Children can't consent to puberty blockers, court told

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Good. The harm that children are coming to for the sake of a broken ideology needs to be stopped, for good.
 
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There are people with XY chromosomes that look exactly like women from birth, have female genitalia, and are raised as women. If we go by the chromosome definition we would have to call them men.
 
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How easy/hard would it be for youth in the UK to get these drugs illicitly?

A person who wants to be a different sex often has the desire so strongly that it makes them depressed and/or suicidal, and the school system & surrounding culture are fanning the flames of whatever psychological issues they might have.
 
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This just begs the question, it doesn’t once attempt to answer it. It might be comforting for people who want a rigid sexual dichotomy to exist, but it never once actually suggests how such a thing could exist. There’s just lame hand waving of intersex people suffering from a “disorder” and a suggestion that some underlying male or female gender is still present, but it never attempts to answer how.
 
TK421 said:
A person who wants to be a different sex often has the desire so strongly that it makes them depressed and/or suicidal,
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Pre-puberty seems young for lifelong decisions. Also, I’m not sure it helps with the depression/suicide issue. I get that it’s a step further, but the numbers suggest that surgically transition are associated with higher suicide risks.
How much is based on how society treats trans people vs other factors is hard to say.
 
Regular_Atheist said:
There are people with XY chromosomes that look exactly like women from birth, have female genitalia, and are raised as women. If we go by the chromosome definition we would have to call them men.
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Please stop.

It’s been established over and over that intersex does not equal transgender.

And you know this
 
Please stop.
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I won’t stop speaking the truth because it makes people uncomfortable.
It’s been established over and over that intersex does not equal transgender.
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I didn’t say that it did. I was responding, specifically, to the meme someone posted which implied that chromosomes suggest the existence of a rigid sexual binary, but they don’t. It is very easy to verify that they don’t.

The push for a belief in a rigid sexual dichotomy that can be proven biologically is dangerous, and is just going to lead to the policing of people’s bodies to an unimaginable degree. We already saw this with Caster Semenya, where the subject of her biological sex became a matter of public debate. The fact is that while natural averages exist lots of people have bodies that don’t conform to expectations for male and female bodies and there is no rigid sexual dichotomy in nature. There is no overcoming this, it is fact, and nobody has yet to provide the biological basis on which this sexual dichotomy can be said to exist.
 
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HerCrazierHalf said:
Pre-puberty seems young for lifelong decisions. Also, I’m not sure it helps with the depression/suicide issue. I get that it’s a step further, but the numbers suggest that surgically transition are associated with higher suicide risks.
How much is based on how society treats trans people vs other factors is hard to say.
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I don’t support transgender expression. I’m Catholic. I’m wondering how easy it is for a young person to do hormone treatments illicitly.

The school system & culture is inflaming a demand for it and it is something that a person can want very badly, so where there is a demand there is a market.
 
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Regular_Atheist said:
There is no overcoming this, it is fact, and nobody has yet to provide the biological basis on which this sexual dichotomy can be said to exist
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Wrong again.
A man produces sperm.
A woman produces ova.
A person who produces neither has a birth defect.
There is a strict sexual dichotomy, because only the union of sperm and egg produces new life.

But this whole “trick” of muddying the conversation about transgender and intersex states has risen to the level of dis-information.
A person might be forgiven for not knowing any better, but it’s been discussed here enough times that anybody who’s been on this forum for awhile knows the difference.

And is lying anyway.
 
A man produces sperm.
A woman produces ova.
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And yet there are countless people who will not meet these conditions and yet still be considered part of the sex associated with those conditions. There is no overcoming this.
A person who produces neither has a birth defect.
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Which is just applying norms to nature, which has no norms and acts unconsciously. When nature fails to conform to the standards you demand it adheres to, you say that nature is broken!
A person might be forgiven for not knowing any better, but it’s been discussed here enough times that anybody who’s been on this forum for awhile knows the difference.
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I am being sincere, and I really believe this. I don’t care what shady clique or agenda you think I’m part of, I’m a normal person commenting on what I have genuinely understood to be true. I have never seen anything convincing said on this forum in terms of arguing for the existence of a real sexual dichotomy. Someone makes some demonstrably indefensible claim (“Only men have XY chromosomes!”), it is pointed out to be untrue, and then the person making the initial claim is just reduced to accusations of someone having a political agenda or of being insincere or of being “unscientific.”

The way people engage with the topic of a sexual dichotomy is absurd. It has to be true and the idea that it isn’t is infuriating, yet nobody can demonstrate that it is true! Common sense and “scientific truth” just demand that we accept it, no questions asked.
 
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Regular_Atheist said:
And yet there are countless people who will not meet these conditions and yet still be considered part of the sex associated with those conditions. There is no overcoming this.
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Birth defect.
Full stop.

And yes, sometimes nature is broken. People get sick, organs fail to develop or fail after development.

But the only way to make new life is the union of sperm and egg.

Two sexes.
That’s it.

And to you know very darn well that somebody who feels “wrong” in their body in the absence of anomalies is an entirely different condition than somebody with an anomaly.

But there are people whose knowledge of nature is so poor they get sucked into these ideologies.

The least you can do is not confuse them further or confirm them in their wrong understanding.
 
I wonder how much if this is a chicken vs egg situation.
Are they depressed/suicidal and then wonder if a sex change will ease the depression? The BBC had an article (long read) recently which interviewed two girls who went through drugs and breast removal, only to find that it didn’t fix things emotionally at all.
The girls talk about how their counselors really didn’t take time to help them think through their issues but promptly began addressing them as male and guided them right into the wrong decision.
They are now off of their male hormones but can’t reverse their surgical non-solutions.

 
Birth defect.
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Which is just a lazy way to avoid natural phenomenon that doesn’t align with your dogma.
But the only way to make new life is the union of sperm and egg.
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Ignoring the implied “natural law”, I agree that this is the origin of male and female in that the need for the reproduction of the species is the basis on which natural averages are converted into the dichotomy between those who get pregnant and those who don’t. All this proves however is that sex is socially constructed, and the male-female dichotomy is imposed onto nature by the needs of social reproduction.
And to you know very darn well that somebody who feels “wrong” in their body in the absence of anomalies is an entirely different condition than somebody with an anomaly.
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What is the meaningful difference? An intersex person will have a sex imposed on them despite the fact that they do not meet the biological criteria for that sex. Immediately in this case “sex” and biology are separated. “Intersex” people aren’t merely confused, they’re literally assigned a gender and live as that gender, male without meeting your classification of male or female without meeting your classification of female. You can’t see it, but by trying to impose a strict biological definition of sex you have already denied them their identity of male or female and made them some kind of “third sex.”
The least you can do is not confuse them further or confirm them in their wrong understanding.
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From my experience with trans people I can say that they do not want your pity or to be diagnosed by you.
 
@Regular_Atheist

When something doesn’t transcribe correctly for whatever reason it generally results in a birth defect. It’s not something built-in, like how there are dominant traits and recessive traits.

The difference is that unlike issues with other organs, people can express themselves sexually through their genitalia and that means human egoism gets wrapped up in it. That’s why there are two separate running narratives in society: if something affects the liver/kidney/lung/muscles/etc. we readily identify it as a defect to be treated, which is the common sense approach, but if it is related to the sexual organs and the hormones, people will sometimes do mental acrobatics and start inventing artificial ideas like infinitely variable genders and such. Again: it’s egoism inserting itself into society.
 
Regular_Atheist said:
Ignoring the implied “natural law”, I agree that this is the origin of male and female in that the need for the reproduction of the species is the basis on which natural averages are converted into the dichotomy between those who get pregnant and those who don’t. All this proves however is that sex is socially constructed,
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I’m really starting to think you’re trolling?

The sexes are a “social construct”?
So the egg and sperm being the only way of making new babies is something humans thought up in their minds and Nature complied?

In your defense, the trans activists have been heavily propagandizing and marketing to people with emotionalistic appeals, and one of their tactics is extremely fuzzy thinking and slippery definitions, so I’ll gice you the benefit of the doubt.

But no.

Two sexes only. Sperm and egg for reproduction.

A “third sex” would imply another agent needed for making new humans.

And as for what “trans people” want, would you be so kind as to explain in your own words what trans means?
 
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