Confession-Catholic vs KJV. Gospel of John Ch 20:19-23-

[Kenandbarbie]

I have started exploring apologetics and I just began studying confession and why protestant faiths don’t believe. But…I don’t know why they don’t believe.

The Catholic Bible and the KJV both say the same thing. KJV has fancier words. The Catholic Bible says “Forgive” and the KJV says “Remit”. They both mean the same thing.

Why do they deny it when it’s right infront of their face. I don’t get it. There are so many other things that are right infront of them and if they would listen to what they read…they would convert and become a Catholic…right.

I realize they can’t practice the sacrament of reconciliation because they don’t have the priests to do it. I just want someone elses insight. Thanks. Tina.

 

[MilesJesu]

Tina,

You bring up a very good question, one that often seems very perplexing.

As Catholics, we often take our birth right for granted. We often miss out on what the “fullness of truth” really means. A priest friend once shared a passage that may be relevant to your question:

In Mt 13:14-17 "14 With them indeed is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah which says: ‘You shall indeed hear but never understand, and you shall indeed see but never perceive. 15 For this people’s heart has grown dull, and their ears are heavy of hearing, and their eyes they have closed, lest they should perceive with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and turn for me to heal them.’ 16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see, and your ears, for they hear. 17 Truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous men longed to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.

That you see what is plain and hear what is clear, is truly a gift from God- one that prophets and righteous men longed to see. That is tough for me to slow down and grasp but makes me thank God.

I have read Jn 20:19-23 to many protestants and they just don’t seem to understand what the text says literally. But if you read further in Mt 13, you will read about the sower. Just keep planting the seed!

Peace,

MilesJesu

 

[Genesis315]

Kenandbarbie:

Why do they deny it when it’s right infront of their face.

One of the tenets of the Reformation was the desire to not be dependent on clergy. Well, one of the things we depend on clergy for is confession. So, in order to separate themselves from the Catholic hierarchy they had to axe confession. Plus. confession is hard–it really makes you put down your pride and humbly go to God for forgiveness.

 

[Veritas]

Kenandbarbie:

I don’t know why they don’t believe.

The foundational truth of Protestantism is that “Catholicism MUST be wrong.” That is their raison d’etre for if the Church is true, then there is no valid reason for Protestantism. As such, only ONE of the million complaints leveled at the Church needs to be true for them to hold a valid position. Whereas the Church needs to be correct on ALL of its positions in order to be the true Church of Christ. Probabilistically they hold the stronger position. Which is why the Catholic Church of Christ is a living Miracle of truth.

And don’t underestimate how difficult it is to realize the truth. To realize their foundation is sand is to realize that which is built upon it will not last. We’re talking life-changing choices.

 

[asteroid]

Kenandbarbie:

Why do they deny it when it’s right infront of their face. I don’t get it. There are so many other things that are right infront of them and if they would listen to what they read…they would convert and become a Catholic…right.

… wrong! unfortunately.

I’ve just looked at a few reformed commentaries. They note that “only God can forgive sins” therefore Catholics are wrong, thus misunderstanding the Sacrament. After all, in the Sacrament it’s really God/Christ forgiving us isn’t it, even though a priest is physically there opening his mouth and saying we are forgiven.

They note that the power is given to all the apostles, not just Peter - so apparently there isn’t any primacy of Peter.

Albert Barnes writes that Jesus meant the apostles “should be inspired; that in founding the church, and in declaring the will of God, they should be taught by the Holy Spirit to declare on what terms, to what characters, and to what temper of mind God would extend forgiveness of sins. It was not authority to forgive individuals, but to establish in all the churches the terms and conditions on which men might be pardoned,”

Of course, this isn’t what Jesus said is it? The view of Barnes seems common among reformed commentators. That view states that the apostles would be able to tell people how their sins could or couldn’t be forgiven. This isn’t what Jesus said.

If they would read the words of Jesus and assume, unless they had good reasons otherwise, that Jesus meant what he said, then yes, they might question things.

I’ve been in various pentecostal churches and I’ve only ever heard the verses mentioned a few times. Curiously, that was in connection with ALL OF US being able to forgive or retain sins. Rather the opposite of the reformed commentary.

 

[ZAROVE]

In this case its just that the KJV is a prosucet of the 1600’s. Not sure but I think the DR uses similar language throughout its text, though I am not certian as ot thsi spacific instance.

Remember, the KJV is an Anglcian Bible, and the anglcians athte time where extremely Cahtolic in their theology…

 

[seeker63]

Well, as a Catholic who used to be Protestant, maybe I can offer one tak eon it.

Consider 1 John 1:9–“If we confess our sins, He [God] is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”

Verses like that can be seen by a Protestant as justification that all a person needs to do is confess in prayer DIRECTLY to God and he’ll obtain forgiveness from Him, without having to bring a priest into the equation.

 

[MarySon]

seeker63:

Well, as a Catholic who used to be Protestant, maybe I can offer one tak eon it.

Consider 1 John 1:9–“If we confess our sins, He [God] is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”

Verses like that can be seen by a Protestant as justification that all a person needs to do is confess in prayer DIRECTLY to God and he’ll obtain forgiveness from Him, without having to bring a priest into the equation.

I do not want to be too picky, but the verse does not say anything about confessing sins to God. If you add to this verse what Jesus told His desciples to forgive sins, it, at least for me, makes sense that there must be someone in between to have a valid and good confession.