CC not the source of absolute truth?

  • Thread starter Thread starter webdezyn
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
W

webdezyn

Guest
i heard someone say that the Catholic Church is not the only source of absolute christian truth ( Protestant Churches are also sources ) because God is constatnly revealing new truths and the Catholic church changed many truths in vatican 2.

how do i respond to that ?
 
You respond by arming yourself with the facts! God does present Himself to us…daily. He does not change - we are the ones that change. Check out information about Vatican II on Catholic Answers, Vatican II did not CHANGE God’s Word. John Martignoni spoke ot this on Open Line today on EWTN radio. You may wish to listen to his program, too. God Bless -
 
40.png
webdezyn:
i heard someone say that the Catholic Church is not the only source of absolute christian truth ( Protestant Churches are also sources ) because God is constatnly revealing new truths and the Catholic church changed many truths in vatican 2.

how do i respond to that ?
Click to expand...
The truth is the truth, and it can’t be changed…

The Catholic Church believes that public revelation ended with the death of the last Apostle. In essence, the deposit of faith was complete, and nothing can be added or subtracted. The deposit is presented to us in the form of doctrines. Consequently no doctrine has ever been added or subtracted from the deposit of faith in the 2000 year history of the Church.

Now there has been what is called “development of doctrine”. Basically, this refers to the fact that as man reflects and studies the truth from generation to generation, new insights into the truth can be gleaned, as well as new applications of the truth to changes in society. This in no way indicates that truth is being changed…it is simply being understood more fully. An example of this is Church teachings on human cloning or fetal stem cell research. These are isssues that are unique to society today, and thus wouldn’t have explicitly been thought about in centuries past. Yet by reflecting on the truth, we can see how it applies to new situations.

All the above refers to official Church doctrine. Vactican II, changed no truths as defined above. What the council did do, is change some practices, or ways or doing things. Customs and practices are diffferent from doctrine, and can be changed as the need arises. To take one controversial topic, priestly celibacy is a discipline, not a doctrine. At some point, the Church could change this practice and allow married priests. This in no way affects Church doctrine, it just changes the way of doing things. Another good example is saying the mass in vernacular as opposed to latin…it’s just a way of doing things.

To sum up, disciplines/practices/customs can be changed, and do not affect the deposit of faith. Doctrines, as part of the deposit of faith, cannot be added, subtracted, or changed.
 
because God is constatnly revealing new truths
Click to expand...
  1. These Protestants are contradicting one of the essential parts of their own doctrine of Sola Scriptura, which says that the Bible alone is the only good source of revelation, and that it is ‘complete.’
  2. All truths are already known (all the essential Catholic doctrines at least). These truths are only affirmed when they become a dogma…for example Purgatory is a dogma, but the word Purgatory was never used before it became one. If youll look in the first chapter of the didache, youll find a subtle passage which mirrors scripture and shows that purgatory was indeed an early teaching.
and the Catholic church changed many truths in vatican 2.
Click to expand...
Wrong. We didnt alter any dogmas. Anything that isnt dogmatic is up for speculation. Just because we altered the liturgy and the general attitude towards non-catholics (ecumenism is emphasized) doesnt mean Church teaching is altered.
 
40.png
webdezyn:
i heard someone say that the Catholic Church is not the only source of absolute christian truth ( Protestant Churches are also sources ) because God is constatnly revealing new truths and the Catholic church changed many truths in vatican 2.

how do i respond to that ?
Click to expand...
Maybe you should try to find out what new “truths” did God reveal. The person who said it should first list them down so we can make an assessment if indeed they are new truths.

Secondly, you should ask him to list down the “truths” which the Church allegedly "changed. The burden of proof is on him.

However let me emphasize that public revelation **ceased ** with the death of the last apostle and this is the Catholic view. As the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith declared in *Dominus Iesus, paragraph. no. 5 *:

**Faithful to God’s word, the Second Vatican Council teaches: “By this revelation then, the deepest truth about God and the salvation of man shines forth in Christ, who is at the same time the mediator and the fullness of all revelation”.9 Furthermore, “Jesus Christ, therefore, the Word made flesh, sent ‘as a man to men’, ‘speaks the words of God’ (Jn 3:34), and completes the work of salvation which his Father gave him to do (cf. Jn 5:36; 17:4). To see Jesus is to see his Father (cf. Jn 14:9). For this reason, Jesus perfected revelation by fulfilling it through his whole work of making himself present and manifesting himself: through his words and deeds, his signs and wonders, but especially through his death and glorious resurrection from the dead and finally with the sending of the Spirit of truth, he completed and perfected revelation and confirmed it with divine testimony… The Christian dispensation, therefore, as the new and definitive covenant, will never pass away, and we now await no further new public revelation before the glorious manifestation of our Lord Jesus Christ (cf. 1 Tim 6:14 and Tit 2:13)”.10 **

So, any one who claims that they have “new” teachings coming from God should not be believed since scripture itself says that even if an angel from heaven comes down and teaches something not taught by Christ should not be believed!

Gerry 🙂
 
40.png
webdezyn:
i heard someone say that the Catholic Church is not the only source of absolute christian truth ( Protestant Churches are also sources ) because God is constatnly revealing new truths and the Catholic church changed many truths in vatican 2.

how do i respond to that ?
Click to expand...
How about, “How can I be sure that your opinion is true?”, or in a more simple statement, “Prove it.”
 
40.png
RobedWithLight:
So, any one who claims that they have “new” teachings coming from God should not be believed since scripture itself says that even if an angel from heaven comes down and teaches something not taught by Christ should not be believed!

Gerry 🙂
Click to expand...
which specific book and verse is that stated ( about the angel ) ?
 
40.png
webdezyn:
i heard someone say that the Catholic Church is not the only source of absolute christian truth ( Protestant Churches are also sources ) because God is constatnly revealing new truths and the Catholic church changed many truths in vatican 2.

how do i respond to that ?
Click to expand...
Sounds like a moral relativist. Their feelings are their only authority.
 
The Fullness of Christian Truth can be found NOWHERE on the face of this Earth EXCEPT, The Catholic Church. This is what Christ intended, and what Mankind upended.
 
40.png
RobedWithLight:
So, any one who claims that they have “new” teachings coming from God should not be believed since scripture itself says that even if an angel from heaven comes down and teaches something not taught by Christ should not be believed!

Gerry 🙂
Click to expand...
This verse is often used and followed with “…so would you rather accept the Gospel of the Catholic Church or the Gospel of Jesus Christ?”

Actually, one of the “levels” of theology with your quote is a defense for the gift of infallibility.

MrS
 
webdezyn said:
which specific book and verse is that stated ( about the angel ) ?
Click to expand...

Here it is:

Galatians 1:8-9, Paul wrote:

8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.

9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.
Gerry
 
40.png
MrS:
This verse is often used and followed with “…so would you rather accept the Gospel of the Catholic Church or the Gospel of Jesus Christ?”

Actually, one of the “levels” of theology with your quote is a defense for the gift of infallibility.

MrS
Click to expand...
You do have a point with regards the fact that the passage says “we, … or an angel…”. I posted the quote in my reply to webdezyn. Perhaps I should have quoted it verbatim much earlier.

However, it does not invalidate its relevance and applicability to so-called “new” revelation, since the Church, in Dominus Iesus affirms that we now await no further new revelation.

Gerry
 
The Gospels are complete, nothing can be added or taken away from them. No revelation can supercede or impeach on the ONLY and last revelation which is that of Christ Jesus Himself. The ‘WORD’ made flesh, the fullness of truth that instituted His church to live in His truth. The full body of truth of Christ Jesus’ revelation is embodied in His bride the Catholic Church, upheld and guided infallibly by our pontiff. THE WORD is complete and the interpretation is COMPLETE. All that is new is the application of them in OUR changing times, each age is different in the life it faces and each has it’s benefits and it’s faults, so the application of the WORD to each time requires guidance and this is what our beloved pontiff, Pope John Paul II does for us also. Also each age has brought forth saints of exceptional holiness to support the application of the WORD IN THAT TIME. Thing is God is timeless, outside , within and beyond ALL time and we have the challenge of living in His word in our own time. Thank goodness for papal guidance, we are truly sheep who are fed. God Bless you xxx
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top