Catholic prayer

[mark_a]

I think I noticed that Catholic prayer focuses more on God than self, and I’m pretty happy about it.

Is this why I can’t grasp the purpose of speaking in tongues (I’m speaking of now, not early Christianity)?

Or am I assuming that all this uninterpereted prayer is like announcing “Look at ME ! I have the proof!! The Holy Spirit is speaking through ME !! This proves I have faith!!”

Although my thoughts come off mean spirited, I’m not sure how else to get my question across.

I would love to have as much faith and charity as some of the Charismatics’ posts I have read.

 

[PKK]

Don’t for one moment think that you do not have as much faith or charity as someone who claims to speak in tongues. I will make no judgements, but only comment on what I think. Speaking in tongues was done in early Christianity, and maybe (?) in today’s world for one purpose only. That was to proclaim Christ crucified to those who would not other wise beable to know him. Even the apostles didn’t know that they were talking in tongues, they were just talking, and different cultures understood them. I would only really believe that someone today is talking in tongues, if it could be verified that someone could understand what they were saying, or that they themselves knew what they were saying. Too many claim to speak in tongues yet no one knows what they were saying, not even themselves. It would be a waste of one of the gifts of the spirit, and I don’t believe that God wastes his gifts.

 

[mark_a]

PKK:

.Even the apostles didn’t know that they were talking in tongues, they were just talking, and different cultures understood them.

Is “hearing” in tongues what is really meant by the phrase “speaking”?

PKK:

I would only really believe that someone today is talking in tongues, if it could be verified that someone could understand what they were saying, or that they themselves knew what they were saying. Too many claim to speak in tongues yet no one knows what they were saying, not even themselves. It would be a waste of one of the gifts of the spirit, and I don’t believe that God wastes his gifts.

Dig city. Are you familiar with this phenomenon?

 

[RichT]

Many protestant churches teach two basic things about speaking in tongues. One is that some are gifted in tongues, meaning they can speak in tongues. Some are gifted in translation. meaning they can translate the message that was given by the person speaking in tongues. This was quite common in the protestant church I was baptized in. Someone would deliver a message through the gift of tongues, and then someone would translate the message through the gift of translation. I never really came to a point where I could say one way or another if what was happening was real. I fugured it wasn’t my place to judge or discern. Quite often the translated messages were beautiful and eloquent and really had something important to hear. So, I left it at that.

The second thing that is taught is that tongues are also to be used as a heavenly language between you and God. In other words, during private prayer time tongues were simply looked at as a heavenly language that God would have no trouble understanding. Someone who is “in the spirit” may begin to babble during prayer, but God will always hear what is in their hearts.

 

[mark_a]

Thanks for your thoughtful response

RichT:

Someone who is “in the spirit” may begin to babble during prayer, but God will always hear what is in their hearts.

Is this to say that the above person may sound like they are babbling to an observer, but have their actual native language in their head or heart?

I guess the impression I’ve gathered while reading in these forums is that “speaking” always happens in groups specifically gathered for that purpose.

Did I presume? If so, I’ll see “speaking” in a slightly different light.

 

[RichT]

mark a:

Thanks for your thoughtful response

Is this to say that the above person may sound like they are babbling to an observer, but have their actual native language in their head or heart?

I guess the impression I’ve gathered while reading in these forums is that “speaking” always happens in groups specifically gathered for that purpose.

Did I presume? If so, I’ll see “speaking” in a slightly different light.

In answer to your first question, I wouldn’t use the term native language. Tongues are usually a language that is not considered native, meaning it isn’t an actual language that is spoken by a certain race or nationality of people. It is a heavenly language that the person speaking can’t even understand. Imagine a person so into their prayer that they just begin to babble in an uncomprehensible language. The person is in such an emotional state that they more than likely have no idea what is coming out. No one can understand it, except for God who knows all.

In regards to speaking happening in groups, yes it does, but I don’t think people gather just for the purpose of speaking in tongues. In charasmatic prayer groups, it is not unusual for someone to speak in tongues, not unlike my first example of someone speaking in tongues during a worship service.

I hope that helps. Please keep in mind I am only sharing my experience of this spiritual gift from my former protestant dealings with it. I do belong to a charasmatic catholic parish, but have yet to attend a charasmatic prayer group, so I am not sure what one would expect. I have never heard anyone speak in tongues during mass, nor do I ever think I will. At least not in my parish.

 

[Annunciata]

RichT:

The second thing that is taught is that tongues are also to be used as a heavenly language between you and God. In other words, during private prayer time tongues were simply looked at as a heavenly language that God would have no trouble understanding. Someone who is “in the spirit” may begin to babble during prayer, but God will always hear what is in their hearts.

Thanks Rich,
I pray in tongues usually quietly so as not to disturb anyone who might not understand … However, when in a Charismatic Prayer meeting I have prayed out loud in Praise to God…It’s been many, many years though. I don’t understand what it is that I’m praying…it sounds something like the Aramaic used in The Passion of The Christ. Annunciata

 

[mark_a]

RichT:

In answer to your first question, I wouldn’t use the term native language. Tongues are usually a language that is not considered native, meaning it isn’t an actual language that is spoken by a certain race or nationality of people. It is a heavenly language that the person speaking can’t even understand.

Wow. Now I’m really out of it.

Let me explain what I thought it was:

I’m speaking English to a Frenchman and a Spaniard. We each know only our own language. The Frenchman and Spaniard both understand my English in his own language. It’s a quick way to get the Gospel out there.

Was (is) “speaking” not a way around language barriers between men on God’s behalf? I never realized it was meant for God.

I presumed the term “tongue” was interchangeable with the word “language”.

So what else am I wrong about?

 

[RichT]

mark a:

Wow. Now I’m really out of it.

Let me explain what I thought it was:

I’m speaking English to a Frenchman and a Spaniard. We each know only our own language. The Frenchman and Spaniard both understand my English in his own language. It’s a quick way to get the Gospel out there.

Was (is) “speaking” not a way around language barriers between men on God’s behalf? I never realized it was meant for God.

I presumed the term “tongue” was interchangeable with the word “language”.

So what else am I wrong about?

I wouldn’t say you are wrong. I have heard that some have been able to speak spanish for example when they had no previous training in the language. For me, the only tongues I have heard is not of a language we know of. I personally have only heard people speak in tongues in an uncomprehensable language that is not of any dialect or language known to man. Have you ever heard anyone speak in tongues? Also, I didn’t say that tongues was just for God. Remember my example of those who have the gift of translation. Someone gives a message that is meant for the community through the gift of tongues, and then someone translates it.

 

[chemcatholic]

Read Acts 2:1-13. There you’ll see that at Pentecost when the apostles spoke in tongues in front of a crowd of Jews from many different regions, and each one could heard the apostles speaking in his own language.

Years ago I heard a few stories about how modern Christians received the gift of tongues when in the presence of foreigners, and the foreigners heard the tongues in their own language. I have no idea how true these stories were though.

Peace

 

[PKK]

mark a:

Is “hearing” in tongues what is really meant by the phrase “speaking”?

Dig city. Are you familiar with this phenomenon?

No I am not familiar with the phenomenon. And your following responses, say basically the same thing I was trying to say. Someone speaks, and someone understands, usually in respect to spreading the Gospel, in public speaking. As the others have posted that in private pray, it is different. There are many times when words are just not enough, but is this speaking in tongues?