Catechist issues

[hoping4more]

Several problems currently going through while my wife and I both serve as catechist and our twins are preparing for first communion.

1. We felt a little pressured into volunteering but thought there would be more support than there has been. I (me only and not her) taught as a co-teacher last year which wasn’t too bad since there was always a backup but this year am by myself which can be difficult if I wake up sick etc(the other co teacher didn’t volunteer again this year). The subs never EVER reply to emails. My wife has two highschool helpers but they still can’t teach the class unless a cleared adult is in the room; so she doesn’t have any sort of backup either.
   1a. There is only one other young mom that does this. The other parents are kinda nervous or uncomfortable(this is my observation and maybe it is because there is a man teaching their little kid in a room for an hour; I know I would be uneasy), I am not sure if they are just going through the motions to maintain their cultural catholicism or what. We recently had a Christmas event canceled; their second grade teacher was planning this and has asked for volunteers in the past since it is such large class; I have heard her voice a few complaints related to the difficulty of teaching before; it wasn’t stated as such but I think she was feed up with the other parents not helping.
   1b With doing this we have both questioned why no one else volunteers? Why not people with highschoolers, young adults or young grandmas? I think this is way too difficult when one has small children, but why haven’t others who have gone through this volunteered at a later stage in life? It is just frustrating seeing so many adults at our parish and plenty of people to bake cookies or Oktoberfest brats but virtually no one wants to lift a finger to help kids.
2. The RE director is trying to make everyone behave like it is 1940s and we are supposed to all have kids seen and not heard or whatever. Says kids in second grade preparing for first communion shouldn’t be reading or coloring etc but attentive to the entire Mass. Practically speaking this is really unrealistic/difficult. Doctrinally, I am pretty sure this is just wrong; maybe it is what she or the priest wants but to foist that on the parents and the little kids who can’t handle it is incorrect. Case in point; Eastern Rite churches, their BABIES recieve baptism and first communion (I am guessing only a sip of the Blood and not Body), so it is not as if children must understand what they are doing etc. Perhaps it is good for them to understand it is a grave matter/seriousness to hold/consume the Eucharist, but for them to sit at full attention for a whole hour plus of course the obligated hour of Sunday school.
3. We are both struggling spiritually/morally but I and to a certain extent she, thought this could be helpful. I questioned, in my mind at least, if we should be taking on leadership roles with our current struggles but thought this is where God is possibly leading us or allowing us and that everyone has problems and we could keep our spiritual struggles somewhat compartmentalized, etc. …

 

[hoping4more]

…Well, that may have been the case, but with the other problems this is made much worse. We have considered leaving for another parish at the beginning of Christmas break…
4. There is a lot of rude people in the parish. Once giving a tour of the church during sunday school, my wife and I, her Kindergarten class and my 3rd grade, were told by someone they were going to pray the Rosary(about 45 minutres before Mass and with the microphone) and started when we were right behind her, half way through our tour. And yes, we were really quiet and the kids were good the whole time. Needless to say we promplty left; the senior high school said she was shocked at how rude the parishoner was. On another occasion, while at Mass, the kids didn’t get a good nights rest etc but were not being that bad; at one point the 4yo crawled under the pew for a second but that was the extent of it. Anywho, the elderly couple behind us were giving some old people grumbles that I could n’t hear but my wife heard them say “Terrible” and shake their head, refused to look or say ‘Peace’ to us. My wife started crying and we just went to the Narthanx.
5. As I said we were considering another parish; this one is in our county but slightly farther away than another, however her mom lives close and the kids liked sitting with her at church but she hasn’t come once this fall semester, which makes Mass more difficult which makes teaching more difficult. The other one is insufferably liberal, we went for a while while in college, but at this point if it makes it any easier with the kids I am all for it. I dont think we will quit mid year, but most likely leaving at the start of summer.

Should I bring up any of these difficulties and disagreements to the RE director?
Should we stay or leave? Any value in staying somewhere where we put in two years, and our kids have been? I don’t think I know even one other dad/man by first name…I could look at the parent list for my class but you know what I mean.
Are we terrible teachers/communicators? Should we be giving more info to them? This is the only capacity in which either of us have taught young kids.
Other thoughts?

 

[TC3033]

OK…so a lot going on here.

You made mention of why nobody volunteers, but then went on about the RE (and maybe the priest) and how they want it. Do you think that the two may be linked, and that is why nobody wants to volunteer.

Should I bring up any of these difficulties and disagreements to the RE director?

It wouldn’t hurt, but I wouldn’t expect changes. My wife’s parish switched from classroom to a family program a few years ago. None of the parents wanted to participate and raised their concerns to basically be told “too bad, this is the way it is now and we’re never going back” My wife went out with a friend of her’s that very active in the Lutheran church two blocks away. They were so surprised at how many kids from the Catholic church switched to their youth program.

Should we stay or leave? Any value in staying somewhere where we put in two years, and our kids have been? I don’t think I know even one other dad/man by first name…I could look at the parent list for my class but you know what I mean.

Totally your call. Do what’s best for your kids and your family.

Are we terrible teachers/communicators? Should we be giving more info to them? This is the only capacity in which either of us have taught young kids.

No. Heck, one of the reasons we needed to quit the family program is we couldn’t teach our kids…and my wife’s a teacher…they didn’t want to listen to us.

My last thought is to go where you’re comfortable as a family. If it’s a different parish, so be it. I can speak to this from being in a much similar situation.

 

[1ke]

I would encourage you to volunteer where you feel called, not where you feel pressured.

If RE isn’t it, give your notice to the RE director.

Don’t worry about what other people do or other people think, you do you. that is the best advice I can give.

Also no one is looking at you askance for being a dad teaching religious ed, that’s in your head.

 

[BartholomewB]

@hoping4more, please allow me to ask you a hypothetical question. Imagine, for a moment, that you go to the RE director and tell him, “It looks as though I may have to give up doing this volunteer work here. It’s too much of a strain to have to follow a teaching method I don’t agree with.” What do you think would be his likely response?

 

[hoping4more]

I don’t disagree with the teaching method.

I am actually surprised at how wide open they leave us. They provide plenty of materials but don’t really check up too much.

I know it was a lot but doesn’t sound like you read it for what I wrote and to be abundantly clear. The only thing I disagreed with the RE dir was that the kids should be stone silent in mass or perhaps they aren’t ready for Communion. The rest was just bad personalities that I wanted to discuss how to deal with, maybe suggesting a family mass or something so all the grumps will know to come to a different one, or something.

 

[1ke]

The rest was just bad personalities that I wanted to discuss how to deal with, maybe suggesting a family mass or something so all the grumps will know to come to a different one, or something.

Or, just ignore the grumps.

 

[JulianN]

There is only one other young mom that does this. The other parents are kinda nervous or uncomfortable(this is my observation and maybe it is because there is a man teaching their little kid in a room for an hour; I know I would be uneasy)

I’m really surprised that the DRE allows this. There should be two unrelated adults in the classroom – at least that was my policy as a DRE, and I’ve never regretted it.

 

[BartholomewB]

Yes, I misread your point #2. I thought the director meant “no reading and coloring” in catechism class. I’m surprised that an RE director should think he’s entitled to tell parents how to look after their kids in Mass.

 

[1ke]

The RE director is trying to make everyone behave like it is 1940s and we are supposed to all have kids seen and not heard or whatever. Says kids in second grade preparing for first communion shouldn’t be reading or coloring etc but attentive to the entire Mass. Practically speaking this is really unrealistic/difficult.

It is not unrealistic to expect an 8 year old to sit and pay attention. You give them a chidlren’s mass book. You help them with the missal. You sing the songs and pray the prayers together.

Children that age do NOT need to be wallowing around on the pew, coloring, or otherwise not paying attention.

They are capable of paying attention for 8 hours a day in school. They can pay attention for 1 hour in mass. Will they be perfectly behaved every week? No. Might there be some melt downs? Yes. But on the whole, the expectation of how we behave and what we do at mass should be set by the parents and it shouldn’t involve entertainment unrelated to mass.

I’ve been teaching religious education for over 25 years, and 8 years olds can certainly behave. The 8 year olds in our parish do so every week.

 

[1ke]

Yes, I misread your point #2. I thought the director meant “no reading and coloring” in catechism class. I’m surprised that an RE director should think he’s entitled to tell parents how to look after their kids in Mass.

Part of religious formation for first communion is the mass itself and preparation for receiving in mass. The parts of the mass, the prayers, what goes on at mass.

Seven and eight year olds are not babies or toddlers. They are capable of understanding and behaving. I’m surprised at the low expectations people have of 7 and 8 year old children.

 

[1ke]

I’m really surprised that the DRE allows this. There should be two unrelated adults in the classroom – at least that was my policy as a DRE, and I’ve never regretted it.

In a best case scenario there are 2 catechists or a catechist and helper per classroom. When volunteers are not forthcoming, you make do with what you get. Which doesn’t always equate to two people per classroom.

 

[JulianN]

In a best case scenario there are 2 catechists or a catechist and helper per classroom. When volunteers are not forthcoming, you make do with what you get. Which doesn’t always equate to two people per classroom.

It is difficult, but I usually found a parent who was willing to help out for the day if the regular volunteer could not. Or I had them rotate. I believe it’s in the best interests of the children, and the catechists, to have another adult in the room with them.

 

[redbetta]

I think it’s a cultural thing. At my parish, the children of Indian parents, including very young ones, I always see praying and they seem to be paying attention. It’s always the American ones that need to have some sort of distraction like coloring books and Cheerios to keep them still.

 

[TC3033]

And here we go…

 

[hoping4more]

6 hours a day*

And they are usually coloring or participating in some other way along with lunch and other breaks in school. Also, dont’ forget they are supposed to go to Sunday School, after riding in the car for 25 minutes there and knowing they’ll have that ride back home, it is closer to a half day for them and just a 6th day for the 4yo in Pre-k.

I wasn’t in the meeting but it wasn’t as if she suggested childrens missals etc.

It was actually the 4 yo who was doing the wallowing, not the older ones.

 

[1ke]

I wasn’t referring to the 4 yo, the 2nd graders can learn to participate in the mass. If you don’t have a children’s missal, i highly recommend getting some.

We Go To Mass is a board book for the young ones— such as your 4 year old.

There are lots of different children’s missals:

https://www.catholiccompany.com/childrens-missal-c824/

 

[blackforest]

It is not unrealistic to expect an 8 year old to sit and pay attention.

Keep in mind that this is a different generation, in which ADHD and the autism spectrum reign supreme. These are reasons - not excuses - for why some 8-year-old children are better off doing something calming like coloring than making much worse disruptions during Mass.

 

[1ke]

Keep in mind that this is a different generation, in which ADHD and the autism spectrum reign supreme.

Reign, as in override common sense. ADHD, ADD, Aspergers, Autism all existed before we had names for them.

Children with behavioral and mental disabilities can be members of the congregation and can participate in mass. They can love Jesus and receive him in the Eucharist.

Any individualized situation should be discussed with the RE director, the pastor, and the family to make a plan for that child. Adapted curriculum and teach at home options exist for a child where RE classroom isn’t in their best interest. Cry room, attending mass or part of the mass, daily mass, or even watching on TV for a child who has these difficulties can introduce them and help them learn to participate over time.

The OP doesn’t indicate they have an atypical child. An average 8 year old is very capable of the behavior I described. The example of a child with a disability doesn’t disprove the average 8 year old’s ability to sit in mass and participate.

These are reasons - not excuses - for why some 8-year-old children are better off doing something calming like coloring than making much worse disruptions during Mass.

These may be reasons why a specific child may need a coping strategy, one that should be discussed with the pastor and the child’s doctor and/or therapist.

It is not a reason for children in general to be given distractors during mass.

 

[blackforest]

Reign, as in override common sense. ADHD, ADD, Aspergers, Autism all existed before we had names for them.

Yes, I’m familiar with the “better diagnosis” hypothesis. But seasoned teachers will tell you that things really, really have changed. When I was growing up, we never heard about autistic children getting locked into rooms, tackled by teachers, or dragged away by police. Granted, that’s rare in an RE setting. On the other hand, classrooms would have “that hyper kid” but nothing like the ADHD we see today.

It is not a reason for children in general to be given distractors during mass.

It’s just that you don’t know which of those children are “worthy” of having “distractors.” It goes back to that whole juice box discussion. My Kid Drinks Juice during Mass - Sorry (Not Sorry) If That Offends You. - Catholic Sistas

We don’t know either way, and so long as the kids stay quiet during Mass, it’s frankly none of our business. The most our RED told us was to bring kids to Mass every Sunday. The rest was left to us parents. As it should be.

Several problems currently going through while my wife and I both serve as catechist and our twins are preparing for first communion.

One way around this: Does our parish allow for home study? Mine let me just lent us the curriculum and do it at home.

For your mental health and to do what’s best for your family, at very least drop your volunteer commitment. Drop the kids off for an hour, pick them up, and go out for donuts. There’s no need to offer elaborate reasons. Stay vague, polite, and firm. Leave graciously. Assuage any guilt by volunteering to usher or something.