Can I pray for the intercession of any dead person?

[Flopfoot]

I have heard that you can pray to ‘saints’ who aren’t officially declared saints by the Church (because that’s how people become saints, by people praying to them). But does it have to be someone who we think might become an official saint, or can we pray to any dead person? I suppose that it wouldn’t work if that person we prayed to was in hell, but then again there are a lot of cases where we don’t know for sure if someone is in heaven or hell. For example, could I pray for the intercession of Cliff Burton to help me improve at playing the bass? He was bassist of Metallica, a musical inspiration of mine, died in a bus accident about 20 years ago, not sure if he was religious, but that doesn’t mean that he’s not in heaven or purgatory at least.

 

[Lorrie]

Long live Cliff Burton, his playing the bass was a miracle in itself! I was a huge Metallica fan until they sold out (anything after The Black Album is a waste in my opinion).

ANYWAY, its my understanding that the dead can’t pray for themselves much less anyone else. We can pray for them (repose of the souls in purgatory) but they can’t pray for us.%between%

I know someone will come along to give you a much better answer than I have given.

 

[John-the-Seeker]

I have heard that you can pray to ‘saints’ who aren’t officially declared saints by the Church (because that’s how people become saints, by people praying to them).
This is not true. People become saints because of their lives, their connection and devotion to God, His laws and His church,(His people). The saints become cannonized, recognized through the church through people who pray for the proposed saint’s INTERCESSION for needs of people on Earth and whose prayers are answered in ways that are deemed miraculous or in other words because the request for intercession and the result seem to have a direct relationship to one another. We do not pray to saints for things for all things come from God not from anywhere or anyone else. There are many unrecognized saints in Heaven. Some may even be greater saints than those we recognize on Earth. It is God’s intervention and interaction with sinners that makes saints. He calls upon us to pray to Him everyday giving Him permission and asking Him to make us and anyone we have the authority to intercede for saints. No one can become a saint without God’s help and each one of us have a fatal flaw within us that would lead to our damnation if we do not give Him our Hearts and our permission for Him to grow our Love for him.

"For example, could I pray for the intercession of Cliff Burton to help me improve at playing the bass?"
I reiterate, your talents and skills are gifts from God alone. They are His skills and your gifts. Cliff Burton is not God and niether he nor any person should be exalted as the source or giver of gifts. We sometimes are the instruments through which instruction and.or encouragement comes which enables others to develop more fully the gifts placed within us by God. In all things give glory to God. Praise God through His creation. Do not praise His Creation.

 

[Flopfoot]

I know that my talents come from God alone and that when we pray to saints we pray for their intercession - no saint can do miracles of their own power, only by God’s power. I just say ‘pray to saints’ so I didn’t have to keep repeating the word ‘intercession’ but what I really mean is to pray for their intercession.

You say that people become saints because of their lives. But how do we know who is a saint and who is not except for when they are officially recognised?

So, to use my example again. Cliff Burton is certainly not a recognised saint. But if there is no hard and fast criteria about who we can call an unrecognised saint, then is it possible that he is an unrecognised saint? In which case, can I pray for his intercession? I know that it doesn’t matter what I pray about, I was just using playing the bass as an example because, if I can pray for his intercession, it seems an appropriate thing to specifically pray for his intercession about - sort of similar to how people pray for St Anthony’s intercession to help them find lost things, or for St Benedict’s intercession to help them stay pure. All of these gifts come from God but we pray for various saints’ intercession.

Hope I make more sense this time.

 

[John-the-Seeker]

The best I can say is that ONLY the Church can authorize the designation of saint. Only God knows who is or who is not a saint. The Book of Maccabees tells us it is good to pray FOR the dead. This is because deceased souls in Purgatory or those who would go to Hell without prayer can do nothing after death for themselves but we can and they CAN intercede for us. So YES you may and should pray for the dead and for their intercession. Maybe Cliff Buron, to use your example, might just make it into Heaven, through your prayers, and thus become a saint. As a saint he could intercede for you and your Bass playing might benefit. Just be careful not to fall in to the trap of ancestor worship, as you have indicated you would not, and pray to any creature for gifts. Give unto God that which is God’s. I apologize for being too litteral in my first response.

 

[cmt]

Lorrie:

ANYWAY, its my understanding that the dead can’t pray for themselves much less anyone else. We can pray for them (repose of the souls in purgatory) but they can’t pray for us.%between%

Link

Link:

Do the souls in purgatory pray for us? May we call upon them in our needs? There is no decision of the Church on this subject, nor have the theologians pronounced with definiteness concerning the invocation of the souls in purgatory and their intercession for the living. In the ancient liturgies there are no prayers of the Church directed to those who are still in purgatory. On the tombs of the early Christians nothing is more common than a prayer or a supplication asking the departed to intercede with God for surviving friends, but these inscriptions seem always to suppose that the departed one is already with God. St. Thomas (II-II:83:11) denies that the souls in purgatory pray for the living, and states they are not in a position to pray for us, rather we must make intercession for them. Despite the authority of St. Thomas, many renowned theologians hold that the souls in purgatory really pray for us, and that we may invoke their aid. Bellarmine (De Purgatorio, lib. II, xv,) says the reason alleged by St. Thomas is not at all convincing, and holds that in virtue of their greater love of God and their union with Him their prayers may have great intercessory power, for they are really superior to us in love of God, and in intimacy of union with Him. Suarez (De poenit., disp. xlvii, s. 2, n. 9) goes farther and asserts “that the souls in purgatory are holy, are dear to God, love us with a true love and are mindful of our wants; that they know in a general way our necessities and our dangers, and how great is our need of Divine help and divine grace”.