Church Rejects Donation from Lottery Winner

[sola_scriptura]

Oh, I was under the impression that Church of Christ was a liberal denomination, not of the fire-and-brimstone hell-fire variety. But there is more than one “Church of Christ” denomination, isn’t there?

By the way, I know this has hardly anything to do with the OP about the lottery winner, but has anyone read the short story entitled, The Lottery?

They are very liberal; but they also are reformed

 

[vocatio]

Oh, I was under the impression that Church of Christ was a liberal denomination, not of the fire-and-brimstone hell-fire variety. But there is more than one “Church of Christ” denomination, isn’t there?

No sweety…hellfire and brimstones is the norm. There are however some more liberal COCs as we refer to them as converts from that faith. Much like all Protestant faiths there is a plethera of various magnitudes of this hellfire and brimstones.

Anyone remember Max Lucado…Rolling Oaks in San Antonio. We went there a few times and nearly croaked with their liberalness. Interestingly they ended up abandoning a required baptism for salvation and went Mega non-denominational…heresy for a Church of Christ. Orthodox Church of Christ rally to get them to take down the name Church of Christ because they are not. The same happened to the Richland Hills Church of Christ which we were members for a while…we cringed at some of the liberal atmosphere…almost Joel Olstene feel to it…with a more conservative feel to it. However one must realize that they do seem to be trying to practice what they beleive. We fell on our face financially after being laid off from an engineering job for 7 months. They spotted a house payment and a truck payment that allowed me enough time to join the National Guard, get enrolled in school and apply for a last ditch effort lower paying job…which I still have to this day. It amounted to $2,300… I’ve been trying to repay it by giving to others in need without counting it up. I call their act putting their money where their mouth is. I received much help from the elders in prayer and direction. I am greatful for all of their pastoral help to us…me really. We gradually worked form more conservative to more liberal. But their liberal is more conservative than most conservative Christians, Catholics or Orthodox. In fact, the Orhtodox would have been a much easier transition for us.

But coming home was inevitable after crossing a couple of major landmark moments…like discovering the ancient church fathers, the didache, etc.

 

[sola_scriptura]

No sweety…hellfire and brimstones is the norm. There are however some more liberal COCs as we refer to them as converts from that faith. Much like all Protestant faiths there is a plethera of various magnitudes of this hellfire and brimstones.

Anyone remember Max Lucado…Rolling Oaks in San Antonio. We went there a few times and nearly croaked with their liberalness. Interestingly they ended up abandoning a required baptism for salvation and went Mega non-denominational…heresy for a Church of Christ. Orthodox Church of Christ rally to get them to take down the name Church of Christ because they are not. The same happened to the Richland Hills Church of Christ which we were members for a while…we cringed at some of the liberal atmosphere…almost Joel Olstene feel to it…with a more conservative feel to it. However one must realize that they do seem to be trying to practice what they beleive. We fell on our face financially after being laid off from an engineering job for 7 months. They spotted a house payment and a truck payment that allowed me enough time to join the National Guard, get enrolled in school and apply for a last ditch effort lower paying job…which I still have to this day. It amounted to $2,300… I’ve been trying to repay it by giving to others in need without counting it up. I call their act putting their money where their mouth is. I received much help from the elders in prayer and direction. I am greatful for all of their pastoral help to us…me really. We gradually worked form more conservative to more liberal. But their liberal is more conservative than most conservative Christians, Catholics or Orthodox. In fact, the Orhtodox would have been a much easier transition for us.

But coming home was inevitable after crossing a couple of major landmark moments…like discovering the ancient church fathers, the didache, etc.

Sounds like Orthodox COC has a lot in common with Orthodox Presbyterian (I know the latter is “extremely” conservative – not even allowing females to teach males in any capacity).

 

[vocatio]

Sounds like Orthodox COC has a lot in common with Orthodox Presbyterian (I know the latter is “extremely” conservative – not even allowing females to teach males in any capacity).

EXACTLY…the same… Alexander Campbell was Presbyterian before venturing out on his own to create the Disciples of Christ. Somewhere along the way in the late 1800’s, witin the first 50 years of this “restoration movement” of the early church another schism between 3 factions in the restoration movement went sour creating the Disciples of Christ, Christian Church and Church of Christ. Women are severely marginalized in that faith…probably why my wife suffers from extreme anxiety issues after being tormented. Her dad was an elder. We have lots of elders, preachers and deacons in our ranks. Needless to say they do NOT know we’re Catholic.

 

[Matariel]

This is all very interesting… especially the part about coming home when reading the Fathers and Didache and the Faith that early Christians died for.

I myself have not fully decided on Orthodox or Catholic, though I’m leaning Catholic due to Petrine Primacy.

Oops… I digressed. Mea maxima culpa.

 

[vocatio]

I digressed also…sorry…

Back to going to hell…I mean buy lotto tickets… I still am impressed at the clergy for refusing to accept the lotto winnings tithe. So, I think the winner should consider crossing the Tiber and giving it to our parish…we need lots of work on our church.

 

[jblake]

Hmmm, I wouldn’t be surprised if the pastor really get’s an earful from his congregation

Probably not. This isn’t the first time a religious organization in Florida has not accepted a US$100,000+ donation whose source was lottery winnings.

If gambling truly was the issue than what’s the problem with simply admitting it?

The church probably has an unofficial policy of not publicly commenting on why any donation was accepted, or rejected.

xan

jonathon

 

[jblake]

Matariel;:

Oh, I was under the impression that Church of Christ was a liberal denomination,

Church of Christ (Disciples of Christ)

not of the fire-and-brimstone hell-fire variety.

Those tend to be one of the following:

• Church of Christ (One Cup)
• Church of Christ (No Sunday School)
• Church of Christ (Non Institutional)

Whilst both Church of Christ (Instrumental) and Church of Christ (Non-Instrumental) can get into hellfire and damnation, they are more likely to espouse either prosperity theology, or “seeker sensitive” theology of megachurch christianity.

But there is more than one “Church of Christ” denomination, isn’t there?

It depends upon how “denomination” is defined.

These congregations can range from the marginally autonomous, to the militantly autonomous.

Individual congregations range from happily condemning the congregation in the next town as being hell bent on eternal damnation, for some minor theological point that nobody else knows about, much less cares about, to ignoring everybody else, to not caring what the theological beliefs of others are, if working with them will accomplish the aims of a worthwhile project.

xan

jonathon

 

[Sabda]

Probably not. This isn’t the first time a religious organization in Florida has not accepted a US$100,000+ donation whose source was lottery winnings.

The church probably has an unofficial policy of not publicly commenting on why any donation was accepted, or rejected.

xan

jonathon

That’s probably true, the last statement that is. I find it interesting that they quoted a Holiness pastor who stated that the money could have been used for a lot of good. The Holiness are another group who are against gambling and drinking.

 

[kalt]

I don’t have a problem with it.

Get over it! How many dang times do I have to state that I DO NOT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PEOPLE GAMBLING. Some religions believe gambling is a grave sin. I know that it is not equal to murder or drugs. I know Catholics don’t believe gambling is a sin. I know gambling is legal. Abortion is legal but Catholics believe Abortion to be a grave sin. Gambling is legal, but some religions believe gambling to be a grave sin. This is between this guy and his pastor. If the pastor believes it to be a grave sin, he is respectable to have turned down the money. For crying out loud, quit beating a dead horse.

Why are you yelling?

I am talking about your comparing gambling to murder and drug dealing. That comparison doesn’t work, because the 3 things aren’t equal.

I’m telling you that the comparison doesn’t work, not that you believe that 3 are equal. You pulled murder and drug dealing into the argument, but they don’t really support your point. The 3 aren’t equal (as you’ve said you know–at least twice now), and yet you insist that the comparison is valid.

Everyone knows what you mean–that the pastor feels strongly about gambling. But, honestly, it’s not like a Catholic Priest refusing a donation from an abortion clinic, a drug dealer, or a hitman, all three of which society as a whole agrees are bad.

People feel strongly about all kinds of things.

Let’s take your abortion example. It’s legal, but most Americans have a problem with it. I don’t know a single person who thinks abortion is a good thing, even if they would fight to keep it legal. I’ve never heard a political candidate, no matter how pro-choice she is, say that abortion is a good thing that everyone should be free to enjoy. Instead, they say that it should be legal, but we should do everything we can to reduce the number of abortions per year. Even the pro-choice people agree that abortion isn’t a good thing.

Gambling. It’s legal, and most Americans don’t think that buying a lottery ticket is a sin. According to our society’s collective thinking, a person can gamble and not have a problem. Having a gambling problem and simply buying lottery tickets are two different things.

Gambling isn’t seen by most Americans as a bad thing.

Abortion and gambling - another invalid comparison.

Like I said earlier, your point (that the pastor has the right to refuse the money if it’s against his church’s principles) is right on the money.

You don’t even need that comparison to win the point.

The pastor is walking the walk, even if his view on gambling is wrong in most people’s eyes–including ours.

I don’t think you realize that I agree with your point. I only disagree with the comparison you used to try to support it.

IMO, your argument was strong and didn’t need a comparison to begin with.

 

[kalt]

That’s so stupid! Gambling isn’t morally wrong in and of itself; how pharisaical of him. He wasn’t taking a high road, he was basically saying to that guy who won the lottery, “I’m holier than thou, so you can take that unholy mammon and shove it!” Just like Baptist’s illogical restriction on alcohol. Um… let’s see… last time I checked Jesus turned water into wine.

Besides, for all he knows, some of his other congregants might be slipping won lottery money into the offering basket. What a Pharisee.

I think it was stupid, too. I know that the pastor was “walking the walk”, but when the walk is based on a false idea…

The donor, otoh, is the real hero of the story.

No matter how true to himself the pastor is, he’s wrong about gambling.

He has every right to refuse the money–good for him for not doing something different than he says he believes–but in the end, he’s wrong.

I’m wondering, though, if the man who tried to donate the money has a gambling problem. In that case, I think anyone would be right to refuse the money. Taking it would be tacit approval of the addiction.