Confirmation - What Exactly Does it Mean??

[davidv]

My main question at this point is, since I am confirmed, do I have a choice in whether I attend mass or not? I am under eighteen. I am not asking permission to disobey my mother. I am asking what the Church’s view is.

The Church’s “view” is that you are to obey to your parents until your are an adult. To disobey is a sin which comes with consequences.

Does the Church say that I need to continue to attend mass to please my parents even thought I do not share their beliefs? Or does the Church say that I am old enough to decide for myself?

At your age the Church considers that you have reached the age of reason and therefore are accountable for your decisions and actions.

Obeying your parents is meant to please God. This is why the Church instructs you to obey them. You can still decide not to, but you won’t get the Church’s approval to do so.

And although your concern that I teach a CCD class is not dismissible, trust me when I say that I know what I’m teaching when it comes to CCD, and I would never, ever, in a million years teach children that are not my own anything but what their parents intended them to learn when they go into a CCD class. I teach them what they are supposed to learn. Please do not fear for any Catholic children. They do not know my beliefs and I am not going to share my beliefs with them.

If you don’t walk the talk, they will know. They are smarter and more observant than you are giving them credit for. “Actions speak louder than words.”

 

[DCNBILL]

An objective truth is one that is entirely independent of human thoughts and feelings. One that remains true anywhere and everywhere in the universe. No matter where you go, 2 plus 2 will always equal four. You cannot prove to me that your god is not simply the imagination of desert wanderers that has lived on to this day. What makes your case for your god being the single objective truth in the universe, rather than the god of the Muslims, or the god of the Ancient Egyptians, so much more adequate? Absolutely nothing. Since you cannot prove that a god exists, let alone said god being the Christian god, your god remains a matter of subjective truth.

I fail to understand how one can have anything conceptual independant of human thoughts if there is no higher creative being. Truth, as you point out is universal, it is also necessary and eternal. A person is none of these things, so how can we possibly know truth with the exception of participating in the “life” of a creating being?

Peace to all,

Bill

 

[quickquestion]

At your age the Church considers that you have reached the age of reason and therefore are accountable for your decisions and actions.

Obeying your parents is meant to please God. This is why the Church instructs you to obey them. You can still decide not to, but you won’t get the Church’s approval to do so.

If you don’t walk the talk, they will know. They are smarter and more observant than you are giving them credit for. “Actions speak louder than words.”

Alright that somewhat helped I suppose.

In regard to the CCD kids, think about it. How often do I see them? Once a week and I can’t always make it due to other conflicts so three times a month if I’m lucky, sometimes two. I’m with them for an hour and a half.

When I’m there, I pretend to pray. They cannot see any outward difference and neither could anyone else walking by the room and watching this. The only difference is that I know that I am not praying, but rather am just guiding these children closer to their beliefs (even if it pains me to do so).

I don’t walk around saying things like, “Jesus Christ is the only way to salvation and he loves you.” I simply won’t do that. But then again, I also don’t walk around saying “You know, you should listen to your heart and decide for yourself what you really believe, regardless of what others think of you” (even though I personally think every child should be given this opportunity). Mainly, I read from a textbook and walk around the class making sure everyone is behaving.

I don’t set a bad example and I don’t set a holy example either. And I’m not indifferent in the classroom, either. I teach in the classroom just like I remember it being when I was their age.

 

[quickquestion]

I fail to understand how one can have anything conceptual independant of human thoughts if there is no higher creative being. Truth, as you point out is universal, it is also necessary and eternal. A person is none of these things, so how can we possibly know truth with the exception of participating in the “life” of a creating being?

I don’t quite understand your question. Perhaps I am reading it incorrectly or it is awkwardly worded? A person is none of what things?

I don’t know how you came to the conclusion that truth is necessary and eternal. Perhaps you could elaborate on this?

 

[DCNBILL]

I don’t quite understand your question. Perhaps I am reading it incorrectly or it is awkwardly worded? A person is none of what things?

I don’t know how you came to the conclusion that truth is necessary and eternal. Perhaps you could elaborate on this?

You said it yourself a truth is always a truth where ever and when ever thus eternal and universal. A truth is necessary because it has to be 2 + 2 has to equal 4 there is no other answer so it is necessary.

Now how can a human mind grasp something that is necessary, universal and eternal when a human has none of these traits?

Furthermore if truth is actually a concept that is outside of the human mind (which I very much agree with), then whos mind is this concept in?

Peace,

Bill

 

[teachccd]

You cannot claim that your god is objective truth. This is entirely based upon belief. While you believe it to be fact, it is not. And I am not claiming that it is a fact that there is no god. No one knows.

An objective truth is one that is entirely independent of human thoughts and feelings. One that remains true anywhere and everywhere in the universe. No matter where you go, 2 plus 2 will always equal four. You cannot prove to me that your god is not simply the imagination of desert wanderers that has lived on to this day. What makes your case for your god being the single objective truth in the universe, rather than the god of the Muslims, or the god of the Ancient Egyptians, so much more adequate? Absolutely nothing. Since you cannot prove that a god exists, let alone said god being the Christian god, your god remains a matter of subjective truth.

I have heard this argument that love is objective. It is not. Do I believe love is entirely universal? I cannot make that call. I am not an omniscient being. But by definition, an objective truth must be independent of human thoughts and feelings. Since love is a feeling, it cannot go in this category and ergo I must decide until further proof is brought forth that love is a subjective truth.

In addition, I understand that relativism has many negative connotations within the Catholic Church. But it isn’t necessarily a bad thing. For example, I would completely and entirely agree with you that killing another human being is wrong. But, given a certain situation (by definition, something subjective), such as having to kill someone in order to save your family, killing another human being in this situation, I would say, is entirely all right. And I know for a fact that the Church teaches that murder in self defense is acceptable. Is this not relativism? It most certainly is.

Relatively speaking your post has no more substance than anyone’s opinion about anything. Relativism is self refuting since nothing that I can say is absolutely true. So why would I waste my time giving anyone my opinion when it really means nothing to anyone except myself and those who may want to agree? What a waste of time this whole world is without objective truth. My truth, your truth, whose truth?

About proving to you that God exists. Well that’s like asking me to prove to a blind man that I’m wearing a blue shirt. But guess what? A blind man can know with certainty that I am if he uses the other senses that can tell him so. You won’t get this but relatively speaking there are some who will…

Your intention for being here was not for an answer to a Confirmation question but to promote your theories. If this were not so you would have left after the first post that would have questioned your beliefs. You never mentioned my gravity analogy which says alot but then again your opinion is only relative so it remains “your” truth and not a whole lot to anyone else… And, by the way, that’s not what I believe… I will continue to pray for you and all who come here to tell us how much they " don’t want to believe in God"…teachccd

 

[quickquestion]

Relatively speaking your post has no more substance than anyone’s opinion about anything. Relativism is self refuting since nothing that I can say is absolutely true. So why would I waste my time giving anyone my opinion when it really means nothing to anyone except myself and those who may want to agree? What a waste of time this whole world is without objective truth. My truth, your truth, whose truth?

About proving to you that God exists. Well that’s like asking me to prove to a blind man that I’m wearing a blue shirt. But guess what? A blind man can know with certainty that I am if he uses the other senses that can tell him so. You won’t get this but relatively speaking there are some who will…

Your intention for being here was not for an answer to a Confirmation question but to promote your theories. If this were not so you would have left after the first post that would have questioned your beliefs. You never mentioned my gravity analogy which says alot but then again your opinion is only relative so it remains “your” truth and not a whole lot to anyone else… And, by the way, that’s not what I believe… I will continue to pray for you and all who come here to tell us how much they " don’t want to believe in God"…teachccd

Thank you for so kindly using ad hominem.

My intent and reason for coming on to this forum was to simply find an answer to my question. I wouldn’t still be on here if this question was answered sufficiently enough (and some posters here have given very nice thoughts to the subject, and to them I say, thank you).

Think about your assertion. Why would I come on a Catholic forum to simply “promote my theories”. I do promote my theories, but not in a place such as this, where my intentions do not involve turning away people from their beliefs. People presented arguments to why I could be wrong, and therefore I presented arguments to why they could be wrong.

The reason I didn’t comment on your gravity analogy is because I found little merit in the argument. I wasn’t going to waste my time with it. Sorry if you feel neglected by this overlook…

Since you feel I should have left after the first post that question my beliefs, perhaps I should leave. I’m sorry I was mistaken and thought we were having a rational debate. I’m not the one who questioned your beliefs originally. It was certainly the other way around.

Think about it. If someone questions your beliefs, you’ll be sure to explain your beliefs more properly to said person. That is what happened here, and the whole conversation got outrageously side tracked.

I can see I’m not getting an answer here, so I suppose I’ll talk to a priest or a deacon.

Thank you to all those who tried their best to answer my question with sincerity. I truly appreciate your (name removed by moderator)ut.

 

[christianlove]

I don’t walk around saying things like, “Jesus Christ is the only way to salvation and he loves you.” I simply won’t do that. But then again, I also don’t walk around saying “You know, you should listen to your heart and decide for yourself what you really believe, regardless of what others think of you” (even though I personally think every child should be given this opportunity). Mainly, I read from a textbook and walk around the class making sure everyone is behaving.

I don’t set a bad example and I don’t set a holy example either. And I’m not indifferent in the classroom, either. I teach in the classroom just like I remember it being when I was their age.

Great, you have this really messed up! I teach too, and the only thing I truly rely on to make sure I am doing a good job is the guidence of the Holy Spirit. You SHOULD be telling them that JESUS loves them and and is the only way to salvation. DANG! that is what we teach, that is the truth, the way, and the life for young Catholics, and exactly why you should NOT! be teaching it!

Also, I would encourage someone (not you) to tell them to follow their heart, because there is where God lives…We are all asked to listen to the feelings inside of us that guide us back to communion with God. That is what you missed out on in confirmation, that acceptance of the Holy Spirit to guide your life. You are scared to let go. You have not learned that love is not weak, instead it is the strongest thing in our lives. Your heart is off on a hiatus right now, hopefully with our prayers and the Lord’s persitance in undying love for you, you will come back to know who He really is and so who you really are. Reading from a textbook is not how you teach children to know God, telling them to follow the love inside of them, that is God, no wonder you dont understand this, you can’t describe the love inside you and you certainly have not recognized that it is the Holy presence of God.

You dont set a bad example? You are a religion teach, you should set a Holy one…you don’t get it though, do you? Stop teaching, you are an athesit…I dont care how objective you think you are, you actions are scandelizing and condemning. Please, stop! How are you not indifferent, you do not have the passion and the love for God that is really needed to set the right example for these children. That is indifferent.

You are teaching them just like you remeber being taught, and look how you have turned out, you think that is a good thing? I guess you do, but not if you are teaching young catholics. Shame on you…shame. Go be objective somewhere else!

I love you quick, I love all people. Our souls are so dear and priceless to God; however, your ACTIONS are beyond remand! Get out of that classroom and search for your answers where ever you like. You are hurting those children’s chance at a very lovely experience where they can learn how faith moves mountains, hope endures forever, and love conquers all!

Love and peace to all the children of God,
and my prayers for you Quick that you hear the truth in these words and follow the will of God.

Christian Love.

 

[MaeganFlinchum]

Confirmation does not make you more or less Catholic, it is the sacrement where you recieve the 7 gifts of the Holy Spirit. Also I understand that you probably did give a lot of thought into this decision. But I urge you please try again. Maybe you should re-evaluate why it is you don’t believe. I find it hard to believe that someone would join a website called Catholic answers forum if you don’t believe. I will pray for you that you see the Truth and realize the Love that God has for you. And remember, it’s never too late to come back to the Church. And I don’t mean any disrespect. Just remember the Cross that He died on for you. Message me with any questions you may ever have.

 

[exoflare]

Confirmation does not make you more or less Catholic, it is the sacrement where you recieve the 7 gifts of the Holy Spirit. Also I understand that you probably did give a lot of thought into this decision. But I urge you please try again. Maybe you should re-evaluate why it is you don’t believe. I find it hard to believe that someone would join a website called Catholic answers forum if you don’t believe. I will pray for you that you see the Truth and realize the Love that God has for you. And remember, it’s never too late to come back to the Church. And I don’t mean any disrespect. Just remember the Cross that He died on for you. Message me with any questions you may ever have.

The OP hasn’t been here in over 2 years. Why would you even bump this old thread?