Child I Babysit is Hitting Others

[Xantippe]

I am not an expert, but I don’t think it’s likely he has an autism spectrum disorder. He really likes to involve me in what he is doing, and doesn’t like playing alone (which unfortunately is a cause for some of the tension because sometimes the other kids want to do what they are doing by themselves, or there is disagreement when they play on what they will do. He doesn’t react well to that.)

**Actually, a lot of autism spectrum kids have exactly those behaviors.

In fact, it is typical for higher functioning autistic children to be good at one-on-one interactions (but maybe too rigid in their expectations of their interlocutor), but to flounder in the more complex and fluid dynamics of a group. **

He was very snuggly this late afternoon (on really bad days, which today was, I notice he is a lot “sweeter” toward the end of the day - asking for hugs, wanting to sit on my lap while we do a puzzle or watch a movie, etc.) But I made sure I told dad that the hitting couldn’t continue, and that I was giving him two weeks to make significant improvement, and if that didn’t happen then I could no longer provide care. Dad actually seemed like he was expecting it when I told him, and told me he absolutely understood.

Good?

Sooooo…we’ll see if there’s some progress. I looked over the link EasterJoy provided about biting, and a lot of that is what I am already doing - just not seeing a lot of progress. I don’t know what the parents will be able to accomplish in this time frame to affect his behavior here. But I’m giving them a shot at it.

Good luck!

 

[ClearWater]

I know it’s not the most unheard of thing in the world for kids to hit each other when they are frustrated, especially when they are young. But I need help figuring out if what I’m seeing here is unusual, and how to go about fixing it (or if I should quit babysitting for this child.)

About 6-8 weeks ago, the 3.5 year old I babysit about 35 hours a week began hitting or otherwise physically lashing out. At least once a day, he slaps, punches, kicks, shoves, or pinches either his older brother, who I watch after school, or one of kids (one is the same age he is, my younger is 20 months old). At first it was usually in response to some kind of direct provoking - a toy was grabbed away, his block tower got knocked down - but now it seems that the littlest thing will set him off. The usual consequence is a time-out, then a required apology. My sense is that at home there is very little discipline of any kind.

Here are a few things that concern me, besides the behavior itself:

1. He now only does it if he thinks I can’t see him.
2. When I tell him to go to the time-out spot, he denies wrongdoing (this could actually be a sign of developmental progress, but no idea how to address it.)
3. He rolls his eyes at me, turns his back, and yells things at me like, “you’re not the boss!” These are not behaviors I’m keen on my kids seeing and repeating.
4. If he was going through a growth spurt or some other “grumpy” stage, I’d have expected it to end by now. If anything, the behavior is escalating.

One possibility I’ve considered is just how much less physical activity goes on here. Any day that is above 25 degrees (F) and not sopping wet I take the kids outside. I also play physical activity games with them, they have a large well childproofed area to run in inside, and I’ve taken them a few times to an indoor playground. The other kids seem to be coping well with that, but it doesn’t seem to be helping with this hitting issue. (Also, and this may be affecting my outlook unfairly because it only happened once on my watch, but this child bit my same-aged son over the summer. No blood drawn, but visible teethmarks.)

I’ve also been teaching about sharing and turn-taking, and I use a timer for turns with specific items that seem to be the toy “du jour.”

Other things I can try? Is this developmentally normal? My son who is the same age hardly ever hits, though he did a bit more when he was younger. I have had other concerns about this child’s development, but don’t know if this could be related to any of those.

Right now the money is really important, but I’m frustrated enough that I’m thinking about giving the parents my notice. Even if it developmentally normal, it’s not fun watching someone else’s kid hit yours and feeling like what you can do to address it isn’t enough.

I would probably stop babysitting him were it me.

I’m in a similar scenario, up a notch, where I volunteer. He’s 5, kicks, bites, scratches, has tantrums. The coordinator says all blind kids are like this, but we disagree. Due to this one child, I want to leave that placement. He also throws stuff, pushes me, plays around with the plugs and such on my wheelchair.

Although, on the flip side, I guess that’s how Anne Sullivan and Hellen Keller began.

It’s your call. For myself, I’m not being paid. Though you are, it still my not be worth it. Weigh your options.

I remember my mother once saying that kids don´t have to be that way, that they can even be a joy to be around. Nowadays, though, due to the lack of discipline, a lot of people don´t want to…be parents…babysit, or teach school.

My parents said this all comes from the home, and most of the time, that’s true, barring some kind of mental problem.

Insofar as developmental delays, I know in the US, Goodwill had programs that would help kids with delays and such, to determine if there was a delay, how much of a delay, and to work on it.

In the city I lived, Goodwill would go out there, free of charge, and check things out if the child was under age 3 or so. Much after 3 y.o., the family had to get the child to the center, somehow.

So, that’s one option, and it could be done, soon, while he is still small. That way, they can go out to the house, tend to him, there.

Often, if there is indeed some kind of developmental delay, it’s ideal it be addressed early on. I once worked with a family, and the kids were seriously developmentally delayed due to extreme overprotection on the part of the mother. The result was the same, though, in that the child was acting much younger. The 7 year old was still using a baby bottle, to give you an idea.

So, I’d recommend Goodwill as one option, because the work with physical disabilities, mental…and from little all the way up to helping people get jobs!

I probably wouldn´t have the patience. However, there are counselors who could also work with him if the family has health insurance. I’m not sure how happy they would be to hear that, but if it’s like you say, they will probably be hearing it from someone, sooner or later.

I’m not sure what to advise. If it’s too much, it’s too much, though. Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[ClearWater]

Oh…and Goodwill works with autism, Down’s, etc.

I went to one of their special schools, and it was actually VERY nice! It had better attention to their individual issues. I was really impressed.

 

[pensmama87]

You said this behavior began 6-8 weeks ago. How long had you been caring for this child before this behavior began?

Has anything changed in the child’s home life? Tension between his parents? New baby?

Is your relationship with the parents close enough to ask if anything has changed at home?

Maybe the child is having an adjustment issue to something.

Since last spring - I’ve been caring for them for almost a year. There have been a few changes during that time - such as brother starting school - but that was in August. I could probably ask, though.

I spoke with mom tonight and she is doing a behavior chart with him at home and suggested I might try something like that here, to see if stickers would motivate him where other things haven’t. She claims he doesn’t hit at home. I can believe that, probably in large part because there’s two fewer kids to have to share anything with. I don’t know if these were issues that ever came up when they were in daycare.

Actually, a lot of autism spectrum kids have exactly those behaviors.

In fact, it is typical for higher functioning autistic children to be good at one-on-one interactions (but maybe too rigid in their expectations of their interlocutor), but to flounder in the more complex and fluid dynamics of a group.

Wow, I never knew that. I worked with a few kids on the spectrum when I was a teacher, but they were teens and had been receiving services for years by that point, so I don’t know at all how they started out. My understanding was different, that generally kids on the spectrum very much preferred being alone and were not interested in group play.

Actually, now that you mention that - I had been trying to figure out if there was a pattern to when he would do this - there didn’t seem to be a particular time of day, related to him being hungry or sleepy, etc. But it’s always been in a group. If it’s just him and me, he’s fine. If it’s just him and one other kid, he’s usually fine (I am astonished sometimes at how calm and sweet he is after a nap if he wakes up before everyone else does). But any more than that and tempers flare fast.

 

[pianistclare]

Since last spring - I’ve been caring for them for almost a year. There have been a few changes during that time - such as brother starting school - but that was in August. I could probably ask, though.

I spoke with mom tonight and she is doing a behavior chart with him at home and suggested I might try something like that here, to see if stickers would motivate him where other things haven’t. She claims he doesn’t hit at home. I can believe that, probably in large part because there’s two fewer kids to have to share anything with. I don’t know if these were issues that ever came up when they were in daycare.

Wow, I never knew that. I worked with a few kids on the spectrum when I was a teacher, but they were teens and had been receiving services for years by that point, so I don’t know at all how they started out. My understanding was different, that generally kids on the spectrum very much preferred being alone and were not interested in group play.

Actually, now that you mention that - I had been trying to figure out if there was a pattern to when he would do this - there didn’t seem to be a particular time of day, related to him being hungry or sleepy, etc. But it’s always been in a group. If it’s just him and me, he’s fine. If it’s just him and one other kid, he’s usually fine (I am astonished sometimes at how calm and sweet he is after a nap if he wakes up before everyone else does). But any more than that and tempers flare fast.

Maybe they don’t put him to bed early enough. If they are feeling like they need family time, maybe he’s staying up too late. Cranky kids act our pretty badly when sleep deprived.

 

[Xantippe]

Wow, I never knew that. I worked with a few kids on the spectrum when I was a teacher, but they were teens and had been receiving services for years by that point, so I don’t know at all how they started out. My understanding was different, that generally kids on the spectrum very much preferred being alone and were not interested in group play.

**I’ve read that that impression often delays diagnosis of higher functioning autistic children.

I think Tony Attwood (the big Aspergers guru) mentions that a lot of times a pediatrician won’t notice there is something off about a child, because the child is able to have an animated discussion on their pet topic. However, put that same child in a group of other children, and the social issues are suddenly obvious.**

Actually, now that you mention that - I had been trying to figure out if there was a pattern to when he would do this - there didn’t seem to be a particular time of day, related to him being hungry or sleepy, etc. But it’s always been in a group. If it’s just him and me, he’s fine. If it’s just him and one other kid, he’s usually fine (I am astonished sometimes at how calm and sweet he is after a nap if he wakes up before everyone else does). But any more than that and tempers flare fast.

If it is autism spectrum issues, the issue there may be sensory issues–he may get sensory overload from dealing with more than one person at a time.

 

[pensmama87]

Maybe they don’t put him to bed early enough. If they are feeling like they need family time, maybe he’s staying up too late. Cranky kids act our pretty badly when sleep deprived.

Yeah, I am sure this is the case. Mom works until 8pm some evenings and the kids stay up to see her. They don’t go to bed until 9 or later most nights. They also don’t nap at home. I notice a big difference in overall crankiness from both boys when they come after the weekend or another day at home - because they haven’t napped in addition to going to bed too late.

Their at-home diet isn’t good, either. They bring food to share which is very generous, but I give almost none of it to them - cookies, “juice” (water and corn syrup with 5% actual juice), white bread. They also refuse to eat rather frequently at my house (I do kid-friendly foods, but I don’t do junk). That’s more the older one, but the younger one likes to copy him. (The parents are aware of that situation, too.) I’m not sure how much that accounts for the hitting behavior because that’s new despite the above going on basically the whole time I’ve been babysitting for this family.

 

[pensmama87]

Thank you for sharing and I am sorry that you are going through this.

It is good that you are asking if the child’s behavior is within “normal” guidelines, however if you think about it, bottom line in the end what matters is what YOU can live with.

Even if the behavior were within the so-called limits, if the behavior is beyond what you want in your own home then you are within your rights to cease caring for this child. Do you have a written contract with the family? Are you obligated to give a notice? What are your obligations? That is important naturally, but once you have met your contractual and legal obligations it is important to recognize what you can handle emotionally and spiritually because we all have our limits.

I believe that morally you have much leeway because this is YOUR home and you have a right to decide what conditions you want to be surrounded with all day long. I once took care of a child that had rather loose bowels because of their diet. Changing their diaper nearly made me vomit every time they came over I am not exaggerating and it STUNK. Also the child as a toddler was rather whiny, cute but extremely whiny. For these reasons the babysitting arrangement was a bit exhausting for me. I am sharing that with you because I don’t want you to worry that you are selfish in any way for not wanting this child in your home. There are “good” reasons and there are other “good” reasons for wanting to stop a babysitting arrangement. As long as you are not discriminating against this child because of the color of his skin, his religious background or other immoral reason I believe you can do as you wish as long as you stick with your contract.

You are kind to want to give him another chance, and kind to want to help him change. Unfortunately the guidelines for change for a toddler like this can be subjective and a matter of opinion. What really is a decrease in behavior? How do you measure improvement? What about a relapse in behavior? You have a lot to think about, please be assured of my prayers.

Thanks for your kind words, Monicad.

For income reasons, I am willing to work with this family to see if we can make some improvement. If he was more violent, or if he does not improve over the next two weeks, then that’s the end of what I can tolerate. If he relapses after initially improving, yes, I would have to be done. Neither of my kids have been injured (besides the one bite last summer), and they are not imitating the behavior - yet. If it continues much longer I expect they would, and that’s not something I can tolerate either. So I feel like the two week probationary period is a good one. I do feel that if there is improvement I can continue with them until I have my baby, and that is a good time to stop.

The reality is, if I didn’t need the income I would not babysit at all. Even the best behaved kids in the world bring inconveniences with them - illness, adjustments in routine, being more limited in what I can do when (we don’t have any major health problems, but wowee even regular checkups can be hard to schedule now!) If I didn’t have to I wouldn’t put up with any of that.

 

[Xantippe]

Yeah, I am sure this is the case. Mom works until 8pm some evenings and the kids stay up to see her. They don’t go to bed until 9 or later most nights. They also don’t nap at home. I notice a big difference in overall crankiness from both boys when they come after the weekend or another day at home - because they haven’t napped in addition to going to bed too late.

Their at-home diet isn’t good, either. They bring food to share which is very generous, but I give almost none of it to them - cookies, “juice” (water and corn syrup with 5% actual juice), white bread. They also refuse to eat rather frequently at my house (I do kid-friendly foods, but I don’t do junk). That’s more the older one, but the younger one likes to copy him. (The parents are aware of that situation, too.) I’m not sure how much that accounts for the hitting behavior because that’s new despite the above going on basically the whole time I’ve been babysitting for this family.

Low blood sugar probably contributes to crankiness and bad behavior.

With autism spectrum children, they are often very picky about food because of sensory issues. I also had a lot of food and meal refusal from my Aspie oldest when she was younger. She also gets unusually cranky when she has low blood sugar. The combination of those two facts (the food refusal and the sensitivity to low blood sugar) contributed to a lot of spectacular bad behavior when she was little.

This kid isn’t necessarily on the autism spectrum, but certain things you’re saying about him remind me of stuff I’ve seen or read.

 

[pensmama87]

Well, we tried out our new behavioral plan starting on Monday and it went really, really well for two days. I was off yesterday and then this morning we had a hitting and a biting incident.

So that’s it. The kids are getting picked up after naptime today. I’m wondering if I should bother suggesting anything about another placement or evaluations, or if that’s just going to rub salt in the wound.

(My recommendations are that he be in a situation where he and his brother are the only kids, and that he be evaluated for speech and possible other developmental delays including autism.)

 

[Xantippe]

Well, we tried out our new behavioral plan starting on Monday and it went really, really well for two days. I was off yesterday and then this morning we had a hitting and a biting incident.

So that’s it. The kids are getting picked up after naptime today. I’m wondering if I should bother suggesting anything about another placement or evaluations, or if that’s just going to rub salt in the wound.

(My recommendations are that he be in a situation where he and his brother are the only kids, and that he be evaluated for speech and possible other developmental delays including autism.)

That sounds totally fine and not out of line.

Getting repeatedly kicked out of daycare is unfortunately one of the things that happens to special needs children. And lots of daycare providers handle it much less gracefully than you have. In one of my autism parent memoirs, the mom was told by their daycare provider that the home daycare was closing, so they’d need to find a new daycare. Well, the mom went back for some reason, only to discover that the daycare was still open! The daycare provider was just that desperate to get rid of the kid.

Enjoy your pregnancy and some (relative) peace and quiet.

 

[pianistclare]

Well, we tried out our new behavioral plan starting on Monday and it went really, really well for two days. I was off yesterday and then this morning we had a hitting and a biting incident.

So that’s it. The kids are getting picked up after naptime today. I’m wondering if I should bother suggesting anything about another placement or evaluations, or if that’s just going to rub salt in the wound.

(My recommendations are that he be in a situation where he and his brother are the only kids, and that he be evaluated for speech and possible other developmental delays including autism.)

Excellent news. Glad that they value your opinion and support you, since you are spending so much time with their children.
I wouldn’t hesitate to get very stern when and if the biting occurs.

As my children used to say:
" Mama gives them the Catholic school stare, and they STOP whatever it is they’re doing!!! "

Yeah. They do.

God bless you!!!

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Well, we tried out our new behavioral plan starting on Monday and it went really, really well for two days. I was off yesterday and then this morning we had a hitting and a biting incident.

So that’s it. The kids are getting picked up after naptime today. I’m wondering if I should bother suggesting anything about another placement or evaluations, or if that’s just going to rub salt in the wound.

(My recommendations are that he be in a situation where he and his brother are the only kids, and that he be evaluated for speech and possible other developmental delays including autism.)

I had a feeling that this is what would happen. But I am so thankful that you have the strength to make a rule and a plan and follow it. Your handling of this situation was spot on and you should rest easy with the outcome.

Good for you pensmama87, As a parent, I am proud of you!

 

[pensmama87]

Mom was actually very receptive to what I had to say as far as evaluations. She said she’d actually had similar suspicions, so I’m glad she didn’t find my suggestions insulting. I think that’s probably much better for him - he’s more likely to get whatever services he needs if his parents aren’t oblivious or refuse to accept that he might need additional help.

She also said she would do the same as far as quitting if she were in my place. I could tell she wasn’t happy about it, but I suppose that’s to be expected. The first time I quit on somebody (this was the wooden block attacking incident) the mom was really, really nasty to me. That experience was really making me dread this.

Of course, I just went over our budget and we’re going to have to tighten our already tight belts a little more…oh well, at least Lent starts soon. Some extra penance will do us good.

Hopefully I’ll get a few kids just for the summer before the baby comes, when they can do a lot of running around outside and I can (hopefully) lounge and observe and put my (probably swollen) super pregnant feet up. A girl can dream, right?