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david_house
Guest
What you define as a “sin” is again only a matter of opinion. There are many “sins” we could agree upon, but other restrictions which are your own self regulations. Fine for you maybe but it is a mistake to call them “sins” for the rest of us.
What upsets me are the double standards found within your faith. I have lived in a deeply RC country, where the Government and the legal system are dominated by your thinking. Most people attended church several times each week. It is also without doubt the most imoral place I have ever lived, with corruption at all levels of society, no-one’s word can really be trusted, stealing is commonplace, murder an every day occurence. The church protects the elite, whilst only paying lip service to the poor who they seem to want to stay poor to maintain their power over them. The priests often live well, driving around in big cars and demanding money from the people they are supposed to serve so they can maintain that lifestyle. Not surprisingly the priesthood seems to attract many who are not really responding to a call but who have an eye on a comfortable life. No doubt you think this is an exaggeration. It is my personal observation. I won’t identify which country as I guess it fits several.
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gardenswithkids
Guest
Our church recognizes sin–just as you recognize sin. With the exception or Jesus and Mary, we all sin. That you found sin and hypocrisy in the Catholic Church doesn’t surprise me–and it shouldn’t surprise anyone who knows their Catechism. In Catholic churches, we place statues of canonized saints on pedastals, not living humans.
Keeping with the “extreme Catholic” theme–some people consider saints “extremists”. Extremism in the good sense. Saints lived charity to extremes. They lived justice and temperance and all the other virtues to extremes. Basically, they lived their faith in Christ to extremes. Even when living in places where Christianity dominates, it is not easy to follow Christ to the extreme. We must continually struggle against our tendency to sin.
CCC 2520: Baptism confers on its recipient the grace of purification from all sins. But the baptized must continue to struggle against concupiscence of the flrsh and disordered desires. With God’s grace, he will prevails…
It’s no big surprise that when any institution holds power, people who seek power, seek positions in the institution that holds power. There’s also an old saying: power corrupts. You encountered sin and hypocrisy from people in positions of power. So did many of the saints. The difference is the saints did not loose their faith in Christ and His Church because of the misdeeds of sinful humans; in fact they were often inspired to follow Christ closer.
St. Teresa of Avila (who lived in Catholic Spain during the time of the Reformation and the Spanish Inquisition) said something to the effect that Christ had so few friends that those who are His friends should be good friends. She was a “Catholic Extremist” in the best sense.
Personal experience proves to me otherwise.
Perhaps you are unfamiliar with the many outreach programs the church has throughout the world that help the poor directly? ‘Food for the Poor’ comes to mind first.
It is very easy to point an accusing finger.
It is often much harder to back it with actual fact.
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EmperorNapoleon
Guest
And unfortunately, for many lay Catholics, it’s just going through the motions and not out of any real desire to help the poor. Something I find particularly offensive is a small paragraph, printed in the bulletin in my diocese, which instructs parisheners not to give money to any person outside or near the cathedral. They’ve even got the police to stand across the street, on the sidewalk in the immediate area, and inside the church every Sunday to shoo away beggars. Apparently a lot of people in my diocese don’t want to help the poor if it involves anything more than dropping a 10 in an offering plate or casually slipping it into a box. Not a very Christian thing to do if you ask me and, in my opinion, such an attitude and lack of any real action runs contrary to our obligation and God’s command to help the poor.
I can see good reason for this.
Why give money directly to a begger that may well use it to feed an addiction when the money can support a program that directly assists the begger with support as well as food and treatment for the possible addictions mentioned earlier.
And I am curious here…‘my diocese’??
Your profile says you are agnostic.
Both cannot be the case at the same time. So which is it?
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EmperorNapoleon
Guest
That issue can be dealt with if or when it arises. The possibility doesn’t change the fact that stuffing a couple of bucks in a box doesn’t even come close to meeting our obligation to charity or God’s commandment to help the poor and needy. I don’t believe that Jesus ever intended for charity to become so impersonal and void.
I’m agnostic and I attend mass on occasion.
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Nino
Guest
Good for you ,the best answer yet…we are not 'extreme’enough…we have become sadly too eager to please and not be considered the above…also…‘ole fashioned’ 'ultra’this or that and when hollyweird takes another punch at us and our beloved Church,we just roll over and play dead re: Vinci Code and angels etc hate flicks!!!We have fallen for the ‘dialogue’ bit…which has meant we go over to their side and they win again. Jesus was hated because there was a line drawn in the sand of values of which he would not cross…no matter what the price…even slow death on the cross. Maybe this cowardice will weigh on our scale of justice against us…lets wait and see!!!
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lizaanne
Guest
I watched this the other day and was reminded about this thread - what a fantastic coincidence!!!
CATHOLIC EXTREMISM!!
~Liza
CATHOLIC EXTREMISM!!
~Liza
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centurionguard
Guest
EXCELLENT ARTICLEI watched this the other day and was reminded about this thread - what a fantastic coincidence!!!
CATHOLIC EXTREMISM!!
~Liza
Thanks for posting it Liza. It’s good lesson all of us Catholics need to remember and most importantly put into action.
We truly are what we choose to eat, Spiritually.
One cannot share with others the goodness of Gods Love if that same love is lacking in our own heart.
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Tram_Is_the_Way
Guest
IMHO I think Catholic Answers fosters the Catholic Extremism mentality. It has created forums just for those types IMHO.
Traditional Catholicism is one such forum. The Tridentine Mass Extremists vs The Nova Ordo Extremists.
The War on Terror forum. The Anti-Islamic Extremists vs Human-Dignity Extremists.
Politics: 2008(archived) Politics: 2009: The pro-life extremists. There was never a politics forum until it was becoming evident that a Democrat would be the next sitting President. The vast majority of the threads are about abortion or they turn into an abortion thread.
Traditional Catholicism is one such forum. The Tridentine Mass Extremists vs The Nova Ordo Extremists.
The War on Terror forum. The Anti-Islamic Extremists vs Human-Dignity Extremists.
Politics: 2008(archived) Politics: 2009: The pro-life extremists. There was never a politics forum until it was becoming evident that a Democrat would be the next sitting President. The vast majority of the threads are about abortion or they turn into an abortion thread.
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Prayer_Warrior
Guest
This is very much an “opinion” sort of thread. What one may call extremism, another may say they are just following the faith. For myself, I am 100% faithful to the Church. I believe in all of the teachings, even the unpopular ones because I believe in the authority of the Church. Does that make me an extremist? If so, I accept the title.
However, in my view, extremists are the ones who lose sight of the bottom line. They refuse to remove the plank in their own eye. The bottom line is that we are to LOVE God and our neighbors and BLESS our enemies. That doesn’t mean we have to lay down and agree with everything our “enemies” have to say. But when we respond, we are to respond in love. In my humble opinion, extremists have lost the focus on the love and, like Pharisees, focus on rules.
With that in mind, I think there are many Catholic extremists, just as there are extremists in any group. With over a billion Catholics, there are surely extremists. Personally, I think it would be wise for all Catholics to try to imitate the saints. Can you imagine St. Padre Pio bombing an abortion clinic or the Blessed Virgin screaming at a gay couple that they are going to hell? I can’t. I can only imagine them speaking the truth in love, praying about it, and loving all sinners (Catholic and non-Catholic) into the Kingdom.
However, in my view, extremists are the ones who lose sight of the bottom line. They refuse to remove the plank in their own eye. The bottom line is that we are to LOVE God and our neighbors and BLESS our enemies. That doesn’t mean we have to lay down and agree with everything our “enemies” have to say. But when we respond, we are to respond in love. In my humble opinion, extremists have lost the focus on the love and, like Pharisees, focus on rules.
With that in mind, I think there are many Catholic extremists, just as there are extremists in any group. With over a billion Catholics, there are surely extremists. Personally, I think it would be wise for all Catholics to try to imitate the saints. Can you imagine St. Padre Pio bombing an abortion clinic or the Blessed Virgin screaming at a gay couple that they are going to hell? I can’t. I can only imagine them speaking the truth in love, praying about it, and loving all sinners (Catholic and non-Catholic) into the Kingdom.
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Irish_Catholic_1
Guest
I think today, when people think of “extremists”, they think of groups who’s extremism does harm to others, such as Muslim extremists who commit terrorist acts.
In that sense, there is no Catholic extremism.
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lizaanne
Guest
Thanks! I’m glad you enjoyed it!
If Jesus was extreme (and he was) then I have no problem with following in His footsteps. 
~Liza
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alacoque
Guest
Good question/observation…thanks for this post…
I think the groups you refer to COULD be considered extremists, depending on ‘how’ extreme they are and their behavior, in general. I don’t think it’s possible to paint with a broad brush, but my own opinion is that there certainly are some around. I know some of these groups/people; even count some of them among my friends (although I am not part of their ‘groups’ or beliefs), and not all of them claim that because of what they believe or do, they are ‘better Catholics’ than others. But, some do, as you point out. That, I think, is very unfortunate, and is, like many other ‘extremes’, a part of human nature.
So, yes, I think some of these groups are extreme; some are not and are harmless. And, in my experience, very very few (if any) of these “Catholic” extremists are ever dangerous to others…so can’t be compared with other types of extremists whose tactics include illegal acts and persecution of other people in furtherance of their agenda.
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