Can Prayer Really Change God's Mind?

  • Thread starter Thread starter RedFan
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
R

RedFan

Guest
Do prayers of the faithful for the occurrence or non occurrence of an event have at least the potential to get God to alter His plan, or are they wholly ineffectual? What is the third possibility, if any?

Let’s take Mark 13:18 as an example, discussing the Great Tribulation whose “hour no one knows, neither the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father” according to Mark 13:32. “Pray that it may not be in winter,” Jesus says. Why bother? If the Father knows the hour, is it a particular hour He has already fixed in stone, or a “floating” hour that won’t be fixed until all the prayers are in? If the former, how can we say our prayers are potentially efficacious? If the latter, how is it that He already “knows” the hour?
 
Perhaps, only the Father knows the hour because only he can set the hour. Maybe He has an idea of when the hour might be but it is not set in stone and can be swayed by prayer. Maybe this is why Jesus does not even know when it is and He is God.
 
Prayer means that we’re in right relationship with God, the relationship of dependency for one.
Without that state or relationship based on faith, hope, and love, God has no avenue through which to work in us. That’s the way it is: man was made for communion with God.
 
Last edited:
What if there are multiple different events that all still allow God’s Will to be done, and so praying may bring one to occur and not the other?
 
If all time and history is present to God, I think It follows that if our prayer is effectual it is because our prayer is in His plan.
 
Of course prayer can. Moses is a prime example -
God wanted to wipe out the Israelite people - for the golden calf.

Or Nineveh, in the time of Jonah…they repented.
Jonah folded his arms in anger. HA !
There’s other examples…

The lady to whom Jesus said, " it’s not right - to give bread to the dogs "

BUT… a sick person was dying, a person began earnestly praying for her…
she said to stop it - it was delaying her entrance into Heaven.
 
Last edited:
I also think about Hezekiah. The Lord sent the prophet Isaiah to him to tell him he was about to die. Hezekiah prayed to the Lord and the scripture says: "Then the word of the LORD came to Isaiah, saying, Go and say to Hezekiah, 'Thus says the LORD, the God of your father David, “I have heard your prayer, I have seen your tears; behold, I will add fifteen years to your life.…” (Isaiah chapter 38)
 
We can’t make God change His plans; but He knows past, present and future in His eternal Now.
He takes our prayers into account within His plan. Our prayers make a difference because God gives us that privilege.
 
The author of these verses (and many others) clearly thought that God’s mind could be swayed, and otherwise-intended divine outcomes altered, by prayer. It’s a natural way of thinking, and I dare say most of us still think that way. BUT WHAT ABOUT THE LOGICAL PROBLEM OF OMNISCIENT GOD KNOWING THE OUTCOME IN ADVANCE?

When “[t]he Lord sent the prophet Isaiah to him to tell him he was about to die,” was it true? Clearly not; it was off by 15 years. Did God think it was true at the time (such as would save it from being a known falsehood, i.e., a lie)? Clearly not; He’s omniscient. That means He knew the prayers were coming and that He was going to answer them – so in effect He empowered the supplicant to “determine” the outcome. Comes the question: why the divine lie? Why not tell Hezekiah “Unless you pray to me to extend your life, you are about to die”?

(I would argue that Isaiah didn’t consider God omniscient, but I don’t want to take my own post off-track . . .)
 
RedFan said:
When “[t]he Lord sent the prophet Isaiah to him to tell him he was about to die,” was it true?
Click to expand...
God relates to humans in a human way. We live in the temporal realm and God intervenes in a temporal way. God’[s foreknowledge doesn’t change the fact that Hezekiah was about to die. God didn’t lie because at that moment in time Hezekiah was going to die.
 
But that’s what puzzles me. It seems either God lied or He changed His mind. You favor the latter. So do I, but at a minimum its means I have to lower Num. 23:19 from the masthead.
 
Last edited:
RedFan said:
But that’s what puzzles me. It seems either God lied or He changed His mind. You favor the latter. So do I, but at a minimum its means I have to lower Num. 23:19 from the masthead.
Click to expand...
My good friend, in my opinion you can raise it back up there. I don’t see God changing His mind in this account. God’s plan was for Hezekiah to do a serious assessment of his life. God already knew what He wanted Hezekiah to know. That Hezekiah had been a good and faithful servant. Like Job he was willing to take his case before God. " I have been a good and faithful servant of your laws" This is risky because doing that could prove you wrong and death justifiable. In Hezekiah’s case God agreed and gave him more life. This is God revealing man to himself. The thing is, if Hezekiah had died he would have died in God’s favor but he wouldn’t have known it.

I don’t see God changing His mind in this account.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top