Christ died for all - proof

[PrinceCaspian]

Hey all,

Could faithful Catholic provide me with the Catechism reference to the fact the Christ died for every person?

Also does anyone know the scriptural references to this claim: the Christ died for all people?

Thanks,

 

[kell0618]

Hello!

From the Catechism:

[1260](javascriptpenWindow(‘cr/1260.htm’) "Since Christ died for all, and since all men are in fact called to one and the same destiny, which is divine, we must hold that the Holy Spirit offers to all the possibility of being made partakers, in a way known to God, of the Paschal mystery."63 Every man who is ignorant of the Gospel of Christ and of his Church, but seeks the truth and does the will of God in accordance with his understanding of it, can be saved. It may be supposed that such persons would have desired Baptism explicitly if they had known its necessity.

605 At the end of the parable of the lost sheep Jesus recalled that God’s love excludes no one: "So it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones should perish."410 He affirms that he came “to give his life as a ransom for many”; this last term is not restrictive, but contrasts the whole of humanity with the unique person of the redeemer who hands himself over to save us.411 The Church, following the apostles, teaches that Christ died for all men without exception: "There is not, never has been, and never will be a single human being for whom Christ did not suffer."412

**616 **It is love "to the end"446 that confers on Christ’s sacrifice its value as redemption and reparation, as atonement and satisfaction. He knew and loved us all when he offered his life.447 Now "the love of Christ controls us, because we are convinced that one has died for all; therefore all have died."448 No man, not even the holiest, was ever able to take on himself the sins of all men and offer himself as a sacrifice for all. The existence in Christ of the divine person of the Son, who at once surpasses and embraces all human persons, and constitutes himself as the Head of all mankind, makes possible his redemptive sacrifice for all.

**961 **The term “communion of saints” refers also to the communion of “holy persons” (sancti) in Christ who “died for all,” so that what each one does or suffers in and for Christ bears fruit for all.

From Pope Paul VI:

Indeed Christ, ‘who committed no sin,’ suffered for us, ‘was wounded for our iniquities, bruised for our sins… by His bruises we are healed.’ Thus there was established, as it were, a treasury of ‘the infinite and inexhaustible value which the expiation and the merits of Christ our Lord have before God.’

From the Bible:

Heb. 7:27, 9:12,26;10:10; 1 Pet 3:18 - Jesus died once and redeemed us all, but we participate in the application of His redemption by the way in which we live.

  			 					Heb. 9:12 - Christ's sacrifice secured our redemption, but redemption is not  					the same thing as salvation. We participate in and hope for salvation. Our hope  					in salvation is a guarantee if we are faithful to Christ to the end. But if we  					lose hope and fail to persevere, we can lose our salvation. Thus, by our own  					choosing (not by God's doing), salvation is not a certainty. While many  					Protestant churches believe in the theology of "once saved, always saved," such  					a novel theory is not found in Scripture and has never been taught by the  					Church.

  			Rom. 5:6,18 - Christ died for the ungodly (all of us), and His righteousness  					leads to acquittal and life for all men (not just the elect).

  			2 Cor. 5:14-15 - Christ has died for all (not just the elect), that those who  					live might live for Him.

  			1 Tim. 2:6 - Jesus Christ gave Himself as a ransom for all (not just for the  					elect). But only those predestined to glory will be saved.

  			1 Tim. 4:10 - our hope is on the living God who is the Savior of all men (not  					just the elect).

Hope this helps!

 

[PrinceCaspian]

Thanks!!! You rock!

My brother, who is not Catholic, had put some doubt in my mind that Christ actually did die for all. I never went away from the Catholic teaching, but I didn’t have anyway to defend it.

Thanks again.

 

[kell0618]

More Scripture:

  			Titus 2:11 - for the grace of God has appeared for the **salvation of all men**  					(not just the elect).

  			1 John 2:2 - **Christ is the expiation for the sins of the whole world** (not just  					the elect). But not all are predestined to glory because of their own choosing.

  			1 John 4:14 - again, Jesus Christ is the **Savior of the world** (not just the  					Savior of the elect).

Heb. 7:27, 9:12,26;10:10; 1 Pet 3:18 - Jesus died once and redeemed us all, but we participate in the application of His redemption by the way in which we live.

 

[kell0618]

Let your brother know that Christ did indeed die for him as well.

God bless you,

Kelly

 

[PrinceCaspian]

Well he’s “saved” so he knows Christ died for him… just maybe not me…

 

[kell0618]

Well he’s “saved” so he knows Christ died for him… just maybe not me…

Well, if he’s of the ‘once saved always saved’ mentality, perhaps this site would be of assistance to you.

Scripture Catholic

Kelly

 

[PrinceCaspian]

Thanks.

I’ve just started to get into Scriptural Apologetics recently so that will help.

I stumbled onto this website: www.BibleChristianSociety.com It’s really excellent. :bible1:

 

[James_Carson]

Thanks.

I’ve just started to get into Scriptural Apologetics recently so that will help.

I stumbled onto this website: www.BibleChristianSociety.com It’s really excellent. :bible1:

Books by Dave Armstrong or Patrick Madrid would be exellent reads for scriptural apolegetics.

 

[La-Petite-Fleur]

So does this mean everybody in the whole world needs Jesus?

Hello!

1260 "Since Christ died for all, and since all men are in fact called to one and the same destiny, which is divine, we must hold that the Holy Spirit offers to all the possibility of being made partakers, in a way known to God, of the Paschal mystery."63 Every man who is ignorant of the Gospel of Christ and of his Church, but seeks the truth and does the will of God in accordance with his understanding of it, can be saved. It may be supposed that such persons would have desired Baptism explicitly if they had known its necessity.

605 ** "There is not, never has been, and never will be a single human being for whom Christ did not suffer**."412

 

[Pug]

So does this mean everybody in the whole world needs Jesus?

Even Mary had a redeemer. Even children have a redeemer. Remember his words, “Let the little children come to me”? Is this what you have in mind by your question?

 

[La-Petite-Fleur]

Even Mary had a redeemer. Even children have a redeemer. Remember his words, “Let the little children come to me”? Is this what you have in mind by your question?

Children, adults, Christians, non-Christians… every person alive in this world… Does everyone need Jesus?

 

[Pug]

Children, adults, Christians, non-Christians… every person alive in this world… Does everyone need Jesus?

To get into heaven, yes. God could have set it up differently, but he didn’t. We don’t need Jesus (that is, we don’t need for God to have become incarnate and die and rise) to do many things that we do. We can breathe and eat and such without the incarnation having happened. We aren’t getting to heaven without it, though.

Each man/woman in heaven will be incorporated into Christ. The angels were in heaven without the need of the incarnation, though, so they are not in the same situation as us, that is part of why I asked you, to see if it was the angels you were interested in.

In the end, all things are given to Christ. All things are brought together in Christ. God set it up that way. Maybe it would help to remember that “through him all things came to be, and without him, nothing that came into being came to be” from the gospel of John. “In him was life, and that life was the light of men.” He’s the one with the life as per God’s plan.

Oh, also it might help to remember that prior to Jesus, all the Old Testament righteous people were not in heaven. They were waiting. After the crucifixion, Jesus opened the gates of heaven.

 

[La-Petite-Fleur]

To get into heaven, yes. God could have set it up differently, but he didn’t. We don’t need Jesus (that is, we don’t need for God to have become incarnate and die and rise) to do many things that we do. We can breathe and eat and such without the incarnation having happened. We aren’t getting to heaven without it, though.

Each man/woman in heaven will be incorporated into Christ. The angels were in heaven without the need of the incarnation, though, so they are not in the same situation as us, that is part of why I asked you, to see if it was the angels you were interested in.

In the end, all things are given to Christ. All things are brought together in Christ. God set it up that way. Maybe it would help to remember that “through him all things came to be, and without him, nothing that came into being came to be” from the gospel of John. “In him was life, and that life was the light of men.” He’s the one with the life as per God’s plan.

Oh, also it might help to remember that prior to Jesus, all the Old Testament righteous people were not in heaven. They were waiting. After the crucifixion, Jesus opened the gates of heaven.

Thank you, that is good to know . I’m so thankful for your answer. I guess the only other question I have (I dont want to take over the thread) is, does every person in the world need Jesus in order to have a fulfilled spiritual life? Is one’s soul/spiritual life lacking if they lack Christ (even if they feel completely fulfilled by some other religion)? I guess what I’m trying to get at… is that, so many people think Jesus & His salvation are “good for some, but not all” (thus discrediting the universal truth of Christ & Salvation by redefining it as something of a moral relativist nature). Besides needing Jesus after death when trying to enter Heaven, don’t all people need Him in their spiritual life for one reason or another (no matter what their religion, or how happy they are with their religion) while on earth too (not just after death)? Thank you again for your answer .

 

[Pug]

does every person in the world need Jesus in order to have a fulfilled spiritual life? Is one’s soul/spiritual life lacking if they lack Christ (even if they feel completely fulfilled by some other religion)?

I’ve thought about this, and I’m not fully sure how to answer you. It is not something I usually think about, at least, not by comparison to other religions than mine. We need grace to enter into communion with God, whether it be now or in the future. So someone in communion with God here on earth got there by grace. Christ is the source of the grace that makes us participants in the divine life, even here on earth.

We will be the happiest (most blessed, most fulfilled) in communion with God. God is the ultimate, and to have a share in his divine life cannot be beat. But, someone who is in another religion may well have a share in God’s divine life (after all, they can get to heaven, so this must be possible). They might not be aware to whom they owe their debt, of course, and to be in possession of the truth would always be an improvement, in my opinion.

I could add some remarks about the Eucharist, but I think instead I’ll say that someone may feel fulfilled, but they will suddenly be more so if they come to share in the divine, as that is how men/women were designed, and that is how supernatural grace is to us. In some ways we determine who we are, but we all have a nature, a way we were made.

I don’t quite feel I am hitting the mark you are looking for, so maybe another poster can chime in. Here is a somewhat relevant quote from the newer Compendium of the CCC.

359. How do we attain beatitude?

We attain beatitude by virtue of the grace of Christ which makes us participants in the divine life. Christ in the Gospel points out to his followers the way that leads to eternal happiness: the beatitudes. The grace of Christ also is operative in every person who, following a correct conscience, seeks and loves the true and the good and avoids evil.

 

[Athanasiy]

Does it has anything to do with the Church Discipline.

For example I belong to the community ( not Catholic ) and there
there is the custom , that if the person committed sin he is excommunicated or putted to the disciplinary act.

The communion exist only for the church members not for the guests from other denominations ,not for the excommunicated.

I do not ask about is it good or bad practice.
I do not inquire about communion or church membership.
I would like to ask the Teaching of the ‘‘Christ died for the Elect’’ is the reason of this church practice ?
Or my church also believe that Christ died for all ?