Confused? Why is this verse missing?

RosaryGirl_777 · Dec 29, 2008

Why is Sirach 24:24 missing from my RSV-CE? Its only under the footnotes?I looked for it in my NAB but its a totally different verse in it. I tried looking in the D-R online but its chapters are in a different order.

May be you guys know what happened to this verse here is what it says in the footnotes.“other authorities add 24. Do not cease to be strong in the Lord, cleave to him so that he may strengthen you; the Lord Almighty alone is God, and besides him there is no savior” I’m new to the book of Sirach but I really like this verse & I don’t understand why its not there. I don’t understand why there are verses missing.

I also don’t understand why the other two Bibles seem to have there verses numbered differently for the book of Sirach? All three Bibles have a different order for the verses in Chapter 24 of Sirach.

Derwin_James · Dec 29, 2008

Normally, what must be considered is the presence of a verse/chapter consistently in all sources. It seems that the ancient sources may omit that verse in a few cases, for whatever reason, enough to put it into question.

Gottle_of_Geer · Dec 29, 2008

RosaryGirl_777 said:
Why is Sirach 24:24 missing from my RSV-CE? Its only under the footnotes?I looked for it in my NAB but its a totally different verse in it. I tried looking in the D-R online but its chapters are in a different order. May be you guys know what happened to this verse here is what it says in the footnotes.“other authorities add 24. Do not cease to be strong in the Lord, cleave to him so that he may strengthen you; the Lord Almighty alone is God, and besides him there is no savior” I’m new to the book of Sirach but I really like this verse & I don’t understand why its not there. I don’t understand why there are verses missing. I also don’t understand why the other two Bibles seem to have there verses numbered differently for the book of Sirach? All three Bibles have a different order for the verses in Chapter 24 of Sirach.

The book exists in Greek & in Hebrew - the Vulgate Latin, & versions derived from it, depend upon a different text from that in the RSV-CE.

**That’s the short answer. Variations of this sort are entirely usual in manuscripts of all sorts. Hope that helps

**

tobinatorstark · Dec 29, 2008

I much prefer the Latin Vulgate(Clementine) and the Douay-Rheims over the NAB and RSV-CE version of the Ecclesasticus any day. It is hard to comparative analysis between them and harder to follow along.

bpcatholic · Dec 29, 2008

I remember reading something in the NIV and a verse was in the footnote. I don’t know why they do this.

Light_Seeker · Dec 30, 2008

Appendix in my RSV-CE has a hint… It was originally written in Hebrew, & translated into Greek 50 years later. St Jerome had both Greek & Hebrew texts. The Church accepted the Greek text and translated that into Old Latin. The Greek text Jerome used had more quantity than the text the RSV is translated from.

RosaryGirl_777 · Dec 30, 2008

Light_Seeker said:
Appendix in my RSV-CE has a hint… It was originally written in Hebrew, & translated into Greek 50 years later. St Jerome had both Greek & Hebrew texts. The Church accepted the Greek text and translated that into Old Latin. The Greek text Jerome used had more quantity than the text the RSV is translated from.

So this verse is in the Latin Vulgate Bible Is it in the Douay-Rheims too?

tobinatorstark · Dec 30, 2008

I believe so. From what I have seen it looks like some of the verses earlier in the Chapter of the RSV-CE occur later in the Chapter in the Douay-Rheims. Here is the link to the Douay-Rheims www.drbo.org and here is a link to the Latin Vulgate (Clementine Edition)
vulsearch.sourceforge.net/html/index.html and finally a link to the RSV-CE
geocities.com/sacra_scriptura/eng_bible_index.html

RosaryGirl_777 · Dec 30, 2008

tobinatorstark said:
I believe so. From what I have seen it looks like some of the verses earlier in the Chapter of the RSV-CE occur later in the Chapter in the Douay-Rheims. Here is the link to the Douay-Rheims www.drbo.org and here is a link to the Latin Vulgate (Clementine Edition)
vulsearch.sourceforge.net/html/index.html and finally a link to the RSV-CE
geocities.com/sacra_scriptura/eng_bible_index.html

Thanks

tobinatorstark · Dec 30, 2008

Oh by the way one might want to check the Vatican’s site and see what the Nova Vulgata has, it too may be different from the Clementine Vulgate and the Douay-Rheims

RosaryGirl_777 · Dec 30, 2008

tobinatorstark said:
Oh by the way one might want to check the Vatican’s site and see what the Nova Vulgata has, it too may be different from the Clementine Vulgate and the Douay-Rheims

I don’t know that much Latin . I only know a few prayers in Latin.
I wish I could read the Bible in Latin that would be cool.

Light_Seeker · Dec 30, 2008

Lets see if I understand:
…Hebrew to Greek to Vulgate to Douay (Church approved all translations)
…Hebrew to Greek(2nd source) to RSV to RSV-CE (Church approved only RSV-CE translation)

Tobinatorstark, I’ve read on other threads your aversion to the RSV-CE.

This book is a fine example. I’m beginning to see your point!

tobinatorstark · Dec 30, 2008

Light_Seeker said:
Lets see if I understand:
…Hebrew to Greek to Vulgate to Douay (Church approved all translations)
…Hebrew to Greek(2nd source) to RSV to RSV-CE (Church approved only RSV-CE translation)

Tobinatorstark, I’ve read on other threads your aversion to the RSV-CE.

This book is a fine example. I’m beginning to see your point!

Thank you!!! I try not to be judgemental to a Bible version but the RSV-CE has disappointed me in many ways. However if one feels that he/she should read it, go ahead. Five years ago if you asked me what version of the Bible I read, I would have said that I don’t read the Bible very often. I didn’t even know what versions were out there other than the KJV. I can only speak for myself, but doing the research I have I try to stick what the mass operates under other than the scripture readings. If you consider the Gloria, Nicene Creed, the Rosary, Hail Mary and Our Father they follow the words set up in the Douay rather the NAB or RSV-CE. But there is so much to consider into what would be the best translation for me to read.

Light_Seeker · Dec 30, 2008

tobinatorstark said:
Five years ago if you asked me what version of the Bible I read, I would have said that I don’t read the Bible very often. I didn’t even know what versions were out there other than the KJV.

Ditto!
I have an old KJV, but most of my reading is an RSVCE, I find the prose much more elegant than NAB. But lately I’ve been referencing DR online quite often …

… and am itching to get the 1859 Haydock’s DR! I love the commentery from the Doctors & Saints!

RosaryGirl_777 · Dec 31, 2008

tobinatorstark said:
Thank you!!! I try not to be judgemental to a Bible version but the RSV-CE has disappointed me in many ways. However if one feels that he/she should read it, go ahead. Five years ago if you asked me what version of the Bible I read, I would have said that I don’t read the Bible very often. I didn’t even know what versions were out there other than the KJV. I can only speak for myself, but doing the research I have I try to stick what the mass operates under other than the scripture readings. If you consider the Gloria, Nicene Creed, the Rosary, Hail Mary and Our Father they follow the words set up in the Douay rather the NAB or RSV-CE. But there is so much to consider into what would be the best translation for me to read.

I wanted to see how the D-R transitioned the Our Father.(I’m just weird I like to see how different transitions word things

) There’s one term that I’m unfamiliar with “supersubstantial bread”. What is supersubstantial bread?

Here the whole Lord prayer Matt 6
9 Thus therefore shall you pray: Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. 10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our supersubstantial bread. 12 And forgive us our debts, as we also forgive our debtors. 13 And lead us not into temptation. But deliver us from evil. Amen. 14

Guys I think I found a D-R Bible word search. Here’s the information on the version they have is it the same D-R biblegateway.com/versions/index.php?action=getVersionInfo&vid=63&lang=2

tobinatorstark · Dec 31, 2008

RosaryGirl_777 said:
I wanted to see how the D-R transitioned the Our Father.(I’m just weird I like to see how different transitions word things ) There’s one term that I’m unfamiliar with “supersubstantial bread”. What is supersubstantial bread? Here the whole Lord prayer Matt 6
9 Thus therefore shall you pray: Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. 10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our supersubstantial bread. 12 And forgive us our debts, as we also forgive our debtors. 13 And lead us not into temptation. But deliver us from evil. Amen. 14

Guys I think I found a D-R Bible word search. Here’s the information on the version they have is it the same D-R biblegateway.com/versions/index.php?action=getVersionInfo&vid=63&lang=2

the supersubstantial bread is our daily bread, the body of Christ. I believe Bible Gateway has the same version we use. 99.99% of all text of the Douay on the Internet is the Challoner text. I have only seen the Haydock Commentary in location

RosaryGirl_777 · Dec 31, 2008

tobinatorstark said:
the supersubstantial bread is our daily bread, the body of Christ. I believe Bible Gateway has the same version we use. 99.99% of all text of the Douay on the Internet is the Challoner text. I have only seen the Haydock Commentary in location

Thanks:thumbsup:

Confused? Why is this verse missing?

RosaryGirl_777

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Derwin_James

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Gottle_of_Geer

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The book exists in Greek & in Hebrew - the Vulgate Latin, & versions derived from it, depend upon a different text from that in the RSV-CE.

tobinatorstark

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bpcatholic

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Light_Seeker

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RosaryGirl_777

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tobinatorstark

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RosaryGirl_777

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tobinatorstark

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RosaryGirl_777

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Light_Seeker

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tobinatorstark

Guest

Light_Seeker

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RosaryGirl_777

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tobinatorstark

Guest

RosaryGirl_777

Guest

Confused? Why is this verse missing?

RosaryGirl_777

Guest

Derwin_James

Guest

Gottle_of_Geer

Guest

**The book exists in Greek & in Hebrew - the Vulgate Latin, & versions derived from it, depend upon a different text from that in the RSV-CE. **​

tobinatorstark

Guest

bpcatholic

Guest

Light_Seeker

Guest

RosaryGirl_777

Guest

tobinatorstark

Guest

RosaryGirl_777

Guest

tobinatorstark

Guest

RosaryGirl_777

Guest

Light_Seeker

Guest

tobinatorstark

Guest

Light_Seeker

Guest

RosaryGirl_777

Guest

tobinatorstark

Guest

RosaryGirl_777

Guest

The book exists in Greek & in Hebrew - the Vulgate Latin, & versions derived from it, depend upon a different text from that in the RSV-CE.