Colossians 2:16-16

[ElizaE]

Colossians 2:16-16. “16Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.”

Please help me rebuke this.

 

[Fidelis]

ElizaE:

Colossians 2:16-16. “16Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.”

Please help me rebuke this.

Tell us first what the charge is; what this verse is supposed to imply that we need to rebut.

 

[John_Henry]

Not sure whacha mean. But all the verse means is that, now that we have Christ, the things which pointed to Christ in Old Testament worship and practice are no longer necessary. Consequently, we shouldn’t let anyone judge us about not keeping those Old Testament practices (e.g., certain religious fetivals).

 

[ElizaE]

The person I am debating implied that all the Traditions of the Catholic Faith are just Shadows of Christ. She based that argument on the above passage. Is there another passage that will rebuke the above.

Thank you

 

[John_Henry]

ElizaE:

The person I am debating implied that all the Traditions of the Catholic Faith are just Shadows of Christ. She based that argument on the above passage. Is there another passage that will rebuke the above.

They can imply all that they want, but seen as that isn’t what the passage is talking about, it won’t float. In other words, the passage is talking about Old Testament Jewish practices. Your interlocutor will have to bring forth scripture that supposedly contradicts specific Catholic practices. Once they do that, then your task is to show them that those scriptures don’t mean what they think they mean.

 

[ElizaE]

Thank you to all

 

[Scalia]

Paul also implores “hold fast to your traditions” 2 Thessalonians 2:15

 

[ScottH]

Scalia:

Paul also implores “hold fast to your traditions” 2 Thessalonians 2:15

The question then becomes what were the traditions at the time of Paul?

 

[DeFide]

ScottH:

The question then becomes what were the traditions at the time of Paul?

It doesn’t say “at the time of Paul”. Traditions, by their very nature, continue. Also, you accept a Tradition of a time much later than St. Paul-- namely the canon of the New Testament. You’ll have to reject that Tradition if you limit valid Tradition to the Tradition Paul is aware of.

 

[michaelgazin]

ScottH:

The question then becomes what were the traditions at the time of Paul?

The traditions at the time of Paul were largely just the Apostolic interpretation of the Biblical teachings, that were maybe less explicit in the writings i.e. baptism of infants or not, baptism symbol or not, Eucharist real or symbolic, once saved always saved or not etc. Their Traditions give us the appropriate lens to interpret Scripture in a sense.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

The question then becomes what were the traditions at the time of Paul?

That’s an easy one. . .all the ones that Catholics call Sacred Tradition. (Really. There is NO more revelation after the Bible, and I’m not even going into the 382 A.D. date for the written one).

All the things of Sacred Tradition, including the discipline of priestly celibacy in the Latin rite, the Immaculate Conception, the co-equality of the Trinity. . .these are not part of the “written” tradition of our beloved Sacred Scripture, but ARE a part, traced through apostolic works through the early Church Fathers and all the way to today (and to the future). They may not have been fully known, fully realized, or fully explicit, but they were there.

Paul lived in a time when slavery was legal and practiced. . .with some minor and some MAJOR differences from the slavery of say 19th century Europe and America. Do we think that the Bible “changed” its position on slavery, or do we think that as people grew in the word of God and followed in the way of Christ that people better understood slavery and thus worked to end it?

 

[John_Henry]

ElizaE:

Colossians 2:16-16. “16Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.”

I would also add, show me where the Catholic Church judges me as to what I eat and drink. Does your interrogator not keep religious festivals (Easter, Christmas, Pentecost etc.)? When do Catholics celebrate new moons? And when do Catholics keep the Jewish sabbath (Saturday)?