Catholics who don't follow Church teachings, in European Catholic Countries

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I immediately say that I am a Catholic and I respect Protestants.

Where I live there are few formally Protestants and I respect them too.

Respect is not indifferentism, of course. I would never give up my being a Catholic.

Unfortunately, here we have an impressive number of Catholics who play badly at being Protestants.

They interpret the Bible in their own way, individually. If you tell them: “Why should I prefer your interpretation to that of the Church?” they answer “What kind of retard are you?”.

They make strange speeches about the fact that there is evil in the world perhaps because God is evil or indifferent, and this seems to me a blasphemy not only for Catholics but also for Protestants.

I therefore deduce that when I say “They are Catholics playing Protestants” I must apologize to my Protestant friends, because they would never say such blasphemies.

Despite this, they claim to be true Catholics.

From your experience which I think is partly the same and partly different, do you have any advice for us?
 
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brown_bear said:
They interpret the Bible in their own way, individually.
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I don’t think this is an exclusively Protestant characteristic. Most European forms of Protestantism have been quite hierarchical, magisterial and confessional and so will have a variety of canonical norms that structure their theology.

I think the problem being encountered by all expressions of Christianity in Europe (whether Catholic, Protestant or Orthodox) is an ‘interiorisation’ of religious belief: that it’s something private, a ‘matter of taste’ and so the only canonical norm is you yourself, rather than the Creeds, the Fathers and the Magisterium.

I think this trend is being accelerated by the general contours of Western society: an emphasis on the individual and the prioritisation of individual perceptions, beliefs and emotions (regardless of how peculiar and contrary they might be).
 
I really dont think it is nice or charitable to call Protestants ‘false Catholics’

Or to call Catholics ‘false’

Does CAF allow this?
 
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Protestants are not fake Catholics, because they don’t pretend to be Catholics.

Catholics can be false Catholics if in fact they profess ideas that are not Catholic, in serious matters, especially if at the same time they say they are true Catholics.

For example: whoever says that God is indifferent to evil or that God himself is evil, and at the same time claims to be Catholic, is a false Catholic.
 
brown_bear said:
They interpret the Bible in their own way, individually. If you tell them: “Why should I prefer your interpretation to that of the Church?” they answer “What kind of retard are you?”.
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I have never heard that kind of reaction from a Catholic! On the other hand, I have never heard it from a Protestant, either. In my limited experience of interacting with Protestants on controversial Biblical questions, a Baptist will stick to the standard Baptist interpretation, an SDA will stick to the standard SDA interpretation, and so on. They wouldn’t call someone a “retard” (or any other offensive name) just for agreeing with the teachings of their own church, whichever church that happens to be.
 
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It is not easy to explain these delicate and difficult things in another language, but what I really meant was: these Catholics “play” at being Protestants, but they are neither Catholics nor Protestants, only poor heretics who even accuse God of badness. But the problem is that they say they are true Catholics.
 
There are screwed-up Catholics in all countries. Usually they are poorly catechized, and either mixed up and hurt about something, or else looking for a loophole that will allow them to do something against Church teaching, such as skip Mass or leave their spouse.

After you have pointed out they are incorrect, I would suggest just praying for them. No point in getting frustrated as the people are unlikely to change any time soon. I feel for the poor priests who often have to deal with these folks.
 
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@brown_bear

A combination of pleasure-based secular society and anti-clericalism from the 20th century in these countries means a large number of extremely confused people. It’s sad to watch but do your best not to take it personally. Something St Alphonsus Liguori recommended to do is to think to yourself “If I was in this person’s position, I would be even worse off than they are”.
 
brown_bear said:
They make strange speeches about the fact that there is evil in the world perhaps because God is evil or indifferent, and this seems to me a blasphemy not only for Catholics but also for Protestants.
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I suppose you could try and explain that evil is necessary for humans to have free will and that God allows evil and that evil is the absence of good, so it is not from God. And if they insist on their views, then just leave them alone. they stand self-condemned.
 
The Catholic church does not have rankings like

True Catholic
False Catholic
Play Catholic

There are Catholics and non-Catholics. One is Catholic by virtue of their baptism.

If a validly baptized Catholic does something contrary to Church teaching, from cheating on their taxes to hating others to inaccurate interpretation of Scripture, they are still Catholic. Even grave sin does not make one unCatholic, should a Catholic reject God and go to hell, they will be Catholic in hell.

Questioning God is not a blasphemy, wrestling with the problem of evil is not a sin.

About interpretation, there are very few passages of Scripture that have been OFFICIALLY interpreted.

I strive every day to love others and to avoid judging the state of their soul. Maybe help your friends find some answers to their questions. For the problem of evil or where is God when terrible things occur, I’d start with essays from Strangenotions.com
 
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brown_bear said:
Catholics can be false Catholics if in fact they profess ideas that are not Catholic, in serious matters, especially if at the same time they say they are true Catholics
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There are no false catholics, If we are baptised into the catholic church we are catholic, regardless of where or how we live our faith, or dont.
brown_bear said:
For example: whoever says that God is indifferent to evil or that God himself is evil, and at the same time claims to be Catholic, is a false Catholic.
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That is someone who , although Catholic, is grappling with all the evil in the world and why God allows it. Rather then calling them false catholic, why not be kind and help them with some answers.
 
Quote: «Rather then calling them false catholic, why not be kind and help them with some answers»

What do you know about what I think, say and do with my friends?

Could it not be that I am very nice to them, and that I just wanted to open my heart to all of you, trusting to find friendly hearts, and not some people who insist on details?

In fact, I thank those who welcomed me in a friendly, fraternal way, and they are the overwhelming majority in this and many other topics.
 
I think what you are talking about is what some of us would call a cafeteria Catholic or CINO (Catholic In Name Only). These are people who say, Well, I’m a Catholic but I believe (some idea that is against Church teaching).

I would say in using those terms, CINO is a stronger term than cafeteria Catholic.

And there are lapsed or non-practicing Catholics, people who have drifted, walked, or run away from the Church and are not currently considering returning.
umamibella said:
Even entertaining the idea a Catholic is a false Catholic is unkind.
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Assuming unkindness on the part of the OP is unkind also, especially since it is clear that he is searching for a way to describe the phenomenon and wondering what to think or do about it.

This is especially true considering that altho his English is very good, it is clear that it is not his first language.

Let’s be a little more welcoming to the strangers among us, shall we?
 
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Annie said:
Assuming unkindness on the part of the OP is unkind also, especially since it is clear that he is searching for a way to describe the phenomenon and wondering what to think or do about it.
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Yes, I don’t think @brown_bear was purposefully intending unkindness or rudeness. I think it’s just a challenge of translating non-English (in his or her case, Italian) perspectives into English. If Italian is anything like Greek, prefixing ψευδο- pseudo- (i.e. ‘false’) to a word is not nearly as pejorative as in English.
 
I was thinking about it these days!

A dictionary teaches you how to say a noun or adjective in two different languages, but it usually doesn’t specify the nuances.

I once said to a Latin American friend, “Yo soy loco” (I am crazy) and he said, "No! Why do you say that? It is not true, you are a good man! ». So I understood that “Sono pazzo” while in Italian it is harmless and joking, evidently in some Latin countries it is not. Nothing wrong with that: you learn a little at a time 🙂
 
Yes, you’re right. I’ve probably read too many of those threads where people are against modifying Catholic at all 😳
 
Annie said:
Let’s be a little more welcoming to the strangers among us, shall we?
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We also need to point out when language is unkind and puts people on the outer. It would be seen as an insulting tag to many. If I am Catholic and not living a devout life, I am not a false catholic, I am still Catholic, just steeped in the secular world.
It wont help someone if you say hey you are a false Catholic. I am surprised CAF allows it.
I have learnt from this site that we are Catholic from the day we are baptised Catholic, for ever. We can never be Un Catholic, regardless of how we live. It changes our soul, puts that mark on it.
 
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