Comparing Best to Best.

[majick275]

(Continued)

The King Follett sermon that GBH so heartily endorsed was not just JS talking at some guys funeral

Historical Note: President Joseph Smith delivered the following discourse before about twenty thousand Saints at the April conference of the Church, 1844, being the funeral sermon of Elder King Follett. Reported by Willard Richards, Wilford Woodruff, Thomas Bullock and William Clayton. This discourse was first published in the Times and Seasons of August 15, 1844:

Here is a key passage:

I will go back to the beginning before the world was, to show what kind of being God is. What sort of a being was God in the beginning? Open your ears and hear, all ye ends of the earth, for I am going to prove it to you by the Bible, and to tell you the designs of God in relation to the human race, and why He interferes with the affairs of man. Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Section Six 1843–44, p.345

*God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret. If the veil were rent today, and the great God who holds this world in its orbit, and who upholds all worlds and all things by his power, was to make himself visible,—I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form—like yourselves in all the person, image, and very form as a man; for Adam was created in the very fashion, image and likeness of God, and received instruction from, and walked, talked and conversed with him, as one man talks and communes with another.

In order to understand the subject of the dead, for consolation of those who mourn for the loss of their friends, it is necessary we should understand the character and being of God and how he came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away the veil, so that you may see. Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Section Six 1843–44, p.345 These are incomprehensible ideas to some, but they are simple. It is the first principle of the Gospel to know for a certainty the Character of God, and to know that we may converse with him as one man converses with another, and that he was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ himself did; and I will show it from the Bible. …

Here, then, is eternal life—to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all Gods have done before you,3 namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace, from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain to the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings, and to sit in glory, as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power. And I want you to know that God, in the last days, while certain individuals are proclaiming his name, is not trifling with you or me.
Does this really sound like speculation to any LDS who has a testimony that Joseph Smith was a true prophet? That he confidently expounded on this in General Conference, telling the church that was the first principle of the Gospel speaks volumes. You can make up any mathematical BSI you want that weights things in whatever fashion you want BUT this is the guy that LDS believed the Lord chose to “restore” the “true” Gospel and establish Christ’ own church in this dispensation.

 

[majick275]

(continued)

This doctrine has been embraced, preached, taught, expounded and exhorted by Brigham Young, Joseph fielding Smith, Gordon B Hinckley and most other LDS prophets. It has been denounced by NONE.

You can work all kinds of deceptions on people so that they think that whatever LDS doctrines that they have problems with either aren’t important or aren’t currently practiced so that people are tempted to join these enthusiastic, friendly people in their charitable service projects and the eating of green Jello. Don’t drink the Kool-Aid!

Eternal Progression, Polygamy, distant stars where God dwells, secret coded messages in egyptian magic scrolls, a complete revision of the Bible, Joseph Smith judging who from this dispensation will enter into the kingdom of God(Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses Vol 7 Page 289 “no man or woman in this dispensation will ever inter into the celestial kingdom of God without the consent of Joseph Smith.”), these are all part of the “man behind the curtain”.

This is why I will no longer “cast my pearls before swine” by corresponding with the servants of Lucifer. I remain here to provide warning to those Catholics and other individuals interested in Catholicism so that they will not be decieved as the Bibles warns us will happen the last days.

*Matthew 24

  4And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

5For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

10And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

11And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

12And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

23Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

25Behold, I have told you before.

26Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

(Doesn’t this sound like Utah and the LDS Temples?)*

and also :

*2 Cor 11

10As the truth of Christ is in me, no man shall stop me of this boasting in the regions of Achaia.

11Wherefore? because I love you not? God knoweth.

12But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.

13For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

14And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

15Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

16I say again, let no man think me a fool; if otherwise, yet as a fool receive me, that I may boast myself a little.

17That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord, but as it were foolishly, in this confidence of boasting.

18Seeing that many glory after the flesh, I will glory also.

19For ye suffer fools gladly, seeing ye yourselves are wise. *

I would exhort all to try this experiment:

Study the teachings of the Catholic Church and then ask God the eternal Father in the name of Christ if these things are not true and if you ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest it to you by the power of the Holy spirit.

But there is more, my words do not provide a perfect knowledge. You can’t know the truth at first. But if you will awake and arouse your faculties to an experiment on my words and exercise a particle of faith, if you can just WANT to believe in the Holy Catholic Church then let this desire work on you until you can believe the full truth of the real Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Try it, just as I described it with a sincere intent, wanting to believe and see what spiritual witness you get.

Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.

 

[PaulDupre]

majick275:

Paul,
Do you see the difficulties in “debating” false doctrines, taught by false prophets with people who glorify and denounce these teachings and “prophets” whenever/wherever it is necessary to support a position based on satanic pride so that they can become Gods?

Yes Majick, it has been clear to me since 1986 that the LDS Church, its leaders and its TBMs are not really interested in teaching the Mormon “gospel” to anyone or getting anyone closer to God. Their only objective is to recruit new members. They don’t care if the members understand LDS teachings. In fact, they would rather have members who know little or nothing of true Mormonism - it’s easier that way.

So the LDS will tell you anything, proclaim any message, defend or decry any doctrine that will get you to agree with them and join them. If you like what they’re saying, they’ll keep saying it. If not, they will switch bait and keep fishing until they hook you. This technique is such a basic part of Mormon culture (they even do it to one another) that most of them don’t even realize they’re doing it.

Only after the Holy Spirit has shown a Mormon that his “church” is false and evil can anyone communicate reasonably with him. Until then all we get is the moving target and the denials and …

I am so grateful that God brought me back to the Catholic faith. What a relief!

God love you,
Paul

 

[BJRumph]

Only after the Holy Spirit has shown a Mormon that his “church” is false and evil can anyone communicate reasonably with him.

Amen to that Paul. This is exactly how it was with me.

I’ll also add a “second” to Majick275’s most recent posts. Up until this week, I was content to “merely” believe that the CoJCoLDS was a human invention, inspired by weakness of character and basic fraud. But now, I have realized it is far more than even the most stubborn of heretics could produce without “outside” help.

It is easy, for example, to “stray”, and pronounce the Fall as being “necessary” and even “good”, but to take the next step and proclaim that sin and evil actually and “necessarily” **defeats God ** is to go beyond basic error and into the realm of the satanic.

The LDS church is not simply a christian church that is simply “mistaken” on a few theological points that are not relevant to daily life; they are the very abominable church that rose in the latter days spoken of in the Christian and mormon Scripture. They “maketh and loveth a Lie”, as is amply evidenced here. Rather than teach about the Christian Unity, they make you get “sealed” to escape the implied penalty that if you don’t, God will punish you with separation from your faithful loved ones, as well as be demoted from “son” or “daughter” to being a serving “angel”. Instead of Grace, ordinances for those dead, denying the dignity to those who, in life, did not fall into the mormon error, rather than allowing God to judge them in Righteousness. Building “community” based on eternal “reward” gain and punishment, rather than on true, voluntary and selfless Christian charity and unity. Placing one’s faith in Church and Prophet, rather than in God alone (even while denying that very faith as they reject the very words of their prophets whose words are “too hard”). Allowing any sort of Heresy, even within its own, just so long as the member does not fall into Apostasy (indeed, does any lds here even know the difference between the two, or that they are both objective realities, not subjective perceptions? From the positions of every lds here, I have to conclude not).

I have been largely absent from the forum for the last few days, and was toying with not coming back at all, until today’s Mass. I post this only in the spirit of the Charity spoken of today, in every catholic church in America, if not the world.

My mormon Brothers, you have fallen into evil. You are deceived. I cannot really go beyond this simple fact, as I, too, know that your human efforts will not produce for you the Truth you need to escape your spiritual bondage. Stop trying to use your human strength, and seek God’s deliverance, knowing the God is not a man; but is supremely Divine and Potent, to be capable of exceeding any limit you have, in error and as you have been deceived, placed upon Him. You cannot escape the prison you entered, but He can deliver you. Know this: He is **not bound ** by the rules He has given us in our state. There is Good without evil; there is Providence without law. No matter the prison you created for your soul, He can liberate you from it.

All you need do is ask Him; not an “exalted man” (as promised by the Serpent), but God.

My prayers are with you, even as I cannot be. If I could deliver you myself, I would; but I recognize that it is beyond my power to do so, but nevertheless, it is not without the power of God, and so it is to Him that I commend you.

May the Peace and Love of Christ be with you all, and my our liberating Redeemer show you His power and glory in revealing to you His holy Freedom, which He stands ready to grant unto you, if you but ask.

Caritas numquam excidit
Inter arma caritas