Collins Daily Prayer and structure of ordinary time office

[fincleah]

Dear all,

I have purchased Daily Prayer by Collins publishers, and I cannot for the life of me find out what the hours are for ordinary time, although I can perfectly find the offices for ordinary Sundays. For example today, 26th of October, I cannot find the hours for this week, neither this day. Any help is greatly appreciated, and I do apologise if the answer is in plain sight and I just can’t see it.

And so my problem may simply be in the understanding of ordinary time divine office. So it would also be greatly appreciated if I could know the structure of todays hours and prayers/psalms/hymns relative to the Psalter and divine office as outlined in the collins daily prayer. Also for example, today seems to be Week 2 of the 4 week cycle psalter (from looking at universalis), but I do not know how I would find that out otherwise.

Regards,
Jaimin

 

[Vico]

Dear all,

I have purchased Daily Prayer by Collins publishers, and I cannot for the life of me find out what the hours are for ordinary time, although I can perfectly find the offices for ordinary Sundays. For example today, 26th of October, I cannot find the hours for this week, neither this day. Any help is greatly appreciated, and I do apologise if the answer is in plain sight and I just can’t see it.

And so my problem may simply be in the understanding of ordinary time divine office. So it would also be greatly appreciated if I could know the structure of todays hours and prayers/psalms/hymns relative to the Psalter and divine office as outlined in the collins daily prayer. Also for example, today seems to be Week 2 of the 4 week cycle psalter (from looking at universalis), but I do not know how I would find that out otherwise.

Regards,
Jaimin

https://universalis.com/

I read that Collins does not include the Office of Readings (Matins). It has 'Morning Prayer’ (Lauds), ‘Prayer during the Day’ (3, 6, 9), ‘Evening Prayer’ (Vespers), and ‘Night Prayer’ (Compline).

For 26 October it should be the 30th week of Ordinary Time (Monday that follows the 30th Sunday of Ordinary Time).

 

[MikeInVA]

What you need is an ordo. An ordo is booklet that tells you what day it is (Church day) and what pages the prayers are on. In the U.S. we use the St. Joseph’s Ordo, but you will need one published for your country, as each country has its own calendar for feasts, etc. Also, make sure it is for the version of the Office that you are using. We have a single volume “Christian Prayer” and the four-volume “Liturgy of the Hours” and each has its own ordo.

 

[fincleah]

Thank you all for your responses, they have been insightful! Indeed, Collins’ Daily Prayer doesn’t include Matins, and it should be that there is a section for ordinary time and it would be, as you say, the 30th week. However, I have given you some images that show the contents pages of the book (the first 3 images), on google drive since I am a new user and can’t upload images to this site directly yet:

link:drive.google.com/drive/folders/1M_5uEDZpqfKpsCAihFOVzI43f7Lx4Aid?usp=sharing

Hopefully you might see that it essentially skips ordinary time although provides Sundays of ordinary time.which is a bit odd. Upon looking further it seems that, looking at today within the psalter (2nd week of the 4 week cycle), that todays hours are included? (if you might be able to double check if this is so that would be a great help, again images are in the google drive link, for the contents, and the Monday of Week 2 in the Psalter section). This leads me to think that the weeks of ordinary time are embedded in the Psalter, but that must mean that the hours for ordinary time repeat on a 4 week cycle too, which I don’t think is the case with my current knowledge. I am really quite lost, so your help is absolutely, most certainly appreciated, thank you very much!!

 

[porthos11]

For weekdays in ordinary time, everything is taken from the Psalter, unless there is a celebration of a saint, in which case, those pertinent parts are taken from the Proper of Saints and Commons.

You will not see daily texts for Ordinary Time in the Proper of Seasons unless you pray the Office of Readings.

 

[mfac11]

The psalter is a 4-week psalter year round. You start with the Week 1 on the first week of ordinary time, the first week of Advent, the first week of Lent and the first week of Easter. To determine which week of the psalter to use, divide the current week number by 4 and use the remainder. 1 is the first week, 2 is the second, 3 the third and 0 the fourth week of the psalter.

Since today is Monday of the 30th week of ordinary time, divide 30 by 4, the remainder is 2, use week 2 of the psalter.

 

[Todd_Easton]

This leads me to think that the weeks of ordinary time are embedded in the Psalter, but that must mean that the hours for ordinary time repeat on a 4 week cycle too,

Yes, Morning Prayer, Prayer During the Day, and Evening Prayer for Ordinary Time repeat on a 4 week cycle. Night Prayer is a little different; it repeats on a 1 week cycle. See Daily Prayer, The Psalter, pages [455]-[484].

Although, as another poster (mfac11) has shown, it is easily calculated based on the week number, the proper for the Sundays in Ordinary Time (Daily Prayer, The Proper of Seasons, pages 507-531) should indicate which week of the 4-Week Psalter is to be used for that Sunday and the rest of that week.

The Liturgy Office of the Catholic Church in England and Wales publishes a monthly liturgical calendar online, such as October 2020, indicating the daily celebrations there, including, if applicable, which week of the 4-Week Psalter is to be used, as Week I, Week II, Week III, or Week IV. However, for this particular week (25 Oct), they wrongly indicate “Week III” when it should say “Week II.”

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops likewise publishes an annual liturgical calendar online, such as 2020 (pdf), indicating the daily celebrations there, including, if applicable, which week of the 4-Week Psalter is to be used as Pss I, Pss II, Pss III, or Pss IV.

 

[Titivillus]

NB: I am not familiar with this particular book.

Another tricky bit to be aware of is that Ash Wednesday and the days following count as the “0th Week of Lent”, and use Psalter Week IV, no matter what Psalter Week has been in use the immediately preceding days.

Also NB the section of Sundays in Ordinary Time likely includes only the proper parts for those days (the antiphon for the Gospel Canticle and the concluding prayer), all else will be taken from the Psalter. During seasons other than Ordinary Time, there should be more proper parts for weekdays as well as Sundays. It would be a good idea to browse the book outside of prayer time to familiarize yourself with it. (Especially with Advent coming up in a few weeks)

 

[Titivillus]

Note:

In the U.S. we use the St. Joseph’s Ordo …

The St Joseph Guide ordos are only useful to those using the (admittedly popular) St Joseph editions of Christian Prayer or the Liturgy of the Hours from Catholic Book Publishers. It would not (I presume) be helpful with this Collins product (and I know it is not useful with the Daughters of St Paul editions)

 

[OraLabora]

Well it depends. If one knows enough about how the LOTH works, any old ordo for your episcopal conference will do, just to confirm which day in which season or which feast or memorial it is especially for your local calendar. You wouldn’t need the page numbers. One would know, for instance, that for the memorial of St. Someone, you find the proper parts, if any, in the propers, the rest in the commons for the type of saint (martyr, pastor, etc.), and the psalms and antiphons are of whatever day of whatever week it is.

That’s why anyone getting started in the LOTH should spend quality time reading the General Instruction and the Ordinary, and if something is unclear ask questions here. It eventually becomes second nature.

 

[TomH1]

I’ve just had a quick look at the book on Amazon but it does not come with a ‘Look Inside’, so I cannot see its contents. Does it not contain the four-week Psalter? That is where the bulk of the Office is found in Ordinary Time. All you need to know is which week of Ordinary Time it is. You need an ordo to tell you which week of the four-week cycle we are in.

Your diocese almost certainly publishes an ordo although by this time of year they’re usually out-of-print. New ones should be available soon for 2020-21. I don’t know yet how I’m going to get mine because the Catholic bookshop where I buy it is still closed due to the COVID-19 Pandemic.

Many dioceses also publish their ordo online in PDF format. You could try to find one for your diocese. (Mine, unfortunately, is one whih doesn’t.)

Also I’ve seen the current week of the Psalter published in parishes’ weekly bulletins. Have you checked to see if yours does? Many also show what is to be observed on each day of the current week.

 

[fincleah]

Dear all who have kindly given answers to my query,

Firstly I thank you all very much for your help and even if it hasn’t directly enlightened me on my specific problem, it has most definitely opened my eyes more with regards to the general workings of the liturgical calendar, so thank you all! I may not have been all to clear so I do apologise if I wasn’t, but my main problem was pretty much just with the arrangement of the book, and I would say the arrangement of most divine office books that don’t have the office of readings it seems, but due to your answers I am now clear on that ordinary time hours rotate with the 4 week Psalter in this book, but also never knew The Liturgy Office provided such calendars (I am a UK resident), so much else has also become clear so I can’t thank you enough! I would say my question has been completely resolved!

I would like to finish off by wishing you all well, not least during this time and in what might be a rather harsh winter, all the best.