and I think it wasn’t hurdles like purgatory, Mary, the pope etc…but for many years as I read Scott Hahn’s books and other good instruction books…and the Catechsim…I still viewed all things about the Church through a protestant screen…and while I accepted the Church and its teachings as truth, I did not follow through and get signed up for RCIA and offically make the change…then one day on the road…was on Highway 99 just south of Tulare when i was listening to Immaculate Heart Radio and they were talking about a topic and as usual I just was comparing that to protestant teaching – that protestant screen in my head – when I felt called…CALLED to the church…I prayed out loud, “Lord I will no longer look at the Church through this Protestant screen but will come into your Church and accept its teachings.” I called the RCIA director the next day and signed up for RCIA. That Sunday in Mass…I felt really awkward, not knowing the responses, etc., and in that parish that was overflowing with worshippers felt just awkward and very alone, and I prayed, “Lord, I know it’s not right to ask for a sign, but I just feel all alone here, and it feels so different, can you just show me a little sign that I’m on the right track”…then at the sign of peace I went to the woman seated on my left, and as she turned to me (she was veiled and I couldn’t see her face before she had turned to me" – I KNEW her…KNEW her well from us both attending a local Baptist Church where I was the pianist and she and her husband attended and their children were active in the church…knew her daughter-in-law well even…WELL gone was the awkward and alone feeling. I don’t feel it’s right to ask God for signs, and it’s not like me to do so, but I did feel he answered my prayer that day. I was brought into the Church Easter Vigil 2009…and not one single day has passed that I have not thanked God for bringing me to the Catholic Church – the fullness of truth. Also, in this very large parish she and her husband are the only ones I know from my protestant days…when their kids were grown, they had returned to the Catholic Church, and I have never ran into them at Mass since then (there are many masses and I guess our paths just haven’t crossed – I have seen them at a social function though)…I really believe our Heavenly Father heard and answered my prayer that day in a very special way…and think…the prayer was answered before I prayed it in the pew in my selection of where I sat…
Oh brother,maybe that sounds corny…but that’s that…it’s late…time to sleep…
Heavenly Father, we pray for unity, and we pray that all souls drawn to you will come to know the fullness of truth that is found in the Catholic Church…
In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit…Amen.
Cat, the whole wounded by church family is a great topic for a thread…I’m the daughter of a Baptist minister, and have a story to share that happened to my father, and also to our family by a committee in a baptist church…but don’t want to shanghai this thread…
Busted at Mass though – the poor pastor recognized the appearance of our Lord in Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity…it’s what I recovnigzed years ago when invited to a girlfriend’s baby’s baptism…the Real Presence…wil never forget…my sis (who is now Catholic also) attended a Mass with a boyfriend (now her husband) and called me before her car was even out of the parish parking lot to say, “You’re right – HE is THERE, just like you said.”…she recognized the Real Presence also.
Truthfully though it did take me many years to make the change from the protestant church to the Catholic Church, and I think it wasn’t hurdles like purgatory, Mary, the pope etc…but for many years as I read Scott Hahn’s books and other good instruction books…and the Catechsim…I still viewed all things about the Church through a protestant screen…and while I accepted the Church and its teachings as truth, I did not follow through and get signed up for RCIA and offically make the change…then one day on the road…was on Highway 99 just south of Tulare when i was listening to Immaculate Heart Radio and they were talking about a topic and as usual I just was comparing that to protestant teaching – that protestant screen in my head – when I felt called…CALLED to the church…I prayed out loud, “Lord I will no longer look at the Church through this Protestant screen but will come into your Church and accept its teachings.” I called the RCIA director the next day and signed up for RCIA. That Sunday in Mass…I felt really awkward, not knowing the responses, etc., and in that parish that was overflowing with worshippers felt just awkward and very alone, and I prayed, “Lord, I know it’s not right to ask for a sign, but I just feel all alone here, and it feels so different, can you just show me a little sign that I’m on the right track”…then at the sign of peace I went to the woman seated on my left, and as she turned to me (she was veiled and I couldn’t see her face before she had turned to me" – I KNEW her…KNEW her well from us both attending a local Baptist Church where I was the pianist and she and her husband attended and their children were active in the church…knew her daughter-in-law well even…WELL gone was the awkward and alone feeling. I don’t feel it’s right to ask God for signs, and it’s not like me to do so, but I did feel he answered my prayer that day. I was brought into the Church Easter Vigil 2009…and not one single day has passed that I have not thanked God for bringing me to the Catholic Church – the fullness of truth. Also, in this very large parish she and her husband are the only ones I know from my protestant days…when their kids were grown, they had returned to the Catholic Church, and I have never ran into them at Mass since then (there are many masses and I guess our paths just haven’t crossed – I have seen them at a social function though)…I really believe our Heavenly Father heard and answered my prayer that day in a very special way…and think…the prayer was answered before I prayed it in the pew in my selection of where I sat…
Oh brother,maybe that sounds corny…but that’s that…it’s late…time to sleep…
Heavenly Father, we pray for unity, and we pray that all souls drawn to you will come to know the fullness of truth that is found in the Catholic Church…
In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit…Amen.
C
Cat
Guest
Thank you for this great post and testimony.
My husband and I each had (separately) a similar “calling” into the Catholic Church.
We were attending a Catholics apologetics class (every Catholic parish should offer this!), and we found ourselves in agreement with everything we were hearing about the Catholic Church, but we were still not making that dive into the Tiber.
Then BOTH of us, separately, were told by the Holy Spirit, words to this effect: “This is the Truth. The Catholic Church is the Church that Jesus, your Savior and Lord, established. IF you do not obey Him and enter this Church, you will be living in disobedience to Him, and your eternal salvation is imperiled. You cannot claim to be a follower of Christ and deliberately choose to disobey Him.”
BOTH of us heard this, and both of us decided to obey Jesus.
As for “stumbling blocks,” I, too, had no problem with the doctrines and dogma of the Catholic Church. Mary wasn’t a stumbling block, nor the saints, or the pedophile priest scandal.
For ME, the stumbling block was (and still is) alcohol use not only by Catholics, but actually IN the Catholic parishes at socials. I find it difficult to reconcile use of a mind-altering drug with Christianity. Yes, Jesus used alcohol, but not the way it’s used to today, and He and His disciples certainly were never at risk for drunken driving murders.
Anyway, I won’t keep talking about this because I always get in trouble on CAF when this topic comes up. Please, everyone, don’t try to convince me that alcohol use by Christians is OK–I’ve heard all your arguments in person and on CAF in the nearly ten years since converting, and I am more convinced than ever that alcohol use by Christians is questionable at best.
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