Catholic Denominations?

[nsper7]

One place where it seems Roman Catholics attack Protestantism as a whole is on the issue of all the Protestant denominations (several thousand) floating around out there. Although Roman Catholicism claims to be only one denomination, if one looks at the broad gamut of beliefs espoused by various RC groups (that are aceepted by the RCC of course), it seems as though they have quite a few denominations.

For example, there is the Catholic Worker Movement (founded a deemed Servant of God), a Christian anarchist movement with many similarities to modern-day Mennonites. There are all the religious orders as well (Franciscans, Dominicans, Opus Dei, Carmelites, Benedictines, etc.) which, although they claim to be a part of the RCC, show differences among themselves, and compared to ‘average’ RCers, greater than between many Protestant denominations. There are self-espoused Traditional Catholics (including the iffy SSPXers), Byzantine Catholics, Novus Ordo Catholics, etc. Then there are the fringe-group RCs, such as the sedevacantists and conclavists. There are also charismatic movements with Catholicism as well. Among RC theologians, there are significant theological differences, such as Bishop John Michael Botean who declared it would be a mortal sin to serve in the Iraq War.

Although, except for a few of the fringe groups, all these sects/movements/etc. are within the Roman Catholic Church, they show significant theological and practical differences (i.e. compare a practicing Roman Catholic who is an influential businessperson or politician to the members of the Catholic Worker Movement).

From an outsider’s perspective, it almost appears as though the RCC has become a bit of a ‘big tent’ (with some limits of course). I am not trying to cast aspersions or insult the Roman Catholic Church, but merely trying to point out how the sects and movements within the RCC are comparable to many of the Protestant denominations.

EDIT: Through more exhaustive research, I am sure I could find more examples of various sects within the RCC. Also, I am not trying to judge the ‘rightness’ or ‘wrongness’ of these sects, merely pointing out how diverse they are in theology and practice.

 

[Tietjen]

EDIT: Through more exhaustive research, I am sure I could find more examples of various sects within the RCC. Also, I am not trying to judge the ‘rightness’ or ‘wrongness’ of these sects, merely pointing out how diverse they are in theology and practice.

I think that perhaps you SHOULD do additional research. You will find that we Catholics have many more denominations within our Church. For example, we have the blonde Catholics, the brunette Catholics, and the balding Catholics. Then we have the young Catholics, the middle-aged Catholics, and the older Catholics. We also have the tall Catholics, the short Catholics, the slim Catholics and the wider Catholics. We cannot forget about the blue-eyed Catholics, the brown-eyed Catholics, the green-eyed Catholics, the hazel-eyed Catholics or the occasional red-eyed Catholics. You see, there are just so many different denominations within the Catholic Church that one can hardly count them all. Oh but wait… me thinks that perhaps these things are not really denominations at all. But they must be! They have just as much right to be called denominations as your assertion that different religious “orders” are denominations. If those things that I called denominations sound silly to you, think how much sillier your assertions sound to me. It was a nice try however; but the fact remains, Catholics (regardless of order) share a common faith. We recognize a common Papa. We are united in our beliefs as put forth in Scripture, Tradition, and the Magisterium. Unlike the differing Protestant denominations that cannot even find agreement on things like baptism and salvation.

PS - Groups that break away or split off from the Catholic Church are not called Catholic denominations… they are called Protestants.

 

[jdnrite01]

Your rambling fulmination against the Catholic Church discloses your utter lack of knowledge thereof. For instance, the Jesuits, Franciscans, Benedictines, etc., are simply different organizations of clergy with different missions. They are united in obedience to the Pope and their theology is completely orthodox. Opus Dei is not an Order, strictly speaking. It is a way of life. Byzantine Catholics do not constitute a separate sect of Catholicism; their theology is identical with Rome, and they are obedient to the Pope The only difference is manifest in their liturgy, which BTW, is absolutely beautiful. SSPX is a group of disobedient Catholics, who while acknowleging the Pope as the Vicar of Christ, nevertheless disobey his rulings. They don’t exist as an indedendent Catholic body; they’re merely wayward children.

The long and short of it is that the word “Catholic” means universal, in thought, deeds and theology.

 

[Righteousone]

I think that perhaps you SHOULD do additional research. You will find that we Catholics have many more denominations within our Church. For example, we have the blonde Catholics, the brunette Catholics, and the balding Catholics. Then we have the young Catholics, the middle-aged Catholics, and the older Catholics. We also have the tall Catholics, the short Catholics, the slim Catholics and the wider Catholics. We cannot forget about the blue-eyed Catholics, the brown-eyed Catholics, the green-eyed Catholics, the hazel-eyed Catholics or the occasional red-eyed Catholics. You see, there are just so many different denominations within the Catholic Church that one can hardly count them all. Oh but wait… me thinks that perhaps these things are not really denominations at all. But they must be! They have just as much right to be called denominations as your assertion that different religious “orders” are denominations. If those things that I called denominations sound silly to you, think how much sillier your assertions sound to me. It was a nice try however; but the fact remains, Catholics (regardless of order) share a common faith. We recognize a common Papa. We are united in our beliefs as put forth in Scripture, Tradition, and the Magisterium. Unlike the differing Protestant denominations that cannot even find agreement on things like baptism and salvation.

PS - Groups that break away or split off from the Catholic Church are not called Catholic denominations… they are called Protestants.

 

[Righteousone]

One place where it seems Roman Catholics attack Protestantism as a whole is on the issue of all the Protestant denominations (several thousand) floating around out there. Although Roman Catholicism claims to be only one denomination, if one looks at the broad gamut of beliefs espoused by various RC groups (that are aceepted by the RCC of course), it seems as though they have quite a few denominations.

For example, there is the Catholic Worker Movement (founded a deemed Servant of God), a Christian anarchist movement with many similarities to modern-day Mennonites. There are all the religious orders as well (Franciscans, Dominicans, Opus Dei, Carmelites, Benedictines, etc.) which, although they claim to be a part of the RCC, show differences among themselves, and compared to ‘average’ RCers, greater than between many Protestant denominations. There are self-espoused Traditional Catholics (including the iffy SSPXers), Byzantine Catholics, Novus Ordo Catholics, etc. Then there are the fringe-group RCs, such as the sedevacantists and conclavists. There are also charismatic movements with Catholicism as well. Among RC theologians, there are significant theological differences, such as Bishop John Michael Botean who declared it would be a mortal sin to serve in the Iraq War.

Although, except for a few of the fringe groups, all these sects/movements/etc. are within the Roman Catholic Church, they show significant theological and practical differences (i.e. compare a practicing Roman Catholic who is an influential businessperson or politician to the members of the Catholic Worker Movement).

From an outsider’s perspective, it almost appears as though the RCC has become a bit of a ‘big tent’ (with some limits of course). I am not trying to cast aspersions or insult the Roman Catholic Church, but merely trying to point out how the sects and movements within the RCC are comparable to many of the Protestant denominations.

EDIT: Through more exhaustive research, I am sure I could find more examples of various sects within the RCC. Also, I am not trying to judge the ‘rightness’ or ‘wrongness’ of these sects, merely pointing out how diverse they are in theology and practice.

Nice try!.. still no excuse for 30,000 denominations floating out there…thank you Lord for my beautiful holy Catholic church.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

Although, except for a few of the fringe groups, all these sects/movements/etc. are within the Roman Catholic Church, they show significant theological and practical differences (i.e. compare a practicing Roman Catholic who is an influential businessperson or politician to the members of the Catholic Worker Movement).

This strikes me as being the same as saying that since Democrats and Republicans have different political priorities they aren’t all Americans. Or since the Army, Air Force, Navy, and Marines cover different aspects of our defense, they’re not all Americans.

As long as these different groups are in union with the Pope and their local bishop, they are Catholic.

 

[heisenburg]

All Catholic “rites” whether Roman Rite, Eastern, etc, have one thing in common… They all believe the same thing with respect to Faith and Morals… all the way down to the finite down to the details…

What you see as denominations are simply different WAYS of offering the same information, and/or maybe a group that focuses more on one or two aspects of that like teaching…

How is this different than protestantism, (and this is not an attack on protestantism)?

If you go down the list of any protestant group of beliefs, and then compare it to any other… you will find differences… Some subtle, some extreme.

They each teach something different with respect to the other. It’s more than just how they practice their faith, it is that the very aspect of what that faith means is different…

Example…
The Faith and Morals taught for a Roman Rite Catholic is exactly the same as the faith and morals taught for an Eastern Rite Catholic…

However, would anyone say that the faith and morals taught by an Episcopal is exactly the same as a AoG church? If you are honest, no…

In Christ

 

[Mannyfit75]

One place where it seems Roman Catholics attack Protestantism as a whole is on the issue of all the Protestant denominations (several thousand) floating around out there. Although Roman Catholicism claims to be only one denomination, if one looks at the broad gamut of beliefs espoused by various RC groups (that are aceepted by the RCC of course), it seems as though they have quite a few denominations.

First all the Catholic Church is not a denomination. Since its faith is one and it professes one doctrine.

For example, there is the Catholic Worker Movement (founded a deemed Servant of God), a Christian anarchist movement with many similarities to modern-day Mennonites. There are all the religious orders as well (Franciscans, Dominicans, Opus Dei, Carmelites, Benedictines, etc.) which, although they claim to be a part of the RCC, show differences among themselves, and compared to ‘average’ RCers, greater than between many Protestant denominations. There are self-espoused Traditional Catholics (including the iffy SSPXers), Byzantine Catholics, Novus Ordo Catholics, etc. Then there are the fringe-group RCs, such as the sedevacantists and conclavists. There are also charismatic movements with Catholicism as well. Among RC theologians, there are significant theological differences, such as Bishop John Michael Botean who declared it would be a mortal sin to serve in the Iraq War.

These are not denominations. I believe Bishop Michael Botean is wrong in his statement because there are Catholic priests and laymen serving in the Iraq Conflict.

These are orders.

Although, except for a few of the fringe groups, all these sects/movements/etc. are within the Roman Catholic Church, they show significant theological and practical differences (i.e. compare a practicing Roman Catholic who is an influential businessperson or politician to the members of the Catholic Worker Movement).

From an outsider’s perspective, it almost appears as though the RCC has become a bit of a ‘big tent’ (with some limits of course). I am not trying to cast aspersions or insult the Roman Catholic Church, but merely trying to point out how the sects and movements within the RCC are comparable to many of the Protestant denominations.

EDIT: Through more exhaustive research, I am sure I could find more examples of various sects within the RCC. Also, I am not trying to judge the ‘rightness’ or ‘wrongness’ of these sects, merely pointing out how diverse they are in theology and practice.

First of all, when a Non-Catholic Christian addresses the Catholic Church as Roman Catholic Church ignore Catholics who are not Roman. Roman Catholic Church expresses Latin Rite, whose liturgy differs from the Eastern Rite.

The proper term to describe the Church of Christ, is it is the Catholic Church. Not Roman Catholic Church. It is Catholic because it is universal. It’s worship and liturgy are one (though differently expressed in the East but the sacrifice of the Divine Liturgy remains the same).

So if you call us Roman Catholic. You ignore our Eastern Catholics who are NOT Roman.

 

[GKC]

One place where it seems Roman Catholics attack Protestantism as a whole is on the issue of all the Protestant denominations (several thousand) floating around out there. Although Roman Catholicism claims to be only one denomination, if one looks at the broad gamut of beliefs espoused by various RC groups (that are aceepted by the RCC of course), it seems as though they have quite a few denominations.

For example, there is the Catholic Worker Movement (founded a deemed Servant of God), a Christian anarchist movement with many similarities to modern-day Mennonites. There are all the religious orders as well (Franciscans, Dominicans, Opus Dei, Carmelites, Benedictines, etc.) which, although they claim to be a part of the RCC, show differences among themselves, and compared to ‘average’ RCers, greater than between many Protestant denominations. There are self-espoused Traditional Catholics (including the iffy SSPXers), Byzantine Catholics, Novus Ordo Catholics, etc. Then there are the fringe-group RCs, such as the sedevacantists and conclavists. There are also charismatic movements with Catholicism as well. Among RC theologians, there are significant theological differences, such as Bishop John Michael Botean who declared it would be a mortal sin to serve in the Iraq War.

Although, except for a few of the fringe groups, all these sects/movements/etc. are within the Roman Catholic Church, they show significant theological and practical differences (i.e. compare a practicing Roman Catholic who is an influential businessperson or politician to the members of the Catholic Worker Movement).

From an outsider’s perspective, it almost appears as though the RCC has become a bit of a ‘big tent’ (with some limits of course). I am not trying to cast aspersions or insult the Roman Catholic Church, but merely trying to point out how the sects and movements within the RCC are comparable to many of the Protestant denominations.

EDIT: Through more exhaustive research, I am sure I could find more examples of various sects within the RCC. Also, I am not trying to judge the ‘rightness’ or ‘wrongness’ of these sects, merely pointing out how diverse they are in theology and practice.

(sigh).

GKC

Anglicanus Catholicus

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

One place where it seems Roman Catholics attack Protestantism as a whole is on the issue of all the Protestant denominations (several thousand) floating around out there. Although Roman Catholicism claims to be only one denomination, if one looks at the broad gamut of beliefs espoused by various RC groups (that are aceepted by the RCC of course), it seems as though they have quite a few denominations.

**You are correct in indicating the various Catholic ministries that exists around the world.True, If you dig more in each country of the world, you will find many more. The key in understanding these diversed communities , is we all believe the same doctrines, and we all have one authority. I can go anywhere in the world, attend a Roman Catholic Church, and follow and understand the Worship.

Thats the difference Catholics hold to one faith doctrine, and one authority, Protestants do not hold to one Christian teaching in its entirety, nor do hold to one authority.

I can see you dilema, But it is only through the Holy Spirit that Peoples from different cultures and languages all aroung the world believing the same in one faith, one baptism, and One Lord, for 2000 years.

This Rock (One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church) will be here when Jesus returns for His bride and we will be able to worship the same.Even in the resurrection the dead in christ will rise and worship the same way all Catholics do today, we will be united as one body of christ with her members in heaven and earth. No matter what different nationality or country one died in or is from heck even the dead in the sea will rise and fall right in to worship our savior (SEE THE BOOK OF REVELATIONS), we have Jesus promise on that.

Think about it, since Jesus resurrection, all the Christians that have lived, up to today believe the same until Jesus returns.

I pray this is not recieved as an attack on Protestants.**

 

[nsper7]

To all involved, this is not meant as an attack on the Catholic (big ‘C’) Church. Several people have mentioned the idea that all ‘true’ Catholic agree on doctrine and authority. Perhaps on authority, but I honestly am not so sure about doctrine. The fact that Bishop Botean declared that serving in Iraq was a mortal sin even though the Church had made no such proclamation seems to show a major doctrinal difference here. The fact that the standard Catholic view is that Salvation is maintained through confession of mortal sins, but certain groups, such as the Catholic Worker Movement and certain Catholic orders, seem to tack on a literalistic interpretation of Jesus words in the Sermon on the Mount, His parables and His words to the rich young ruler as part of maintaining Salvation. Again, looking from the outside, this seems a major doctrine difference. I can see some Catholics who practice their faith (i.e. Confession and Mass), but work in mundane secular professions and do virtually all the same things as their non-Catholic/non-Christian neighbors (except for perhaps the remorseless sinning). Others though give up their material possessions and their ‘secular’ lives and urge others to follow suit. Certainly these doctrinal differences and many more exist within Protestantism, I am merely trying to point out that, although Catholicism has maintained unity in many respects, there are still a wide range of theological views found within it.

I just want to note a few things. I mention the Catholic Worker Movement because I know someone involved with them. Also, I have no issues with the religious orders (Anglicanism has their own religious orders and I have even considered taking vows).

 

[Tietjen]

To all involved, this is not meant as an attack on the Catholic (big ‘C’) Church. Several people have mentioned the idea that all ‘true’ Catholic agree on doctrine and authority. Perhaps on authority, but I honestly am not so sure about doctrine. The fact that Bishop Botean declared that serving in Iraq was a mortal sin even though the Church had made no such proclamation seems to show a major doctrinal difference here. The fact that the standard Catholic view is that Salvation is maintained through confession of mortal sins, but certain groups, such as the Catholic Worker Movement and certain Catholic orders, seem to tack on a literalistic interpretation of Jesus words in the Sermon on the Mount, His parables and His words to the rich young ruler as part of maintaining Salvation. Again, looking from the outside, this seems a major doctrine difference. I can see some Catholics who practice their faith (i.e. Confession and Mass), but work in mundane secular professions and do virtually all the same things as their non-Catholic/non-Christian neighbors (except for perhaps the remorseless sinning). Others though give up their material possessions and their ‘secular’ lives and urge others to follow suit. Certainly these doctrinal differences and many more exist within Protestantism, I am merely trying to point out that, although Catholicism has maintained unity in many respects, there are still a wide range of theological views found within it.

I just want to note a few things. I mention the Catholic Worker Movement because I know someone involved with them. Also, I have no issues with the religious orders (Anglicanism has their own religious orders and I have even considered taking vows).

nsper, I know nothing about Bishop Botean or what he has said or hasn’t said. However, I can tell you that if he has said that serving in Iraq was a mortal sin, he was expressing his personal view on the matter and not rewriting Church doctrine. He’s a man who has an opinion, that’s all.

As for the Catholic Worker Movement, I am not familiar with this organization. However, it is very possible that it is simply a lay organization. That does not mean it is a denomination. As you are outside the Church looking in, it is understandable that you may not grasp how integrated a Church with over 1 billion people can be. There are so many organizations, religious orders, rites, etc. within the ONE Catholic Church that I suppose that I can see how you may believe there to be differing denominations. However, I can absolutely positively assure you that we all believe the same dogmas of the Church. We are all 100% Catholic. We may not all worship exactly the same way, we may not all dress the same, but we are all a part of the one Church founded by Christ on St Peter. We have the same sacraments, dogmas, Bible, Holy Papa, & Magisterium. That doesn’t mean we all like the same foods, wear the same style of dress, are all pacifists, refrain from meat 365 days a year (as some orders voluntarily do), etc. We are allowed to be individuals within the enormous box of Catholicism (that is staying within the confines of Church teaching) without all having to be placed into individual small boxes and stacked on the same self. God bless.