Clapping to the Music?

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Among other disturbing threads creeping into and diluting our sacred liturgy (e.g., hand holding during the Our Father), clapping hands to show approval of the musical talents of the music ministry is starting to really bother me. I would like to know if anyone else agrees with me.

Presuming I am not the only one out here who thinks this, I would also like to know your thoughts on just WHY this is so troubling. Beside the vertical nature of the Mass and the fact that we are there to honor God, not Aunt Betty on the flute and Uncle Larry on the bass, can anyone point to a GIRM article or other church document or article that comments on this?

Thank you, and God bless.
 
cjaubert said:
Among other disturbing threads creeping into and diluting our sacred liturgy (e.g., hand holding during the Our Father), clapping hands to show approval of the musical talents of the music ministry is starting to really bother me. I would like to know if anyone else agrees with me.

Presuming I am not the only one out here who thinks this, I would also like to know your thoughts on just WHY this is so troubling. Beside the vertical nature of the Mass and the fact that we are there to honor God, not Aunt Betty on the flute and Uncle Larry on the bass, can anyone point to a GIRM article or other church document or article that comments on this?

Thank you, and God bless.
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It’s a secular response to what should be a non-secular offering of a particular talent to the community (and of course, to God). To single out the musicians with applause makes them appear to be the center of the Mass. Do we applaud the priest for confecting the Eucharist?
 
You dont need a document to know this is wrong.

I’m going to have to add your post to my collection of “things to be grateful I don’t have to endure” folder.

Sometimes I wonder how a Parish can get away with the things I read here.

Is there not one person willing to challenge the Pastor?😦
 
cjaubert said:
Among other disturbing threads creeping into and diluting our sacred liturgy (e.g., hand holding during the Our Father), clapping hands to show approval of the musical talents of the music ministry is starting to really bother me. I would like to know if anyone else agrees with me.

Presuming I am not the only one out here who thinks this, I would also like to know your thoughts on just WHY this is so troubling. Beside the vertical nature of the Mass and the fact that we are there to honor God, not Aunt Betty on the flute and Uncle Larry on the bass, can anyone point to a GIRM article or other church document or article that comments on this?

Thank you, and God bless.
Click to expand...
I agree, I’m not a huge fan of it. I mean, it’s not really wrong to enjoy the Mass or to enjoy the music in the Mass, but it’s beside the point. We don’t go to Mass to have a good time. We go to be present at the Sacrifice of the Mass and to join ourselves with that sacrifice. At another time or place, honoring the musicians or singers with clapping could be completly appropriate, even a way to worship God (if one thanks God for the great gifts that he bestowed upon the singer or musician) but I agree, that is not the intention of most people who clap to music at the Mass.
But it bothers me for another reason. For me, clapping to music is a part of the Evangelical tradition or form of worship, and to me, attending a Mass that borrows the music, or the clapping, from the Evangelical tradition is kind of embarrasing. It’s like watching my parents (in their 50’s) dance to hip hop music to prove that they’re “cool” or “with it.” It’s painful, and as someone who used to attend Evangelical services, it comes across as the cheap imitation of the real thing. If I ever get the urge to hear Evangelical Christian rock music, or clapping, I’ll go visit an Evangelical Protestant church and get the real thing. I want to go to the Mass and see Catholics worshipping as Catholics, not Catholics worshipping as Protestants.
 
Once in awhile, our Priest will single us out (Cantors and Choirs) and he starts the clapping.
I can tell you that the musicians I know of don’t like it any better than most of you seem to do.

in Christ
Steph
 
I don’t mind an applause of appreciation, after Mass, not during

However, one of the things I had to struggle with when I played in a folk group, was to keep the young members of the group from thinking that they were there for the purpose of entertaining the people. Nothing is more important, than what’s going on up on the altar and the order of importance among the ministries is; the priest, the deacon, the lector, the altar servers and the extra-ordinary Eucharistic ministers, and lastly, the music. You can have a Mass without music, but you can’t have a Mass without the priest.

Often, people would want to join our group. I would have to first interview them, and then have them audition. I didn’t want entertainers, but capable people, who would be serving the congregation, in songs of worship.

Too often, it goes beyond that, and ego stroking become’s a huge part of the music ministry.
 
I’m on the other side of the piano when it comes to this issue folks. If you think we’re doing a good job, don’t clap after Mass, just sing louder on the hymns. I HATE it when they clap for us after Mass. We’re not there to entertain YOU. We’re there to worship God. If He wants to clap after we’re done, He, of course, can feel free. 😉
 
MusicMan said:
I’m on the other side of the piano when it comes to this issue folks. If you think we’re doing a good job, don’t clap after Mass, just sing louder on the hymns. I HATE it when they clap for us after Mass. We’re not there to entertain YOU. We’re there to worship God. If He wants to clap after we’re done, He, of course, can feel free. 😉
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Would He do this with thunder??? 😃
 
VociMike said:
It’s a secular response to what should be a non-secular offering of a particular talent to the community (and of course, to God). To single out the musicians with applause makes them appear to be the center of the Mass. Do we applaud the priest for confecting the Eucharist?
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That reminds me of a hilarious thing that happened back in grade school. I think I was in the 5th grade or so but everyone started clapping when the priests stated something about the music or maybe it was some teacher since I don’t think it was at the very end of mass, I don’t know. However, then the junior high students thought they would start clapping at a bunch of other times like when the priest said the Lord be with you. and other phrases and like you said, although in an unfortunate probably sac religious way, aplauded the priest. I don’t remember the teachers or the few nuns thinking it was too funny and they knew it was the juniorn high so they probably talked to them about it, but we all thought it was hilarious.
 
Oh, in regards to clapping, if I sing in the choir or the psalm I don’t care if people clap or not. However, I have become accustomed to it so if it were to one day stop I would think we all sucked or something. I agree that it is not necessary though and even a little embarrassing since we aren’t there to entertain.
 
MusicMan said:
I’m on the other side of the piano when it comes to this issue folks. If you think we’re doing a good job, don’t clap after Mass, just sing louder on the hymns. I HATE it when they clap for us after Mass. We’re not there to entertain YOU. We’re there to worship God. If He wants to clap after we’re done, He, of course, can feel free. 😉
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Well, I’ve been cantoring and soloing for a couple of years now, and no one in the congregation has applauded me yet.

However, I have heard God clapping. Whenever someone comes up to me afterwards and quietly tells me that my voice is soothing, or that something I sang made her cry, or that she’s glad when I cantor because she finds me easy to follow, that’s the sound of God clapping.
 
MarthaMartha said:
Well, I’ve been cantoring and soloing for a couple of years now, and no one in the congregation has applauded me yet.

However, I have heard God clapping. Whenever someone comes up to me afterwards and quietly tells me that my voice is soothing, or that something I sang made her cry, or that she’s glad when I cantor because she finds me easy to follow, that’s the sound of God clapping.
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I have had a similar experience as cantor and have taken it as you have. Clapping after the choir or organist plays or sings I find terribly disturbing. It makes me cringe, actually.

In Peace,
DS
 
Someone else (sorry… don’t remember who) posted this quote in a previous thread of a similar nature:
“Whenever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment.”
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Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger
The Spirit of the Liturgy
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(Pg 198)
 
It would be nice I think if those experiencing this situation approached their priest and discussed it with him, so that Father could then address (at several Masses, if need be) the faithful, perhaps something to this effect:

My dear brothers and sisters:
Many of you have been expressing your appreciation of the time and talent of our choir/cantor/etc. lately by applause after hymns.

I would like to share with you this passage from our Holy Father Benedict XVI, written while he was still Cardinal Ratzinger: “Whenever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment.”

I am sure that none of you has consciously considered the music ministry here to be ‘entertainment’. Yet the fact remains that in the secular world, applause is most definitely given for that which entertains us.

Your brothers and sisters in the music ministry are not ‘performing’ but are rather directing their efforts to God. Efforts made to please the Lord almost certainly will please many if not all people. However, I would like to ask you, in consideration of all that applause usually stands for in society, to refrain from applause in church. This will not mean that you do not appreciate the work of your brothers and sisters; rather, it will show that you more perfectly understand that their efforts are directed at God.

It is of course perfectly permissible and desirable that, after Mass and outside the church, you may express any feelings you have to members of the music ministry regarding their work, should you feel you wish to share verbal or other active approbation.

I thank you for your attention to making the liturgy of the Mass as pleasing to God as you can. May God bless you all.
 
Tantum_ergo said:
It would be nice I think if those experiencing this situation approached their priest and discussed it with him, so that Father could then address (at several Masses, if need be) the faithful, perhaps something to this effect:

My dear brothers and sisters:
Many of you have been expressing your appreciation of the time and talent of our choir/cantor/etc. lately by applause after hymns.

I would like to share with you this passage from our Holy Father Benedict XVI, written while he was still Cardinal Ratzinger: “Whenever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment.”

I am sure that none of you has consciously considered the music ministry here to be ‘entertainment’. Yet the fact remains that in the secular world, applause is most definitely given for that which entertains us.

Your brothers and sisters in the music ministry are not ‘performing’ but are rather directing their efforts to God. Efforts made to please the Lord almost certainly will please many if not all people. However, I would like to ask you, in consideration of all that applause usually stands for in society, to refrain from applause in church. This will not mean that you do not appreciate the work of your brothers and sisters; rather, it will show that you more perfectly understand that their efforts are directed at God.

It is of course perfectly permissible and desirable that, after Mass and outside the church, you may express any feelings you have to members of the music ministry regarding their work, should you feel you wish to share verbal or other active approbation.

I thank you for your attention to making the liturgy of the Mass as pleasing to God as you can. May God bless you all.
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Cool! Can I lift this and send it to my pastor? You have a way with words, my friend… 🙂

Peace,
DS
 
cjaubert said:
Beside the vertical nature of the Mass and the fact that we are there to honor God, not Aunt Betty on the flute and Uncle Larry on the bass, can anyone point to a GIRM article or other church document or article that comments on this?
Click to expand...
JimR-OCDS said:
However, one of the things I had to struggle with when I played in a folk group, was to keep the young members of the group from thinking that they were there for the purpose of entertaining the people.
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I don’t recall the name of it off-hand, but there is a Vatican II document that talks about the purpose of liturgy and how we’re ALL called to participate. When the choir/music becomes a show, they’ve moved from participating to entertaining.
 
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