Catholic Church is not "Black"

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Jayda

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hola

i am sure people have been confronted with this before… friends or people you are trying to explain the Catholic faith to object to the term “universal” and say that the Church is not black or is not sensitive to black culture. i think one of the things that is difficult to explain to people is that many think of the Roman Catholic Church as only the Latin rite… there are many rites actually including two african rites, the coptic and the ethiopic.

i try to point out to my friends that the ethiopic rite is a wonderful example of traditional african culture expressing itself within the fold of the Holy Catholic Church. i also try to talk about the african Popes and their great contributions…

does anybody know other things that one could talk about?

muchas gracias
Dominus Vobsicum
 
When people talk about “Black Culture”, normally they are talking about “American Black Culture”. This slights the rest of the “Black Culture” around the world.

If the Catholic Chuch was not for all races, it would not be growing in Africa and other places. In addition, mention there are a number of Bishops and Cardinals that are black. Included in these is Cardinal Arinze (which was my first choice for Pope).

BYW: My heritage is Celtic and Teutonic in origin.
 
Jayda said:
hola

i am sure people have been confronted with this before… friends or people you are trying to explain the Catholic faith to object to the term “universal” and say that the Church is not black or is not sensitive to black culture. i think one of the things that is difficult to explain to people is that many think of the Roman Catholic Church as only the Latin rite… there are many rites actually including two african rites, the coptic and the ethiopic.

i try to point out to my friends that the ethiopic rite is a wonderful example of traditional african culture expressing itself within the fold of the Holy Catholic Church. i also try to talk about the african Popes and their great contributions…

does anybody know other things that one could talk about?

muchas gracias
Dominus Vobsicum
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Hmmmm…New Orleans? 🙂

My parish in Houston has more black families than I’ve seen in a Catholic church in Texas in a long time. Our choir leader is African American and sings gorgeous gospel tunes from time to time. He wears a dashiki to the more casual Saturday night Masses.

I went to a concert at the seminary last weekend and we heard a Nigerian seminarian sing Psalms in his native language.

In my parents diocese, they have gotten around the vocations problem by hosting many many priests from Ghana over the years. Speaking with one of these priests, he told me there are so many priests in Ghana (at least at that time, this was about 10 years ago) that they don’t have enough PARISHES to go around, so they’re coming to the US and other countries.

The parish makeup is just a product of location. When I lived in 98% lily-white Illinois suburbs, the church was almost all white. Back home here on the coast, there are churches where I’m more likely to be the one causing people to take notice because I’m the only person who’s not Vietnamese or Hispanic.
 
There are several black saints, the most prominant in my mind being St. Martin de Porres. He is the patron of the Southern Dominican Province here in the US. My church has a gorgeous bronze statue of him in our courtyard.

There’s also St. Moses the Black, and St. Benedict the Black, St. Augustine was from north Africa, and he’s a father of the church. There’s a book on Black saints I saw recently in my local catholic book store that tells the stories of saints and blessed people of African descent. These stories would probably help you.

The thing about african culture though, folks need to understand we’re trying to go for a “catholic” culture, one that is for all people, regardless of their ancestry. You’re supposed to leave yourself behind and be only for Christ when you walk into His church. As St. John the Baptist said, “He must increase, I must decrease.”
 
ohh i know it is so frustrating! when i was a missionary i spent more time with black catholics than with white catholics by far, especially in africa. africa is the most amazing place in the entire world, all of the religious orders and priests are so young! the nuns i worked with were all a little older than me, as was one of the priests.

i strongly believe some day african missionaries will be sent to europe and america to reinvigorate the faith, and call the lost back to the Church.

but for some reason certain people i have tried to explain these to here reject this and say it does not count. their opinion is that these are just black people mimicking white traditions… explaining to them that the ethiopic rite was born in africa or that african people embrace the Church as a natural extension of their beliefs and cultures seems to have no effect…

i think you are right, they want american black culture… and even then i do not think they mean langston hughes… they mean 50 cent.

how do we move past this roadblock?

gracias
Dominus Vobiscum
 
My church has many different ethnicities represented. In fact, we have a Spanish Mass, specifically for our sizable Hispanic community.

We also have Vietnamese, Korean, African, Indian, and Phillipino folks.

I should also mention that when my RCIA class met with all the regional RCIA classes for a service with the Bishop presiding, I was very moved by the number of African Americans who were in the conversion process.

Remember that many African Americans historically came to the United States through the South. We share a region of the country (dawgfan) where Catholicism was not very well tolerated. For many generations Catholics were to many Southerners, regarded on the same level as blacks and Jews (which is to say, not held in high regard or overtly discriminated against). Therefore, it was difficult enough to be black in the post-war South without also becoming a Catholic (though Louisiana was somewhat of an exception here as it is in many things).
 
From what I remember, one of the three wise men of Catholic art was depicted as an African. I think it was Balthazzar. Also, Simon of Cyrene is also depicted as an African. Why would a church who did not welcome diversity not also want to alter the ethnicity of major players of the Bible?

I think the heart of the issue is whether the Church did enough during periods of slavery. In that case, your friend’s beef should be with the governments of the countries that allowed slavery and not the Church. Take for example, Spain. The Spanish government was a HUGE proponent of African slavery and the Spanish government FLAUNTED it’s Catholicism, much to the Church’s detriment. I would do some research and would point out in history where the Church and the Spanish government were separate and where the Church and the Spanish government were not (i.e. Clergy holding positions of power). The history is ugly. It probably would be best to acknowledge where it was ugly and point out how un-ugly it is now and go from there! Mention that it is currently against Church law for a clergyman to hold positions of power. As an example, you might even want to look up Ernesto Cardenal on the internet. His story will even back up the Church’s stance on priests in power with regards to modern times.
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Our Bishop, Bishop Terry Steib, is black and one of our associate pastors is African (Nigeria, I think). We even have an annual Afroculture Mass along with other different cultural Masses, we are even having a Filipino (sp?) Mass in May. I think the Catholic church is the most diversie and culture friendly church I’ve ever been in!
 
Jayda said:
i strongly believe some day african missionaries will be sent to europe and america to reinvigorate the faith, and call the lost back to the Church.
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I feel like it already is happening. We just hosted Fr. Mark Obayi, a black priest from Nigeria for a year as our parochial vicar so that he could learn more about TV/radio and running Catholic youth camps. However, he has taught us so much about being a humble servant and living out the faith. He has been great with our youth and delivered amazing homilies. He has shared great insight into the church in Nigeria. The faith is strong there despite some struggles and less resources. I’ve heard that we are getting another Nigerian priest as his replacement.

Fr. Mark has inspired us so much that we are planning a mini-mission with my women’s Bible study group for 2008 to visit him and help out whereever he needs us. We are looking forward to giving back to him in a small way for what he has given us this year. When he gets home he will be pastor of his rural parish, starting up a Catholic radio station, director for youth (up to age 35) for his diocese and organizer for a Catholic youth camp. He has saved most of his salary from this year to put into his ministry at home. He also would not take any gifts except for his ministry work.

It makes me feel ashamed when I think that I’m too tired or busy or broke to help out with more things here where we have all kinds of resources and transportation to get the job done.
 
It depends on the parish you’re looking at. This is how the seven parishes in my town lineup:

St. V - mixed
St. M - very, very mixed leaning to hispanic
St. MV - formerly Episcopal (very small)
St. Matt - Hispanic
Vietnamese Martyrs - Vietnamese (largest parish in town)
St. MBS - probably white, a little mixed
St. Joe - African!!!

I know from looking at the so-called minorities in my parish, the Africans and Vietnamese are the most holy. MHO
 
pprimeau1976 said:
From what I remember, one of the three wise men of Catholic art was depicted as an African.
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I think that’s not traditional Catholic art but probably modern art inspired by the “diversity” agenda. Here’s what the Catholic Encyclopedia says about where they came from:
Passing over the purely legendary notion that they represented the three families which are decended from Noah, it appears they all came from “the east” (Matthew 2:1, 2, 9). East of Palestine, only ancient Media, Persia, Assyria, and Babylonia had a Magian priesthood at the time of the birth of Christ. From some such part of the Parthian Empire the Magi came. They probably crossed the Syrian Desert, lying between the Euphrates and Syria, reached either Haleb (Aleppo) or Tudmor (Palmyra), and journeyed on to Damascus and southward, by what is now the great Mecca route (darb elhaj, “the pilgrim’s way”), keeping the Sea of Galilee and the Jordan to their west till they crossed the ford near Jericho. We have no tradition of the precise land meant by “the east”. It is Babylon, according to St. Maximus (Homil. xviii in Epiphan.); and Theodotus of Ancyra (Homil. de Nativitate, I, x); Persia, according to Clement of Alexandria (Strom., I xv) and St. Cyril of Alexandria (In Is., xlix, 12); Aribia, according to St. Justin (Cont. Tryphon., lxxvii), Tertullian (Adv. Jud., ix), and St. Epiphanius (Expos. fidei, viii).
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Also, Simon of Cyrene is also depicted as an African.
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His home town (Cyrene) is in North Africa. But I don’t believe he was black. There’s all kinds of art depicting all kinds of religious figures as black – that doesn’t mean that’s authentic. (Some black activists for example say that Jesus was black)
I think the heart of the issue is whether the Church did enough during periods of slavery.
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I was told that the Church saw slavery as a social, cultural institution. But she did advocate for some of the rights of slaves. Here’s a good article on the ethics of slavery:

newadvent.org/cathen/14039a.htm
 
My church has always has some Black parishoners. Not as many as we’d like, but always some. One of my own personal heroes is Pierre Toussaint, the former slave turned philanthropist.
I hope he is canonized. Then there is Mother Mary Lange the founder of the Oblate Sisters of Providence and Henriette Delille founder of the Sisters of the Holy Family. They were both devoted and holy women and I hope they are canonized. How about St. Josephine Bakita? Her story is gripping.
 
Why must the Church be black, white, brown, yellow or red?

WHY?
 
The Spanish government “flaunted” Catholicism? I have studied some Spanish history and I was unaware of that.

About slavery - several European nations engaged in it (Spain, Portugal, England and Holland). Portugal probably was in it the most, because it was and is such a small country, while Brazil is a huge country.

Back to the topic - there are two “black” or “African-American” parishes in the Pittsburgh Diocese. They are St. Charles Lawanga and St. Benedict the Moor, which overlooks the Civic Arena (and will overlook the Penguins’ new arena).
 
I went to CCD classes with a black girl. The Catholic church is not to be racist.
 
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